Talk:Quds Day

Qods day / joursalim day

Qods day can not be chosen to appose joursalim day as it has been set in 1979 and J day is 1998 ! the whole wording is similarly misleading --Qakhoo (talk) 19:46, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

Iran vs. Germany image RfC

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

There is a consensus that a representative image of Quds Day in Iran, its country of origin, should be used as the lead image for this article. No specific image was agreed upon and this does not preclude photos of events in other countries being used elsewhere in the article. – Joe (talk) 14:46, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

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Should the image in the infobox for Quds Day show a rally in Iran or in Germany? OtterAM (talk) 19:50, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

It should show a rally, and the image you put in was a poor representation of the article topic. Whether it should be in Germany, or in Iran, or in some other country is immaterial. Of the two images that started this little edit war, the one currently in the article is far better than what you replaced it with. nableezy - 19:56, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

This version was a better image from Iran. [1] There is also an entire Wikimedia Commons library of images from Quds Day in Iran. OtterAM (talk) 23:04, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

show Iran: It's an Iranian "holiday" that some outside Iran "celebrate". The vast majority of reliable sources focus on events in Iran. Thus, a representative image would show Iranians protesting Israel, not German Neturei Karta protesting Israel. OtterAM (talk) 20:18, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

• Show Iran - considering this is an Iranian "holiday", and Iran hosts the larger rallies, Iran should be displayed.Icewhiz (talk) 10:40, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

  In my recent edit I explained why it is an added value to the topic to keep the existing image. True it's a primarily Iranian event but it was also meant as an international day, reason there are protests on the same day across the world however under-reported they remain due to Western media bias. The fact that there are Jews attending this allegedly "anti-Semitic" rally helps towards a more neutral picture. That picture alone in fact debunks a lot of myths surrounding the nature of this event. --Expectant of Light (talk) 09:52, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  The attendance of Neturei Karta is not an indication of much, and presenting them prominently in our article misrepresents the overall participants of the rally.Icewhiz (talk) 09:56, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  I'd agree quantitatively they are not much (or many) but not qualitatively. I mean one of the key justifications for foundation of Modern Israel has been Jewish religious tales and doctrines. Neturei Karta and similar religious groups counter that justification. And btw, Iranian Jews also participate in these rallies. --Expectant of Light (talk) 10:10, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  Off topic, but most of the founding fathers of Israel were devoutly secular, and if at all attempted to build a competing national mythology to the religious strata. Neturei Karta (and to a lesser extent, Haredim as whole) have objected to Israel on religious grounds (preempting the messiah).Icewhiz (talk) 10:17, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

• Show Iran - This rally in Tehran to be precise. Neturei Karta is a small fringe, not representative of the Jewish people (even the anti-Zionist Satmar hasidim rejected them!). Quds Day was founded by the ayatollahs in Iran and most attendees are Iranians. There are too many pictures of Berlin anyway.--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 17:25, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  It is not just in Tehran or Iran but in several European and Muslim countries too. Btw, are you aware of today's London protests? They held their Quds day rally today! And you keep inserting your own favorite photo into the page before consensus! That's not good practice! --Expectant of Light (talk) 19:23, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  You don't seem to WP:get the point, do you? Again, Quds Day was invented IN IRAN. This is a fact. It doesn't mean there aren't rallies in other parts of the world (whose participants are generally Muslim), but the infobox picture has to be representative of the holiday in general, and we have to pick only one. A rally in Iran, where Quds Day was invented and is celebrated every year, seems the obvious choice. It's not so difficult to understand.--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 19:37, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  It was invented in Iran but it is about an international issue and recognized outside Iran, held in several Muslim and non-Muslims countries. You don't get this because of WP:IDONTLIKEIT. Drop your Zionist prejudices for a second! It's not Israel here where you have your opponents either shut up or shot up! --Expectant of Light (talk) 20:38, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  You need to stop talking about other editors, whether or not a user is a Zionist is irrelevant. Comment only on the content of the article. nableezy - 00:56, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

  Says the guy who comes from a country where dissidents are hanged in cranes...--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 21:27, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

  Keep in mind this is an article with discretionary sanctions. If you continue making such comments I will report them. nableezy - 00:55, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

