The article was originally written by a prolific editor, Niemti, before being rewritten entirely last year by myself and HopalongCasualty. JokEobard has copyedited and improved the article a lot further, and it feels like I want to push more, so I am looking for someone who is good at organizing, summarizing, and spotting errors in an overwhelming number of sources. I'm hoping to improve this article, maybe even further, like FA (I am aware this is very tough). The article may need to use different opinions on what's missing and anything that seems unclear to an outside reader. MOS idea came from an FA article Jill Valentine. Many thanks 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 07:30, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, I will not be able to commit to a full review of this article, but I still want to help out where I can. I do remember this character mostly for the red dress, which I do enjoy even though it is silly. My comments are below:
I would start the article with a clear sentence about the game she was introduced in before getting more into the finer points of the production history. I think that would provide a clearer foundation for readers. I would look at how it is done in the Jill Valentine article. I think that starting with the pseudonym part right away could be a bit jarring for readers. Done attempted
I would introduce Leon S. Kennedy with a clearer descriptor rather than just "protagonist", and I would add one for Ethan Winters. These would be helpful for readers who are unfamiliar with the games by providing clearer descriptions of who these people are. Done attempted
I would be mindful of single-word quotes, such as "shady". With that quote in particular, it is unclear who is saying that so make sure that quotes are clearly attributed in the prose to avoid any unnecessary confusion for the reader. Other instances of quotes without direct attribution in the prose are "mysterious masked person" and "conflicting scenarios". I would also be more mindful of quotes in general and look for areas where the information could be paraphrased instead. attempted
I would look through the prose and structure for the "Concept and design" section in general as I think it could flow a little better. I think it comes across a bit choppy in its current form and that would be better ways to tie things to get together to form a more cohesive narrative for readers to follow and get a better understanding of the character. attempted combining them
I would re-examine how scholars and authors are introduced with descriptors. I do not think that it is particularly helpful to put the full title of the book in the prose, as done with Unraveling Resident Evil: Essays on the Complex Universe of the Games and Films and Immersion, Narrative, and Gender Crisis in Survival Horror Video Games. I would also avoid having the college name, such as Université de Montréal, as these positions can change. I find it more helpful to focus the descriptors on the person's area of expertise if known or something simple like "author" or "scholar" if it is not known. Done attempted
For this sentence, (According to the article "Female Representation in Video Games", women have long been included in video games and Ada's outfit and conduct were visually stereotypical.), I'd attribute the name of the authors rather than the article's title. Done attempted
I appreciate that you included scholarly sources here. I have not done any research into this character so this could likely be all the scholarly/academic coverage, but just as a suggestion, I'd make sure to thoroughly look through places like Google Scholar and Google Books so that an exhaustive search is done.
Reception sections are always difficult to write so it may be useful to consult WP:RECEPTION as a resource for this. I think the prose for this section could use some more work prior to a FAC.
It would be helpful to expand on the praise of Ada being the best Asian female video game characters. Added a bit more like Jill's
Were there any positive reviews for Lily Gao's performance or the changes to Ada in the remake? Couldn't find anything somehow other than negative reviews
For the Japanese citations, the titles will need to be translated into English. In the past, I have used the |trans-title= parameter in the citation for this. Done
I would be consistent with whether or not the citations use title case for the titles. I would also make sure to italicize game and film titles in the citation titles per MOS:CONFORMTITLE. I was honestly only made aware of it rather recently, and while it can be a pain, it is important to make sure that citations are formatted consistently and to the best that they can be for readers. Done
I would be consistent with how works/websites are linked. IGN seems to be linked on each instance, but there are several citations, such as ones Siliconera and Bleeding Cool, that are not linked. Done
Apologies for not being able to do a full review, but I hope that these comments are still helpful. Let me know if you have any questions or comments about anything. You could try reaching out to other editors who have worked on fictional characters on the FA level, although that is admittedly a small group. I intend to work on more character articles in the future; they are my favorite part of Wikipedia and are likely the reason why I stayed on this site as an editor for so long. Best of luck with the peer review, and I hope you are having a great week so far. Aoba47 (talk) 16:06, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks for your detailed review. I will try to work as much as I can if its possible before reviewing the entire article and moving to the next step. I am very glad you didn't retired entirely and push through to that Kes' article. Hope you're havong great day also! 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 18:29, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am just glad that I was able to help at all. I am always happy to see more character articles in the FAC space (or at least being considered for a FAC). Thank you for the kind words. I am very proud of my work on the Kes article, and I am glad that I stuck through the process. Aoba47 (talk) 22:06, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
