Talk:X (Ed Sheeran album)

Background and Recording Section

Most of this section, so far, has been written by me, and for every quote in there I have added a citation, however some citations link to multiple quotes. I do not think it necessary to link to the same citation twice within two sentences, so can other editors please refrain from adding a "Citation needed" tag without checking the citations that are already there. Thank you 87.115.124.173 (talk) 06:31, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

If multiple sentences are supported by the same reference, just move the citation to the end of the last sentence that is supported by that reference. Littlecarmen (talk) 10:56, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

I have done now, thank you for editing the citations so they have titles, I am not totally clued up on how the naming of them works! 87.115.124.173 (talk) 16:47, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

This section has now been split into two. If you disagree with the naming of the second part as "Music and lyrics" then by all means change it, but I feel it fits, as that is what is analyzed. Also, upon the release of the album, Ed will almost certainly upload all of the lyrics, leading to media coverage of them, which will fit perfectly into this section as it is currently titled. On a side note, I am the same user as the unnamed IP address above, just now I have logged in Kielaurie (talk) 11:02, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

Tracklisting/Sample Credit/Writers

As far as I know, there is no proof of the writing or production credits for any of the songs so far. While it is known that Ed wrote "Sing" with Pharrell, and that Pharrell produced the track, the rest of the songs have not been referenced. Having heard the track "Don't", it appears that whoever stated the track uses a sample is correct, but until it is confirmed in an interview, or at the very latest proved in the album liner notes, we simply cannot state that the sample is used. In light of this, if there is no opposition, I shall delete all the unprovable information until a date where it can be proved. However, I shall give ample opportunity for people to make an argument for keeping the information while I search for my own sources to improve the article. 87.115.124.173 (talk) 14:38, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

I agree that the credits should be removed if they can't be referenced. A citation saying that Pharrell and Ed Sheeran wrote "Sing" together and that Pharrell produced the song should also be added to that section. Littlecarmen (talk) 14:46, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

I cannot currently find something specifically saying that the song was written with Pharrell, but plenty of the other references have proved that he produced it, so I will add one of those and add it to the section. I have found proof for collaborations with Benny Blanco and Johnny McDaid, but no specific songs yet, so it looks like those credits will disappear for now 87.115.124.173 (talk) 16:49, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

The Lucy Pearl sample situation appears to be just rumours, and I have provided proof for the Blanco and McDaid collaborations on specific songs now. Unless I manage to find definite evidence of anything else in the next half hour, the remaining un provable material will be gone. 87.115.124.173 (talk) 18:18, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Saying this for a final time, all unsourced material about the tracklisting will be deleted. I have been searching, mostly fruitlessly, for the last hour or so, and can find no PROOF for the writers of the songs "Bloodstream", "Tenerife Sea" or "Afire Love"; the closest is an MTV article that says he wrote "Tenerife Sea" with "a good friend while in Nashville", which is PROBABLY Johnny McDaid but cannot be proven. Unprovable material is not suitable for Wikipedia (see it's guidelines) so I have no choice but to delete it. If you can find a reference for the material, then by all means insert it. If this message has come across as rude, then I can only apologise. Kielaurie (talk) 11:52, 25 May 2014 (UTC)

All of Our Stars on Physical Deluxe Edition of X

https://twitter.com/LittleBirdsUSA/status/474822381257498624 https://twitter.com/edsheeran/status/474823621555519488

I don't know how to add it to the table. 108.227.116.150 (talk) 18:31, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Okay, I DO know how to put it into the table, but I cannot find any record of this on retailers websites. I've pre-ordered the Deluxe Edition of X, but it doesn't include All Of The Stars, and checking on Amazon and other retailers to see if the tracklisting has been updated has proved fruitless. Until then I'm afraid I won't be altering the table. Sorry! But good find, I completely missed that tweet! Kielaurie (talk) 13:55, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Well when I go to his US webstore(or whatever one your country is), go to CD's, and then click the deluxe one, it pops up in the tracklist.--108.227.116.150 (talk) 00:20, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

I have added it, under a new banner to specify that it is only available from his webstore, as I am still unable to find a version with the track on anywhere else. If it proves to be on the standard deluxe edition then I will merge the two tracklists Kielaurie (talk) 16:02, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Article title

