Talk:COVID-19 lockdowns in Italy

8 march expansion

Hi, I'm Italian. I would inform you that the new ban not only restricting travel from or to the affected areas, but even in the affected areas.

From Dpcm Art. 1 a) (https://www.gazzettaufficiale.it/eli/id/2020/03/08/20A01522/sg) evitare ogni spostamento delle persone fisiche in entrata e in uscita dai territori di cui al presente articolo, nonché all'interno dei medesimi territori, salvo che per gli spostamenti da comprovate esigenze lavorative o situazioni di necessità ovvero spostamenti per motivi di salute Bye Thanks --62.18.254.59 (talk) 20:42, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks - changed to "from, to and within", but details of implementation would have to wait a bit I imagine. Juxlos (talk) 21:13, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Current statistics

According to the BBC and the AP, on March 8 Italy reported 7,375 confirmed cases and 366 deaths. The existing article only says over 5,800 cases sand 233 deaths "at the time of the decree."
In order to be timely, and not leave readers wondering how many people the virus has affected in Italy, the current figures should be included in the article – in the lead – and updated as appropriate. The statistics cited for "at the time of the decree" could remain where they are relevant, a third of the way down in this (2,000+ -word) article, in the section titled "Expansion." – Sca (talk) 15:04, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

That information is available in the italian outbreak article, but this article isn't the one that gets updated daily. Juxlos (talk) 16:12, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

Quarantine

Hi all. Everything is moving really fast so there might be a lot of confusion. My question to the community is: is it correct to call this a "quarantine"? When you look at the actual measures there is no complete ban on movement, one can actually move around under certain (not extremely strict) circumstances, given that one hands in a self-certification report to the police. Airports and stations are still open. --Ritchie92 (talk) 22:42, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

I decided to use "lockdown" because news outlets seem to like "lockdown" - #italylockdown is also trending on Twitter. Juxlos (talk) 00:55, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

@Juxlos: Alright for the title but the first sentence of this article refers to a "national quarantine", which I am not sure is the correct definition. But let's refer to what sources say. --Ritchie92 (talk) 08:46, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

I would like to point out that the national lockdown started March 10, not 8, not 9. At March 8, a part of the northern Italy was announced as lockdown. Full Lombardy, part of Piedmont, part of Veneto, part of Emilia Romagna, Pesaro e Urbino province. March 9 this lockdown was effective. 9 March at the evening was announced that the whole country would be in lockdown. March 10 the national lockdown was effective. Some other small zones of Italy like Medicina municipality (since March 16 until April 3) received a further restriction measure: no one without authorization was allowed to get in or out, with Police or army guarding the entrance streets. The lockdown was enhanced March 23, where no one, without any accepted motive, was allowed to change municipality (that was not explicitly forbidden since March 10). Yes, writing from Italy :)

Effect on the Vatican and San Marino

Do we have any information about how the lockdown has affected Vatican City and San Marino? Stelercus (talk) 23:34, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

@Stelercus: The relevant articles for the virus's impact on the Vatican and San Marino (respectively) is 2020 coronavirus outbreak in Vatican City and 2020 coronavirus outbreak in San Marino. OhKayeSierra (talk) 00:50, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

The lockdown is certainly making Vatican empty like the rest of Rome - added the stuff available. I haven't been able to find any news outlets covering Sammarinese affairs, though. Juxlos (talk) 02:57, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Venice Film Festival

I have a QUESTION: how about the 77th Venice International Film Festival which will be held if the outbreak continues? St3095 ^(?) 11:38, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Methods / regulations

Would it be possible to expand with a section clearly detailing the precise methods of implementation of the nationwide quarantine/lockdown? When I first read about it, I assumed the borders were also sealed, but it seems that has not been the case except with Austria. I assumed people would not be able to travel for non-emergency work, but apparently that is not the case. I assumed restaurants would be closed, but that is not the case. The news media is not doing a particularly good job of reporting the specifics, from what I can see. I see that some of the methods appear in the infobox, but I think they deserve their own section. Thanks. - 129.242.80.103 (talk) 12:06, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

