Talk:Székely Land football team

"Private POV pushing"

Skyhighway,

your argumentation is fallacious, there are not just state vs. private constellations, but as well groups, concerns, organizations and associations, etc. However, you know nothing or could not be able to provide any info about ownership, if even this accociation would have. The source as well does not contain such information that you push ad hoc, anyway without any serious knowledge, as you did the same on other articles.(KIENGIR (talk) 21:31, 28 September 2018 (UTC))

Look at facts, why can't you be objective:

1. It is a company born in Hungary not in ROMANIA, by private people was made to represent a historical region IN ANOTHER COUNTRY.

Well, this is not NATIONAL. DO YOU GET IT NOW???

2. SO, IT IS PRIVATE AND NOT NATIONAL!!

Be objective, you have the sources, just read and comply. Use proper words not "your argumentation is fallacious" this is very bad of you. Skyhighway (talk) 05:20, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

If you claim fact & objectivity,

1. they you should have noticed that you don't have any info who created this association (not company!), on the hand I just explained that in your interpretation what is "not national", it does not necessarily mean it is private.

2. You think you are serious when you excommunicate something without any support or careful investigation? I introduced the sources and they don't support your invented POV and on the contrary, I read it, but it seems you don't. I don't see why I would not use peoper words and what would be "bad of me" just because I demonstrated a fallacious argumentation, since we are interested in a valid and precise content on Wikipedia.(KIENGIR (talk) 11:03, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

You do have the source https://kronika.ro/sport/vilagbajnoksagra-keszul-a-szekelyfoldi-focivalogatott it is written who started it Skyhighway (talk) 12:04, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

At the initiative of Kristóf Wenczel, a sports lawyer in Budapest, the Szeklerland Football Association was admitted to the NF Council in January, which is a non-FIFA member of the football team. The selection of Székely Land is still underway, but two things are certain: on May 31 it will play its first official match against the Himalayas and also a member of this year's World Cup.(Ezt a cikket a Krónikáról másolták: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=ro&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.ro&sl=hu&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://kronika.ro/sport/vilagbajnoksagra-keszul-a-szekelyfoldi-focivalogatott&xid=17259,15700022,15700124,15700149,15700186,15700191,15700201,15700214&usg=ALkJrhgV9rHRRDKaASCe4FUZfOjFvMI8wg) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyhighway (talk • contribs) 12:06, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for reinforcing me that it is not stated that it would be private and there is also not any information on ownership.(KIENGIR (talk) 12:33, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

It's owned by the person who created it, Kristóf Wenczel, a sports lawyer in Budapest, can't you read? Skyhighway (talk) 12:35, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

There is not any information on ownership.(KIENGIR (talk) 12:35, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

From the source: The association was established in Budapest

"The association was established in Budapest, so that nobody has any disadvantages from the administration," he continued, and then introduced Zoltan Jakab, the first federal captain of Székely Land.(Ezt a cikket a Krónikáról másolták: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=ro&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.ro&sl=hu&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://kronika.ro/sport/vilagbajnoksagra-keszul-a-szekelyfoldi-focivalogatott&xid=17259,15700022,15700124,15700149,15700186,15700191,15700201,15700214&usg=ALkJrhgV9rHRRDKaASCe4FUZfOjFvMI8wg) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyhighway (talk • contribs) 12:08, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

So what? Nobody debated where it was established. It has not any connection to the problematic part you push, did you read carefully what is the problem?(KIENGIR (talk) 12:35, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

OK, now you admit that was not made in Romania. So, it's an external, foreign association that has no links to Romania. And is private and not national. Step by step you understand now. Very hard for you to admit it finally. Skyhighway (talk) 12:43, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Again, flawed argumentation. Those people have to "admit" something, who deny something, I never denied where it was made. The fact what is "external", or "foreign" is again based from where we reference it, the same way what some would understand on the word "link" since generally it cannot be stated that it would not have a link to Romania. Again, only you are telling that it is private and not I have a problem with understanding, on the contrary, as well there is not any "admitattance" on my shoulders.(KIENGIR (talk) 12:50, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

Misleading POV edits to show that is 'national' when in fact is not national but private and foreign association

Finally some users here admit the fact that it is about a foreign, private not national football team to refer to another region from another country.

This has to be reflected in the article. Not to mislead. Skyhighway (talk) 12:45, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

"Misleading" is what you do by calling and pushing something private you have no information about.(KIENGIR (talk) 12:51, 29 September 2018 (UTC))

The ownership is irrelevant. The naming convention of international teams (even those that are not widely recognised) is Anyland national football team. Spike 'em (talk) 16:29, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 30 September 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved L293D (☎ • ✎) 00:54, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

---

Székely Land national football team → Székely Land football team – Not really a national team. T*U (talk) 17:20, 30 September 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. — Frayæ (Talk/Spjall) 15:54, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

• Support as nominator.Additional comment from nominator: Regardless of the editwarring from the now indeffed editor, they do have one point: The Székely Land football team is not necessarily a national team. There is no indication in the sources I can read that the team is regarded as a national team, nor that they look upon themselves as a national team. --T*U (talk) 17:20, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment and minor point, do not lose sleep but, in terms of the instructions at WP:RM, Nomination already implies that the nominator supports the name change, and nominators should refrain from repeating this recommendation on a separate bulleted line. Andrewa (talk) 20:05, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

I was not aware of that rule, having seen this type of presentation so many times. Andrewa, thanks for pointing this out. I have stricken the "support" and will remember this for any future cases. --T*U (talk) 10:34, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you! Yes, it happens, and I guess that's because others like you have seen it done and just follow the practice (which is why I commented of course). But it makes it a little more difficult for the closer. As I said don't lose sleep over it, rather see wp:creed#bold. Andrewa (talk) 10:58, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

• Support Székely Land is not a country, so they aren't a national team. Joseph2302 (talk) 18:11, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
• Comment in my comment above, I mention there seeming to be a naming convention for teams of disputed nationality. I had looked at a number of teams issued on Confederation of Independent Football Associations, the majority of which are Anyland national football team. Any discussion should include them too. Spike 'em (talk) 18:56, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

There is not, and cannot be, any naming convention dictating the formula Anyland national football team for the simple reason that not all members of CONIFA look upon themselves as nations, and far from all teams can be described as "of disputed nationality". If you look at the membership criteria, you will see that there are a very wide range of membership types, including linguistic minorities, who will usually not have any wish of being a "national" team. You may also notice that other member teams representing Hungarian minorities in different neighbouring countries, like Délvidék, Felvidék and Kárpátalja, do not have "national" in their titles. --T*U (talk) 19:54, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

That may be the case, but we can't just do this article in isolation. From the list on the page above we'd need to add at least the following, which make no mention of being a de facto / disputed country:

• County of Nice national football team (France)
• Felvidék national football team (Slovakia)
• Occitania national football team (France)
• Padania national football team (Italy)
• Western Armenia national football team (Armenians in Turkey)
• Tamil Eelam national football team (Sri Lankan diaspora)

There are many other link to xxx national team, but redirect to a differently named article (I see that they mostly use {{fb}} to do this) . Others that have national team in the lead but not article title are:

• Raetia football team
• Sápmi football team
• Arameans Suryoye football team Spike 'em (talk) 08:36, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

I've editted these articles to remove "national" from the lead. Spike 'em (talk) 11:57, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

• Comment: Just for the record, the RM was relisted as a result of my edit here. Some arguments are made clearer there than above. --T*U (talk) 16:41, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

---

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.