Talk:Excise

May I ask ?

By Law, can we spell "Excise Tax" on the place of Excise Duty.

i dont get it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.216.115.75 (talk) 03:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Major Rewrite Required

This article requires a major rewrite, since it fails to define or explain the excise tax (under US UK or other law).

The rewrite should begin with a clear outline and then proceed to define and explain the excise tax, in comparison with the income tax, sales tax, value-added tax, ad valorem tax, etc.

Oconnell usa :Unfortunately that seems impossible: the point is that THERE IS NO clear definition of it ANYWHERE ! that is why i had bullet-pointed all the different explanations for it by the various governments, as well as the OED, to show as closely as possible the trans-national similarities, since the governments themselves, clearly intentionally, are vague about it. The point IS that it is an excuse to be able to tax almost anything which can be deemed to be in any way noxious to health and/or the environment.

I agree that there should be comparisons with other types of tax, which would definitely help the clarity. BigSteve (talk) 14:44, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

This article is confused and seriously needs to be re-written. For example, it states "Excise tax is notable insofar as how vague its definition actually is - it would be difficult, if at all possible, to find a precise definition explaining what it is that categorizes goods subject to excise tax." The article is confused because there is no single unifying definition of what goods are subject to excise tax. Although many goods taxed are viewed as harmful or undesirable, excise taxes are often imposed on harmless, "luxury" or helpful goods or services simply to raise taxes. For example, the US has imposed excise taxes on vehicles, fuels, tires, telephone services, vaccines etc. Second, the article includes a great deal of unsourced speculation amounting to Original research about the philosophical purposes of excise taxes, all of which should be removed. Ecphora (talk) 17:49, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

It might be that the article contains no "single unifying definition of what goods are subject to excise tax" for the simple reason that the term "excise" may not have a "single unifying definition." Thousands of words in English contain no "single unifying" definition, and that could be especially true with technical legal terms like "excise." Thus, that part of the problem might not be with Wikipedia itself.

There might be no need to strain to come up with a single unifying definition in this case. Perhaps the better course is to work on clarifying that the term "excise" has different meanings, and to clarify those different meanings. For example, there is a lot of confusion among "non-tax people" over the different ways the term "excise" is used in U.S. tax law.

It may help to clarify, just for purposes of this talk page, that whether a particular "tax" is physically called an "excise" or not in some tax statute is not really THE IMPORTANT QUESTION you ask on a day-to-day basis in the United States if you deal with taxes. Someone doing heavy-duty tax research would not necessarily ask the question "Is an 'excise" imposed on this particular activity or article or event?" Instead, you would simply determine what IS IMPOSED. You don't really need to know primarily whether what you have is technically called an excise, or duty, or impost, or capitation, or whatever. What is important? What are you going to have to pay? How much? When? How often? Where? To which agency or agencies?

I have practiced federal tax law (as either a CPA or an attorney) for over 25 years. I have had to research many kinds of federal taxes (and state taxes for many different states), and I have had to prepare many kinds of federal, state and local tax returns. I have NEVER, EVER had a case where there was a need to determine "what goods are subject to excise tax." The issue is: "What IS the good (or the event, or the activity) subject to?" As a tax practitioner, whether the "THING" is technically called an "excise" (or not) is not nearly as important -- legally, financially, or accounting-wise.

Hope that helps.

I agree that the article needs work, though. Famspear (talk) 21:42, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Is a tire fee an excise?

Would tire fees be a suitable subject for this article? Please read Waste Tire Fees and Licenses: Department of Ecology: State of Washington. -- allen四names 01:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

What is the cost of a pack of cigarettes in Canada

The rate of taxation is given 1.3 dollars for a pack of cigarettes. What is the cost of a pack of cigarettes? Prices of a list of common items may be given for each country along with rate of taxes for those. This would give us a perspective about the tax: price ratio. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bkpsusmitaa (talk • contribs) 07:30, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Contains false information

The article mentions that excise taxes are the only taxes mentioned in the Constitution, which is not true. Article 1, Section 2, Clause 3 of the US Constitution mentions direct taxes. And the 16th Amendment identifies income taxes. Likewise, this article defines "capitation" as an indirect tax. This is also erroneous, as capitation is actually a direct tax. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ZTFulkerson (talk • contribs) 19:12, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes, thanks. The statement that an excise is the only kind of tax mentioned in the Constitution was indeed clearly erroneous. I watch this article, and somehow it got in there without my noticing. On the other thing, the intent was not to say that a capitation is a "indirect" tax -- the word "indirect" was supposed to be referring to "excise," but I can see how the language was ambiguous. I therefore changed it a bit -- hopefully that clears it up. Thanks! Famspear (talk) 01:28, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

Appreciate the timely correction and response. --ZTFulkerson (talk) 20:06, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Confusing ambiguity

re: 'In the United Kingdom, HM Revenue and Customs lists "alcohol, environmental taxes, gambling, holdings & movements, hydrocarbon oil, money laundering, refunds of duty, revenue trader's records, tobacco duty, and visiting forces" as being subject to excise.[2] Some of the listed items are not goods, but rather services.'

Money Laundering? The UK has a specific tax code for illegally obtained funds? Or is there a definition for legal 'money laundering' not found in the following page? Money laundering

Ernest Ruger (talk) 11:51, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

The UK doesn't. Someone just copied in a list of subheadings from a web page on excise duties, including sections on administration of the taxes... Mauls (talk) 21:21, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Illegal drugs taxed?

What's the deal with the section claiming that "illegal drugs" are taxed in some US states? Narcotics used in prescriptions are not illegal. I assume that's what it's referring to. If not, and it really does mean illegal drugs, that's essentially an impossible tax to collect. 134.39.119.202 (talk) 19:26, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Such a tax could be meant as a means to prosecute people for tax evasion when there is not enough evidence to prosecute them for illegal drug use; Al Capone was jailed for tax evasion, not anything else he might have done. 331dot (talk) 19:28, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Dear IP 134.39.119.202: You probably shouldn't be assuming that what you are assuming. Also, whether you believe that a tax is impossible to collect or not is irrelevant to the question of whether the law imposes a tax on that drug. Many laws are difficult or impossible to enforce, including some tax laws. Famspear (talk) 19:31, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Example: The U.S. federal income tax (which is technically an "excise" in the sense of "indirect tax") is imposed on illegal income as well as legal income. Illegal income includes income from the illegal sale of certain drugs. The fact that sellers of illegal drugs in the United States rarely report those sales (and are rarely caught for tax evasion, etc.) is irrelevant to the question of whether the tax is imposed by law on the gains from those sales. Famspear (talk) 19:36, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

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Definition problems

This article still needs work, particularly in the introduction, on the definition of "excise" and "excise tax". These terms, like many legal terms, have more than one legal meaning. The throws terms around like "excise" and "duty" without really getting to the heart of the problem. In the United States, for example, the U.S. Federal gift tax is a type of "excise," but the definition given in the article, as presently written, does not really apply to the U.S. Federal gift tax. Same problem for the U.S. Federal estate tax and the U.S. Federal income tax, all of which are technically "excises". Stay tuned. Famspear (talk) 12:57, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

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