WikiProject COVID-19

I've created WikiProject COVID-19 as a temporary or permanent WikiProject and invite editors to use this space for discussing ways to improve coverage of the ongoing 2019–20 coronavirus pandemic. Please bring your ideas to the project/talk page. Stay safe, --Another Believer _(Talk) 18:00, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

This article's listing at "In the news"

Now that many other countries (Spain, France, the Netherlands, Israel, etc.) are going on lockdown as well, let me ask this: is it necessary to list Italy as the sole example of a lockdown in response to the coronavirus in "In The News" anymore? I believe we should either list some of the other countries to establish balance, reword the blurb to something along the lines of "Italy becomes the first country to go under lockdown", or even remove all mention of the Italy lockdown from "In The News" altogether. It just doesn't seem fair that Italy is the only country mentioned here, but I guess that's a natural consequence of the situation being a current pandemic. What do you think? Victionarier (talk) 14:36, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

This has to be discussed on this page, not here. --Ritchie92 (talk) 15:24, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Too little, too late .. Italy is an example of how NOT to do a lockdown

This wiki article does not properly explain the chain of events, how slow the country was to create a lockdown over all of Italy.

NEW YORK TIMES: https://bdnews24.com/world/europe/2020/03/22/italy-pandemics-new-epicentre-has-lessons-for-the-world

As Italy’s coronavirus infections ticked above 400 cases and deaths hit the double digits, the leader of the governing Democratic Party posted a picture of himself clinking glasses for “an aperitivo in Milan,” urging people “not to change our habits.” That was on Feb 27. Not 10 days later, as the toll hit 5,883 infections and 233 dead, the party boss, Nicola Zingaretti, posted a new video, this time informing Italy that he, too, had the virus.

Also in late February: In Milan, only miles from the centre of the outbreak, the mayor, Beppe Sala, publicised a “Milan Doesn’t Stop” campaign, and the Duomo, the city’s landmark cathedral that is a draw for tourists, reopened. People went out.

March 8: broader restrictions in Lombardy also effectively lifted the quarantine on Codogno and other “red zone” towns linked to the original outbreak. Checkpoints disappeared. Local mayors complained that their sacrifices had been wasted.

A day later, on March 9, when the positive cases reached 9,172 and the death toll climbed to 463, Conte toughened the restrictions and extended them nationally. by then, some experts say, it was already too late.

Now we are running after it,” said Sandra Zampa, undersecretary at the Ministry of Health, who said Italy did the best it could given the information it had. “We closed gradually

Peter K Burian (talk) 12:46, 22 March 2020 (UTC)

From CNN

The lockdown should have been wider and stricter earlier, Palù believes, rather than just focusing on the 11 communities initially placed in the red zone, and it should be tighter now. He says the Italian government lagged at first. It was "lazy in the beginning... too much politics in Italy."

Peter K Burian (talk) 12:56, 22 March 2020 (UTC)

Learn from our mistakes': Italians plead https://www.thelocal.it/20200318/learn-from-our-mistakes-italians-plead-with-people-abroad-to-take-coronavirus-risks-seriously

"While Italy imposed a localised lockdown immediately after its first deaths, people outside of the "red zone" carried on going to bars and discos, eating meals at crowded restaurants, and hugging and kissing each other despite government advice telling them to limit social contact.

As reality hit home, Italians watched in horror as some in other countries shrugged it off as "just a case of the flu" – as some in Italy had done weeks earlier."

Peter K Burian (talk) 12:58, 22 March 2020 (UTC)

Crappy articles, before saying that something did not work at least wait the minimum time for the results to be seen.--212.171.108.198 (talk) 14:59, 23 March 2020 (UTC)

Peter K Burian Some aspects are missing FYI 1) the lockdown of the first municipalities was in fact probably not little nor late, it could have been bigger area but only now we start to understand how data from China were understimated and they were what was used at the time, plus its' also a case of an anomalous super-spreader patient 2) the first strong lockdown in some areas such as part of Veneto and Piedmont was on time (the data of Veneto are quite under control, Piedmont is growing but not so much) and the overall national lockdown few days later was on time for the rest of the country 3) Similarly was the closing of schools few days before the national lockdown 4) All those "hugging" initiatives outside the red zone were from a minority of people, you see one full street in Milan and one beach, but you don't see the other ones that are already empty... here you can see how already before the national lockdown mobility was already dropping except grocery stores and parks. Finally, it has not been ruled out if there is some strange co-factor in the anomalous spike of Lombardy (which actually occurred mostly in few provinces in Lombardy) because it does not appear the same way in similar neighboring areas (Pavia is better than Cremona, but both are close to Lodi, Bergamo was immediately worse than Brescia, it never spread to Milan and so on...)