  I don't have time or inclination to engage in a WP:FORUM. So I restate my statement: "It was invented in Iran but it is about an international issue and recognized outside Iran, held in several Muslim and non-Muslims countries." --Expectant of Light (talk) 23:29, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Show Iran where it was invented. Show Iran which is cited in the lede. Berlin is not cited on the lede. Besides, a photo of the celebration in the Middle East is more relevant than any cultural appropriation by others, elsewhere, in an unrelated continent. XavierItzm (talk) 06:29, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

• If we can stop with the drive-by reverts for a change that has no consensus, that would just be terrific. Onus is not selectively applied to when it best suits the situation. The long-standing image works better and demonstrates that this day is more than an Iranian holiday, it is also international.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 14:48, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

  I agree with TheGracefulSlick.Qods Day is not only a national day for Iranians but also an international day Dhamar toronto. So there is no need to use photos that be related to Iran just!Saff V. (talk) 20:31, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

  You must have missed the cited BBC source: «Apart from rallies, usually funded and organized by Iran itself, in various capital cities, the ritual never took root among Muslims at large». Look, any Iranian who _pays_ for activists in a number of cities can make it appear as if it is an "international day," but, per the BBC, it remains an Iranian event.XavierItzm (talk) 01:35, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

• Preferentially Iran. The RFC really should have addressed specific images. That said, there appear to be various good Iran images available and those images appear to most accurately present a generic/typical Quds Day event. It also appears at least some of the support for non-Iranian images is incompatible with Wikipedia policies. (i.e. Activism that the event should be more international than the current reality, attempting to misrepresent/combat "under-reporting" in Reliable Sources, and deliberately selecting fringe participants to misrepresent typical reality.) Alsee (talk) 13:51, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

Other criteria

To me, neither File:Al-Quds_2014_Berlin_20140725_173841.jpg nor File:2016_Quds_International_Day_in_Tehran.jpg look very representative. Without the captions, you would think the images are showing just another one in a long line of anti-Israel demonstrations. A good infobox image would be one where nothing but the image itself is needed to be able to say: hey, this is about Quds Day. I haven't looked through the entire Commons category, but just maybe it contains something like [2]. Bonus: the linked image has a banner written in English. --HyperGaruda (talk) 17:26, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

I think this one (File:روز جهانی قدس در شهر قم- Quds Day In Iran-Qom City 14.jpg) might be better.Icewhiz (talk) 14:18, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Oooh, I'd definitely support that photo! --HyperGaruda (talk) 18:46, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

I don't think we can have it on...few guys standing does not reflect the rally as it should. --Mhhossein ^talk 19:34, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

It is not jam packed with people (though it is more than a few guys standing! You have a crowd in both sides of the street and more people behind, it looks like the photographer (there is a series of these) had people with interesting signs pose mid march or prior/after)... But the composition is good - you have an English/Persian sign. You have signs with images of the Dome of the Rock. You have Iranian flags and pictures of Khamenei and Khomeini. And you see the Qom street and buildings.Icewhiz (talk) 19:46, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

I am OK with this photo.I think its representative--Shrike (talk) 14:15, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

First, I would oppose any image containing readable non-English text unless we get adequate confirmation from experienced&responsible editors of what they actually say. That said, the image at right (Qom_City_14) looks pretty good. I'll add a few other options below. The first image below is aesthetically impressive, but it's probably too much of a microcosm to really use it.

• 
  File:روز_جهانی_قدس_در_شهر_قم- Quds_Day_In_Iran-Qom City_11.jpg
• 
  File:روز_جهانی_قدس_در_شهر_قم- Quds_Day_In_Iran-Qom City_35.jpg
• 
  File:روز_جهانی_قدس_در_شهر_قم- Quds_Day_In_Iran-Qom City_19.jpg

While browsing images I saw quite a few featuring soldiers, bonfires, or missiles. Quds day is clearly not a typical cheery-holiday celebration. I would hesitate to endorse any of them as a lead image, but the group may be significant enough to include one in a subsection for important context.