Is the article named correctly? A number of the sources refer to 'X' or 'x' instead. Eldumpo (talk) 06:24, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Shouldn't it be spelled as '×' (multiplication symbol) instead of 'x' (the alphabet letter)? 89.164.218.199 (talk) 02:08, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Requested move

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Number 57 19:33, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

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X (Ed Sheeran album) → Multiply (Ed Sheeran album) – This article's name should be moved for title clarity. The album's name is pronounced as "Multiply", not as "Ex"; per MOS:TM, as an encyclopedia, we cannot expect the reader to have to read the article first to understand what the title means ... or how it is pronounced. Steel1943 (talk) 02:05, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

• Support - if this album is "Multiply" then we shouldn't be calling it "X", no matter how cover artwork displays that. User:Steel1943 thanks for spotting this, similar issue at VxV, guess before clicking. In ictu oculi (talk • contribs) 02:55, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose, as WP:Use commonly recognizable names. The title may have the meaning multiply but it is presented as X. This is even apparent when you scan through the search results:

"Ed Sheeran" Multiply gets "About 461,000 results"

"Ed Sheeran" X gets "About 17,900,000 results"

The meaning of the title can be explained in the article. My guess is that the presentation of X was chosen because the multiply sign × is not searchable on, at least, Google. Ed Sheeran's people present the album as X and so should we. Gregkaye ✍♪ 13:28, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Suggest move to identical title but without the:

{{DISPLAYTITLE:Desired Title}} italic formatting

The current use of italics makes the title produce: x (Ed Sheeran album).

The x in all the Sheeran related documentation that I have seen is free of italicisation presumably so as to better represent the multiply sign.

Also, if the admin concerned is in the mood for making moves, a move from Talk:X (Ed Sheeran album) to Talk:x (Ed Sheeran album) would keep things consistent.

Gregkaye ✍♪ 14:13, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

I agree, and removing the italic formating doesn't actually require moving the article. I have already removed it from the title and lead section; someone please change that further in the text. — Mayast (talk) 14:56, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

• Oppose for now. I suggest to take a look at reliable sources for the album, e.g. review articles, as I think "x" is more commonly used by music journalists than "Multiply". However, I think it should be stated in the lead that the correct (or intended) title is "Multiply", as it is currently indicated. — Mayast (talk) 14:56, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose. Reliable sources render it as X [1], [2], [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], etc. Zarcadia (talk) 20:06, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose - how something's spelt (out) and how it's pronounced are two different things. Unreal7 (talk) 00:34, 22 September 2014 (UTC)
• His first album + is on the article Plus (Ed Sheeran album) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hadji87 (talk • contribs) 10:06, 3 October 2014‎ (UTC)
• Very many people do not know the difference between a multiply sign and a lowercase x. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 07:26, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

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Why wasn't this moved to "Multiply"?

Seems inconsistent to have his first album listed as "plus" but this one listed as "x". Especially since "x" isn't the title, but the stylized multiplication sign. It only makes his album more confusing to refer to it as "x". This is Wikipedia, we always do things by the book. Calling his album "x" feels like we're going for what people think it's called, not what it actually is called. I missed the discussion, but it looks like there's more for than againsts, and if I was here for it I'd strongly be in the "for" category. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.185.231.232 (talk) 04:30, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

More to the point, this article is essentially renaming the album "x". But that's not the name of the album. It is ridiculous to let this website have the power to rename an album. We didn't rename "The White Album" from The Beatles. It's also bizarre that his first album we call "Plus" but his second album we call "x". I am not for Wikipedia wielding this much power. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.185.231.232 (talk) 00:36, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Italic or non-italic X

The relatively reliable sources on which Wikipedia relies present a capitalised X. They also present it in a non-italic format but this is similar to most presentations of media titles elsewhere. The Multiplication sign "×" is never italicised as per example text shown. The Wikipedia convention is to italicise titles but I'd propose that this is arguably an exception to the rule. Gregkaye ✍♪ 09:49, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

See also: + (Ed Sheeran album) and content of "Article name" and "Requested move" above. Gregkaye ✍♪ 09:51, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