As a comparison, when you try to look into all aspects, you could say that Spain is a better example on how NOT TO DO a lockdown. Their epidemics data were more distributed among regions and in a strong exponential growth already around March, 8th. Yet they made a lockdown circa one week later. Their death count is, as could be expected, much worse. Now stressing this on the article related to Italy and ignoring what to write in the article related to Spain is a distorted perspective. When the situation in Spain was clear to less expert people, newspapers were already more focused on the situation in their own countries.

If I might add a personal opinion, one of the problem of many countries acting late is IMHO also because of this false perspective. The more Italy was described as acting late, the more people abroad assumed they were on time to act and that is the deal. Think about if more journalists had told in your country that actually Italy did more or less what was expected, you would have probably worried a little bit more, am i right? It was maybe convenient for some stakeholders to give a less nuanced vision of reality to some part of the populations, and some Italians also love to be drama queens... but... maybe not a good strategy on the long run overall. You will decide yourself at the end.

I am in favor of adding this information but it should be kept in the right context, that's it. I am more focused on the technical and scientific aspect in 2020 coronavirus pandemic in Italy so not my priority.--Alexmar983 (talk) 20:46, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

Requested change in the title

Can we change the title to "2020 coronavirus lockdown in Italy"? This is more appropriate and is in line with other similar articles like 2020 coronavirus pandemic in Italy or 2020 coronavirus lockdown in India.

-- Amazingcaptain (talk) 23:52, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

Start a WP:Move request. --Ritchie92 (talk) 11:24, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

@Amazingcaptain: You have a response. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:50, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for pinging @Tenryuu:. I just created one for the first time. Not sure if that's how you do it. cc: @Ritchie92:

Amazingcaptain (talk) 16:30, 22 April 2020 (UTC)

Requested move 7 October 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to COVID-19 lockdowns in Italy to allow for expansion of scope. There's a consensus that the current title is imprecise, but no consensus whether we should expand the scope or fix the title; so this move is more or less a coin toss per WP:NOGOODOPTIONS. No such user (talk) 09:20, 10 November 2021 (UTC)

---

COVID-19 lockdown in Italy → First COVID-19 lockdown in Italy

This article's scope is currently just the first lockdown in February 2020. There have been subsequent lockdowns in Italy (https://www.forbes.com/sites/irenedominioni/2020/11/05/to-counter-second-coronavirus-wave-italy-goes-into-a-localized-lockdown/ and https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56621342), but this article has not been updated. As this is the first nationwide lockdown of the pandemic, the article could remain in its current form and be renamed as this lockdown is a notable historic event in its own right. Welcome thoughts. Arcahaeoindris (talk) 12:45, 7 October 2021 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 20:45, 14 October 2021 (UTC) — Relisting. VR _talk 14:32, 24 October 2021 (UTC)— Relisting. –MJL ‐Talk‐^☖ 17:48, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

• Or COVID-19 lockdowns in Italy to allow for future expansion of scope? —  AjaxSmack  04:25, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support March 2020 COVID-19 lockdown in Italy. Per nom, the title must be changed; I think it's best to keep the article focused on the first lockdown rather than expanding the scope to be on "lockdowns". I think a date is clearer than an ordinal. (Were there lockdowns in Italy later in 2020? Probably, though I don't know for sure. Hence I suggest the detail of "March" be in the title.) User:力 (power~enwiki, π, ν) 02:50, 31 October 2021 (UTC)
• COVID-19 lockdowns in Italy. Unless I'm missing it, the later lockdowns don't appear to have their own articles, suggesting they need to be added to an article somewhere. This seems like the most logical article to add them to. Therefore I support changing this title to include the word "lockdowns", and adding a section with that content. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:53, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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