About "I would also make sure to italicize game and film titles in the citation titles per MOS:CONFORMTITLE", I'm surprised that a lot of games or movies title wasn't italicized in Jill Valentine's article (Update: I italicized it by myself now). About the scholar, I'm having hard time to check whats reliable or not sadly; but ill check what I can do. 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 11:29, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was not aware of that aspect of the MOS:CONFORMTITLE while doing the Jill Valentine FAC. It was only something that I was made aware of recently during a FAC review (i.e. in the last year or two I believe). For that reason, I think that it would not be present in most of the FAs that I contributed to. I do not think it is a major issue, but I still wanted to point it out just in case. I can understand the difficulty with judging source reliability. It took me a while to get a better understanding of it myself. Feel free to ask me if you have any questions about it. Just to be clear, you could have already exhausted the scholarly sources on this character. I have not checked myself, but I think that it is always worth double-checking before a FAC. Aoba47 (talk) 18:15, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for addressing my points above. I have made some edits to the article (as shown here) and feel free to revert anything you disagree with or if I have accidentally introduced any errors. Apologies if this is over-stepping on my part. As a quick note, I think the part on the red dress is a bit confusing. The first time it is mentioned in the article is about it being covered up for the remake. The outfit itself should be introduced and discussed with the reader first to give context for it. Aoba47 (talk) 18:43, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tysm, its not actually "over-stepping" since it would be very much worst at FAC if this was actually sent. I'll see what I can do. Again, thank you for the help! 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 20:08, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No worries. I am just glad to help out when and where I can. Apologies for accidentally deleting a citation in my edits and thank you for catching that and putting it back in the article. Aoba47 (talk) 20:15, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No need to apologize, you were the one who actually helped me. While I really doubt that I can pull this through, I'll try to do what I can hehe. About the pseudonym stuff, I attempt to find a book or scholarly source just for that because it feels like thegamer/valnet sources will be recommended to be removed at FAC. Many thanks for the help again. 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 20:23, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Aoba47 I just added three scholar sources, and I believed there's nothing more valuable that I could find. Its Heroic Girls as Figures of Resistance and Futurity in Popular Culture (New), Feminism in Play (which was already sourced), and The Playful Undead and Video Games: Critical Analyses of Zombies and Gameplay (taken from Jill's article). I have no idea where to put it, including the grammar (which I felt a bit awful); I think I have disorganized the reception section now but will see what I can do. What do you think? 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 03:51, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the ping. I would look through other character articles (and video game articles as well) to see how they incorporate scholarly sources and get inspiration that way. No need to feel bad about the grammar. Revision takes time. Apologies again for not being able to help further with this review. I am just taking a small break from reviewing for a bit. Best of luck with it. Hopefully, other editors will help with this peer review. Aoba47 (talk) 12:43, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No need to apologize and thank you for the detailed review; it actually helps! I'll see what I can do at reception and the sfn stuff at sourcing. Take care! 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 12:47, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
After seeing significant issues, I really doubt if I can still pull it through, but I will try whatever I can. Thank you very much for the detailed review! 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 08:24, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Although Ada is often hired by antagonists, she has betrayed her employers for her own agendas and saved protagonist Leon S. Kennedy from dire situations: works of fiction are written about in the present tense. As phrased, this means that she betrayed her employers and saved the protagonist only before the start of the games' plot. Is that correct? No, it happens in the game. Im struggling to reword and it seems kinda fine.
game developer Kazunori Kadoi randomly came up with the name "Ada",: not sure about randomly did X as encyclopaedic language. Simply "came up with" or "proposed" would work -- unless he actually used a random-name generator or something similar? Reworded
resulting in her being the only main character omitted from its cinematics: we said a moment ago that she was a supporting character. removed it
In the 2019 remake of Resident Evil 2, their relationship is more intimate as they kiss earlier in the game: I'd look at this one for prose. The "as" doesn't quite sit right with me: it doesn't follow from the fact that they kiss earlier that their relationship remains more intimate. Reworded
Ada dressed like a femme fatale in a seductive red dress. Her revealing red dress: not sure about the adjectives here. From the picture, it looks like a fairly normal dress? Reworded
Co-director Kazunori Kadoi: was he a co-director in the first paragraph? He's a director; Reworded.
The title screen for "Separate Ways" was inspired by the 1990 film La Femme Nikita, Ada is shown in the same pose as the lead character Nikita in the movie’s poster: punctuation: semicolon or colon after La Femme Nikita, commas around the second Nikita. Done
For the 2023 remake of Resident Evil 4, the developers has replaced Ada's red qipao by a red, woolly jumper to change her shady and sexualized persona, including her red dress to distance her to a Dragon Lady trope, a stereotype of Southeast Asian women: a few copyedit issues here:
Amend replaced, with and from in order.