@Gregkaye: I have reverted the change to a non-italic "x", as – despite the hidden note you left – it was done without consensus (one editor in agreement does not consensus make) and it is a major departure from the standard formatting of album titles per the MoS. Although the title is pronounced "Multiply," it is represented in nearly every source as the letter "x", not the multiplication sign. This needs to be discussed more thoroughly before this formatting is restored. Thanks. Chase (talk | contributions) 01:05, 1 August 2015 (UTC)

x or ×

Why don't we use the "×" instead "x" for the album title? Ed Sheeran call it "multiply" not "X". — Preceding unsigned comment added by FilBenLeafBoy (talk • contribs) 16:18, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

Requested move 27 February 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. – wbm1058 (talk) 02:50, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

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X (Ed Sheeran album) → × (album) – The article for the first album is a plus sign, so to end the dispute between "x" and "X", why don't we just rename it to the multiplication sign? 2601:8C:4001:DCF4:4DB7:8078:579D:9A72 (talk) 20:10, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

• Oppose - In contrast to + (Ed Sheeran album), the character is not available on our keyboards. "X" is easier and commonly used probably by multiple secondary sources. Also, I have to look up to ALT codes to type the whole thing; this creates problems for general readers who want to search for this page. George Ho (talk) 20:49, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose - and speedy close, per WP:NCM. Almost deliberately obstructive to Users. In ictu oculi (talk) 07:05, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
• Strong oppose MOS:TM special characters -- 70.51.46.39 (talk) 08:52, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose per all the above. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 09:44, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose & speedy close per above. //Blaxthos ( t / c ) 01:27, 29 February 2016 (UTC)

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Requested move 7 January 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Consensus appears to be that the common name of the article is the letter X, regardless of how it's actually pronounced. (non-admin closure) JudgeRM (talk to me) 15:34, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

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X (Ed Sheeran album) → × (album) – For consistency with ÷ (album). Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
to reply to me 15:10, 7 January 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose, per WP:COMMONNAME. The title of the album is X. Neel.arunabh (talk) 18:03, 7 January 2017 (UTC)
• Support, I mean, if the album is pronounced "multiply" and the article for "×" is multiplication sign, then it would make sense to make this move. It's not pronounced "X", after all. Aria1561 (talk) 23:07, 7 January 2017 (UTC)
• Support, per Aria1561's points and in the light of Sheeran's upcoming follow-up to this being titled ÷. Mayast (talk) 03:25, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per the last RM (above) and the fact that the page is really named X, no matter the stylization. There are nineteen albums at the X disambiguation page, so picking this one as the primary doesn't work. X marks the spot, literally, because there is no symbol for the multiplication sign on computer keyboards. Randy Kryn 3:39, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
  • "X (Ed Sheeran album)" could just be redirected to "× (album)". Wikipedia has a multiplication symbol, so why not use it when it's necessary, like with this article? The pronunciation is "multiply", so why would the article be called X when we have the × symbol and a redirect ready? Aria1561 (talk) 04:27, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
    • So you're saying that the page would always be a redirect, which makes sense. But would this work without all of the unspecific 'X album' searches being directed there? Randy Kryn 04:36, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
      • I'm confused as to what you're asking. People searching for "X (album)" would find the disambiguation page and the Ed Sheeran album would presumably still be there. Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
        to reply to me 04:39, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
        • Only "X (Ed Sheeran album)" would be redirected there. I would have it under the disambiguation page, but not with the cluster of unspecific X (album) pages. Since the symbol looks like an X, it would be okay for it to be there, just not in that cluster. Aria1561 (talk) 04:46, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
    • @Aria1561: That's already what the requested move proposes… Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
      to reply to me 04:39, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
      • I was responding to Randy's opposing of the move, in case it seemed like something else. Aria1561 (talk) 04:46, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
  • (edit conflict) @Randy Kryn: The other 18 albums are named after either the Roman numeral X, the Greek letter chi, or just the Latin letter. Most computer keyboards (aside from Macs ⌥ Opt+/) don't have "÷" on them either, and if we consider these symbols to be avoided then the three albums should be titled "Plus (Ed Sheeran album)", "Multiply (Ed Sheeran album)" and "Divide (album)". Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
    to reply to me 04:36, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
    • @Jc86035: The Greek letter chi is not the same character the X. But it resembles X. The same goes with the multiplication sign. All titles should be X.Neel.arunabh (talk) 18:18, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
      • @Neel.arunabh: The Greek letter is a currently-used character, so there's nothing in the policy saying they can't be titled that, although I could be wrong because I don't usually edit in this area. Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
        to reply to me 10:09, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per Randy Kryn. It's clearly X, not times. Dicklyon (talk) 04:20, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per all above. In ictu oculi (talk) 09:27, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
• Comment @In ictu oculi, Dicklyon, Neel.arunabh, and Randy Kryn: If the title is "X", then what should + (Ed Sheeran album)^{Fixed. 10:25, 9 January 2017 (UTC)} and ÷ (album) be titled? I'm open to suggestions, including changing the displayed title to lowercase "x" if that's what it's actually registered as. It just seems odd to use the "wrong" character for one of them while using the correct Unicode character for the others. Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
  to reply to me 10:09, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