• 
  File:Missile in Quds Day 2017 in Tehran01.jpg
• 
  File:راهپیمایی روز قدس در تهران - ۶-۱.jpg
• 
  File:راهپیمایی روز قدس در تهران - ۶-۲۸.jpg

Alsee (talk) 15:09, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

Alsee: Non of them is the so-called "representative" of Quds day!!! Hahahahaa --Mhhossein ^talk 07:56, 28 June 2018 (UTC)

@Alsee: - note that Quds_Day_In_Iran-Qom_City_14.jpg (on the right above) as well as Quds_11 (but it's a close up on a few people) - the marchers themselves provide us with a translation (at least their own - there are some grammar / capitalization issues) of what is written on their sign. If we really need to translate the Farsi portion of the sign by ourselves, I believe we have a number of editors able to do so here in this discussion - but I don't think it is required given the marchers have translated it already.Icewhiz (talk) 08:13, 28 June 2018 (UTC)

I agree that "File:روز جهانی قدس در شهر قم- Quds Day In Iran-Qom City 14.jpg" is the most appropriate image for this article.--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 20:23, 28 June 2018 (UTC)

No, Qom City 14.jpg is never a good choice and it's not hard to understand why you support the photo of few guys just standing somewhere, despite so many files uploaded and available. The Berlin photo was really representative, I think.Saff V. (talk) 06:17, 30 June 2018 (UTC)

Indeed! Some users seem to be driven by this motive to fit things into their "fanatic mullahs" prejudice. So any photo or content that highlights the ethical, popular and international aspects of the Quds Day must be repressed! Btw, I am going to restore the Berlin image to the article body and nobody can take an issue with how "representative" it is when it is not in the lead! --Expectant of Light (talk) 14:33, 30 June 2018 (UTC)

Don't you dare to do that. You will be reverted immediately. There's no such consensus. If any, there's a strong consensus to show an Iran image, which is far more representative for Quds Day than a few Neturei Karta in Berlin.--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 02:03, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

Don't dare to say that. Because there's no guideline that material in the page has to be "representative" but only relevant. As for the Neturi Karta participating in Quds rallies, it is quite relevant. And you have too heed the guideline WP:IDONTLIKEIT and perhaps considering your checkered record as a partisan Zionist editor you have not to openly talk about your urge for edit warring. --Expectant of Light (talk) 04:54, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

You have been warned of talking about other editors. If you continue with your personal attacks you might find yourself at AE.--יניב הורון (Yaniv) (talk) 12:22, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

I am only describing your behavior! Feel free to open a complain in AE but also heed WP:BOOMERANG given your comments regarding "wicked ayatollahs". --Expectant of Light (talk) 12:45, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

Expectant of Light: Where did he use that derogatory comment? --Mhhossein ^talk 13:34, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

Here. --Expectant of Light (talk) 13:42, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

• Orthodox Jews are nearly always participating events like Quds day rally. That's why we usually see them in photos of rallies. Saff V. (talk) 13:15, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

• Joe: The consensus has nothing to do with Iran. See 'Other Criteria' section and search for "representative". --Mhhossein ^talk 10:46, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

@Mhhossein: I don't understand what you're trying to say. The question posed in the RfC was "Iran or Germany" and each of the bolded !votes above express support for Iran specifically. – Joe (talk) 13:06, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

Joe:Thanks for the reply. That's clear. Firstly, what the users seems to have agreed upon was the "representative" criteria suggested by HyperGaruda. Be it Iranian or not, the photo needs represent the incident, i.e. it should be somehow different from other regular rallies. Secondly, we don't VOTE and we don't sum the comments when assessing consensus. --Mhhossein ^talk 14:33, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

I stand by the original close. I'm aware that consensus is not a head count, having closed several hundred discussions on Wikipedia by now: that is what the ! in !vote signifies. – Joe (talk) 15:34, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

The mistake after another one

@Nableezy: sorry I removed the long standing material by mistake. I was coming to restore them, but you had done it. Thanks!Saff V. (talk) 19:43, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 23 May 2020

Change "Organisation of the Islamic Conference" to "Organisation of Islamic Cooperation" in the History section. Kongugirl (talk) 05:15, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

To editor Kongugirl:  Not done: sorry, but this should not be changed. The name changed to its present "Organisation of Islamic Cooperation" in 2011, and the event in the history section happened in 1988, while the org's name was still "Organisation of the Islamic Conference". Such a historic reference should not be modified. There is a redirect that links to the article with the new name. Thank you for your edits! P.I. Ellsworth  ed. ^put'r there 13:37, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

broken link

the first External link doesn't work. HaShumai (talk) 17:32, 20 March 2022 (UTC)