Talk:Phrygian cap

Comments

I think a section should discuss the cultural significance of this hat. namely that the smurfs wear 'em. 72.174.2.252 07:10, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Smurfs wear this hat too.

This hat is strikingly similar to Parthian, Persian, and Scythian hats of the classical period. Anyone have a source discussing their relationship?(Kaveh94 (talk) 21:48, 10 October 2010 (UTC))

--Picture?--

Oh my. If the Smurfs get recognition, then a band of Disney midgets called "The Seven Dwarfs" from Snow White's story should get included too. Um, all theirs are red too. User: Bwildasi Mon Jan 19 02:28:55 UTC 2009 —Preceding undated comment was added at 02:18, 19 January 2009 (UTC).

Does anyone have a picture of a live person wearing this cap? --V. Joe 07:26, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

According to the 16th century philosopher Jean Bodin, the cap was 'the auntient marke of a slaue newly enfranchised, to couer his shauen head vntill his haire were growne' (Six Bookes of a Commone-weale, English translation of 1606, p33). Should this be included? - Brodie 14/06/07

we really need a direct mention in article of both smurfs and disney dwarfs, as these are the major avenue for public awareness of this style hat, esp, in nonfrancophone countries. hell, its the only reason i DONT wear the cap, cause i dont want to look like a smurf. 50.193.19.66 (talk) 17:13, 4 April 2022 (UTC)

Nonsensical statement

From Section 1: "liberty and barbarism (in the classical sense of non-Greekness, rather than a reference to any lack of civilization)"

Not quite sure what this is supposed to mean. The classical Greeks (i.e. Athenians) did not consider barbaroi to be simply non-Greek but civilized. In fact, the "classical sense" has everything to do with the fact that the Athenians considered non-Athenians to be uncivilized. Additionally, the "lack of civilization" is unclear, as I'm not sure whether the author means civilization, in the sense of a group of people forming a society, or "civilized" culture.

The connection of the Phrygian cap to barbarians is certainly correct, but to say that there is a classical sense of the word which does include the some sort of value judgement is simply false.

Since I've never edited anything before, I thought I would add a comment rather than to make the actual edit, to ensure consensus.

Hursta (talk) 22:57, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Legend of Zelda

Does Link from The Legend of Zelda video game series wear a phrygian? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.129.64.1 (talk) 17:59, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Va. flag

I removed the reference to the flag of Virginia; the standing figure is wearing a helmet, not a cap.

Virginia-American (talk) 03:23, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

... Along the same lines I've removed the reference to Bonne Homme (from the Quebec_City_Winter_Carnival), he wears a toque. Strawmd (talk) 15:38, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Strasbourg cathedral

The story of the bonnet rouge hauled to the top of the spire is so familiar that it appears in a New York Times travel piece by wine writer Anthony Peregrine. The statement is likely to be challenged by some passer-by, but a reference would be pretentious and jejune, no?--Wetman 20:23, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

The story of the bonnet rouge is so familiar that the first sentence of this article used to hoist the notion that "The Phrygian cap is a soft, red, conical cap ... worn in antiquity ...". There is no compelling reason to suppose that the cap was already red in antiquity, so I furled that flag. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.15.54.203 (talk) 18:08, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

Phrygian cap vs Pileus

Phrygian cap indicates that the two are different things but the articles on Pileus indicates they are two names for the same thing. We should be consistent. -- Beardo (talk) 04:23, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

This is a very good point. The phrygian cap is different thing from the liberty cap. They should be separated. - Eponymous-Archon (talk) 09:29, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

The Phrygian cap is a symbol of liberty, per the entire page. Randy Kryn (talk) 11:56, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

That's the point: the page is wrong. The Phrygian cap is worn by, say, Ganymede, and comes to be a symbol or easterners, especially Phrygians. The freedman's cap is called a pileus, doesn't have the same form, and a native Roman tradition. It may sometimes look like a Phrygian cap, but it is clearly distinct from it. That later people confused them is also a separate issue. - Eponymous-Archon (talk) 15:01, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

It now is the common name, it was adopted by many cultures, is featured on many designs, and is a common symbol of both liberty and some national identities. The lead paragraph describes the two hats and their meanings and symbolization. Randy Kryn (talk) 15:15, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

Some people may confuse them, but Phrygian cap is not the common name for the Roman freedman's pileus. No one would refer to the cap on the coin of Brutus as a Phrygian cap, for example. The freedman's cap deserves its own page, not to be subsumed here. I have no objection to noting the early modern conflation here, of course. - Eponymous-Archon (talk) 16:46, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

Pileus has its own page, as does Phrygian cap, and both are symbols of liberty. The older use of pileus still holds, and the Phrygian cap has been the go-to liberty hat for centuries and has been recognized culturally as one of the main symbols of liberty. The two articles reference and discuss the other. Yes, two different hats and two different articles which converge and augment each other within the realm of liberty symbols. Randy Kryn (talk) 18:13, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

American iconography--several additional images

Several relevant images of a liberty cap in American iconography, which (since they're pre-1900) might be public domain (but ask), are found in a historian's blog post. 11:11, 11 May 2011 (UTC)

Images in "In antiquity" section should be shifted, resized, or removed

I'm not good with these kind of problems, but depending on the screen size the "Three wise men" mosaic (?) gets pushed down so far it looks like it's in the section on modern artistic usage, even though its caption clearly indicates that it is not meant to signify freedom from oppression. Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 08:24, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

Can the word graecified be replaced by hellenized?

I skimmed the passage "In the early Hellenistic world" and had no idea what graecified meant, so I googled it— returning no dictionary entries and a bunch of passages copied directly from this article. Further down there were quite a few uses of the words, but mostly in academic contexts. In context, I think the word means "greekified" which actually does return better definitions but isn't nearly as fancy. I think hellenized is a good compromise, but I'm uncertain if it's actually a synonym. I just think the word should be clarified because it isn't even in wikitionary. As far as I can tell, this page is the most popular use of the word on the internet outside of academia. Symphoricarpos albus (talk) 04:46, 28 April 2023 (UTC)

Sogdians

Shouldn't we add a mention that Sogdians very often wore similar soft pointed caps? 98.123.38.211 (talk) 02:34, 11 July 2024 (UTC)