  + (Ed Sheeran album) requires the artist name because + is just a stylism, there are other Plus (album)s. The Divide (album) well. In ictu oculi (talk) 10:15, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

  @In ictu oculi: Fixed the link, sorry about that. "+" but "divide" seems weird, given that Wikipedia doesn't have a problem with titling articles with Unicode characters anymore (many en dashes could be replaced easily by hyphens if that were the case…) and the guideline specifically advises against using symbols, which "+" would qualify as. Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
  to reply to me 10:30, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. TheKaphox T 17:25, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per everyone above as well as per COMMONNAME, I wonder what Ed's next album is going to be called ? ". (album" or "+-x÷+-x÷ (album" perhaps?. So creative. –Davey2010^Talk 03:50, 10 January 2017 (UTC)
• Support - it's called "multiply", not "ex". Unreal7 (talk) 21:52, 10 January 2017 (UTC)
• Support using the correct glyph, but do not change disambiguation. The proper × glyph is required per WP:MOS. However, this is not distinct enough (the characters are very hard to tell apart in many fonts, and many readers do not even know there's a difference) for WP:SMALLDETAILS to possibly apply. WP:COMMONNAME does not apply here, either; it is not a style policy, but the policy that, based on sources, tells us whether the title is × (in one glyph or another) versus something else entirely like Ecks, Multiply, or I Ate Your Cat. Why do so many people not understand this after over a decade and a half of these discussions? PS: Outside of academic publishing, many writers do not know there's a difference either, so material written to the news style standards of journalistic style guides could not tell us anything about what symbol is actually intended anyway. We know for a fact that it's the multiplication symbol not the alphabetic letter, since the spoken name of the album is Multiply not Ecks. This suggests a WP:NOR problem of trying to "prove" it's not really the multiplication symbol.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  03:46, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

  This seems to be a good consensus solution (in the 'everyone would be okay with it' definition of consensus). Randy Kryn 03:50, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

  No objection to titling it "× (Ed Sheeran album)". Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
  to reply to me 04:00, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

  What is the evidence that the multiply glyph is the proper title? If that's what they intended, why the obvious letter X on the album cover? Dicklyon (talk) 17:12, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

  Maybe this. And check out the EEng-like "Department of Unintended Consequences" on the first line of the {{Ed Sheeran}} template. It looks like he has two albums named "period". I'm imagining dozens of his fans trying to click on them. Randy Kryn 17:26, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose per all of the above.74.105.204.67 (talk) 14:31, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. The album title is most commonly rendered in sources as the letter x. Chase (talk | contributions) 20:36, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose per all of the above.--Jennica✿ / ^talk 21:19, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

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Title

Is the album's title registered as "X" or "x"? Spotify, Apple's iTunes Store and Google Play list the album as x, whereas some Amazon listings and others list the album as "X" (although this could have been influenced by our article's title). Jc86035 (talk) Use {{re|Jc86035}}
to reply to me 15:40, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

×

I know this has been discussed before, but why can't the page be called × (album) with a redirect for X or x? CB19 (talk) 01:23, 9 April 2017 (UTC)

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