Was the dress always a qipao? If so, I'd say on first mention.
shady and sexualized persona: we talk about this a bit, but I'm not happy that we've really established it. Are any of the developers, or any reviewers, on record as applying this kind of label? Removed
Likewise on the "Dragon Lady": is this something that developers or commentators brought up? If so, we should quote or reference them.
completing three individual character scenarios: what's an individual character scenario? Reworded
Li had trouble speaking in English: I think we mean trouble speaking English. Reworded
Non-English text should be in the relevant language templates: for the Spanish ("Las Plagas", "Los Illuminados"), you can set |italic=no. I'd also suggest translating the latter. Done
the Far North: the Russian Far North might be clearer. Done
She did not return in the final film: present tense. What's behind the apparently? Removed "apparently"
director Johannes Roberts found it difficult including too many characters in the: this needs another look for prose. I think we mean to say something like Roberts believed that including her would mean that there were too many characters in the film. Reworded
She was chosen as the returning female character from the game series to contrast Claire Redfield's role in the previous installment, Resident Evil: Degeneration (2008).: as written, this implies that only one female character could return, which seems odd. Reworded a bit
Ada is a playable character in several non-canonical Resident Evil games: can we name some? placed "two"
a feudal Japan-inspired design: endash here per MOS:DASH. Done
Ikiteita Onna Spy Ada: Japanese? Use a transliteration template if so. Done
Critics said that she was not oversexualized in her initial appearances, and cited her as an example of the series' female characters who were not judged solely by gender.: see above: I think there's a bigger issue here as to how we handle this matter, but at present this seems to be contradicted by the rest of the paragraph. moved that sentence at 2nd paragraph and removed other that potentially contradicted it.
in the mold of Simone de Beauvoir's existentialist philosophys: philosophy, but I must admit I'm not seeing the connection here. removed
The Guardian staffers praised: I would cut staffers here (it's very American, and the Guardian uses a lot of freelance writers). removed
Platz wrote that Ada possesses attributes "typically associated with males" including strength and intelligence, : I hope she came up with something slightly better than this to argue that the character is genderfluid -- as we have conveyed it, this is incredibly misogynistic. It's hard to reword this stuff but I'm gonna double check it.
director Shinji Mikami's female roles: female characters, I think. Done
the submissive woman-femme fatale character couple: endash, and lang template (throughout) for femme fatale. Done
Authors of the journal also said that women have long been included in video games: this seems a bit trivial, but we've presented it as somehow a matter of opinion or as something contentious. Which journal? Ended up removing it
Professor Bernard Perron: MOS:HONORIFIC: don't give titles like Professor, Dr. etc. Done
Ada, a playable character in Resident Evil 6 is cited by author Simon Bacon as: cut as marked: we've established this. If Bacon specifically mean Ada's portrayal in Resident Evil 6, say as much. I just omitted this book since its not what Simon directly said this kind of stuff, but sourced other books
According to what they mentioned: I don't understand this. According to Bacon? I just omitted this book since its not what Simon directly said this kind of stuff, but sourced other books
Generally speaking, "author" and "authors", used without qualification, means "novelists". I would use something more like "critics", "commentators" or "reviewers" when you mean "people who write about video games". Removed and replaved
the game allows players to embody Ada: as with a comment above, this isn't a matter of opinion, so we shouldn't portray it as such. I just omitted this claim/book since its not what Simon directly said this kind of stuff, but sourced other books
particularly for gamers who identify as female: why not female gamers? Done
feminist media critic Anita Sarkeesian: I do see the point of feminist in this particular context, but it's a little uncomfortable given that we haven't introduced anyone else by their ideology, and we've just handled several explicitly feminist readings of the material. moved
stilted and unnatural—at times completely devoid of emotion"—: cut the second endash. Done
and couldn't help but wonder whether her English-language voice actor: couldn't help but wonder is not good for an encyclopaedia: "speculated as to whether..."? reworded
Sources that cite merchandises about Ada include: don't do this and follow with footnotes. I would simply work out the smallest number of these citations you need to prove the point, and give them as a multi-cite or as a bundle.
I think we could -- and should -- include much more of the Reception section in the lead. attempted
@Boneless Pizza!: Just a random comment, but have you researched DLC reviews of the Resident Evil 4 Remake? There might be comments that contrast old comments involving Ada's sexualized look kinda like how Capcom changed Jill Valentine's skirt. Just a small sentence might be worth mentioning.Tintor2 (talk) 22:11, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I tried, but it seems to me that only a Polygon source is valuable. If you can spot something, feel free to show here. Many thanks 🍕Boneless Pizza!🍕 (🔔) 22:53, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
