Talk:Damascus/Archive 1

Archive 1

Use of map to show location

The picture file "Syria location map2.svg", used here to indicate the geographical location of Damascus, is quite clearly inappropriate to use in order to show the borders of the the country of Syria. It is seriously (and indeed controvesially) inaccurate in that it shows land at the foot of the southern end of the Golan Heights as included in the territory of Syria. Not only should it be noted that the whole Golan Heights is currently occupied and indeed annexed by neighbouring Israel, but the area in question - at the southern end of the Heights - is NOT included in the occupied area, NOT included and the Heights and, incidentally, NOT claimed by Syria (not even when referring to the so-called "June 4, 1967 borders"). The problem is compounded because, apparantly, this picture file is used in in more that 100 other Wikipedia pages to show the location of Syrian towns. Barmispain (talk) 10:57, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Format

This may just be on my screen, but the first introductory paragraph at the top clips the information box on the right. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.145.210.52 (talk) 19:32, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Naming

The term (Bilaad Al-Sham)can mean "land of Shem (son of Noah)". According to Alkamoos Almuheet (meaning literally: The Encyclopedic Dictionary) by Alfirooz Abaady, in the Section of letter (M: mem), the Chapter of letter (SH: sheen) Al-Sh'am: land to the left[north] of Qibla [Makah in Saudia arabia], and it was named so either because some Canaanites (tsha'moo) went left [meaning north] towords it, or after Sam, the son of Noah since he is called Sham with (SH) instead of (S) in Syric language. ... and Tsha'ama: means he is from there [Damascus, Sham], or it means going North. ... And Sha'oom: is the the opposite of right.

Sham does not mean 'north' in Arabic. Have deleted this line. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.206.131.98 (talk) 13:01, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

uncategorized talk

Why does this page not have a consistent dateing for the creation of damascus? It shifts a few thousand years here and there throughout the article!

Many possibilities for improvement are at "What links here."

I find it a bit odd that we have a string of Hebrew for the name of this city at the top of the article. It is mentioned in the Bible, so it should have a single mention in the Tiberian Hebrew in the history section. It is far more important to note that this city is locally known as Ash-Sham. Gareth Hughes 23:11, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)

It is, perhaps, even more important to note the population of the city...the article, that is, is rather dreadful. john k 07:35, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I agree. I've done a bit of a rewrite of the lead section. Are there any good city articles that would serve as a template for rewriting this one? I used to live in ash-Sham, are there any other Wikipedians who know the city well? Gareth Hughes 16:11, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I used to live just 20 minutes northwest of Damascus in a suburb called Mashroo3 Dummar. This article needs to be improved greatly, when I get the time I might do it.Yuber 23:48, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

There is so much that could be written about Damascus, but coming upon this slim article just makes me wonder where to begin. Perhaps we could start a list here, on the talk page, of things that should be included in the article, and then start editing them in. --Gareth Hughes 10:57, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Should we go by the articles on Cairo and Jerusalem as templates for what to include? Or perhaps we should use a European city? Yuber 03:24, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Yuber, I like what you've done with the article. I would like to see a more extensive history section for the city (we could work off the Syria article). I would also like something about the atmosphere of Damascus, particularly focusing on the Old City and the surrounding city centre, but also perhaps something about the suburbs. For the Old City, I think it would be good to have something about the walls, gates and the citadel; the Umayyad Mosque, of course; Souq al-Hamadiyya; the Street Called Straight (is that the same as Madhat Basha?); Ananias' House; the Greek and Syriac patriarchates; Bab Touma; Saladin's Tomb; Azem Palace; St Paul's Chapel Bab Kisan; various madrassas, hammams, khans and mosques. For the New City: the Barada river, the University of Damscus campus, al-Marja, the Hejaz railway station, the Takiyya as-Sulaymaniyya Mosque and souq; the National Museum. I shall have a look at some other city articles as well (Cairo and Jerusalem are good examples). --Gareth Hughes 10:30, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Good ideas, the history section still needs to be polished up (and possibly reorganized). I added a section on historical sites that can hopefully be expanded, and I put a few of the sites of the Old city there.Yuber 05:09, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Gentlemen, if I may be of any assistance contact me at tarekal_hariri@yahoo.co.uk as I go to Damascus every year for three months. --T.W.a.H.a.a.R.

Hey, if you want, you can start editing by yourself. Just click the edit button at the top of the screen and add whatever you think might be applicable. If you have pictures of Damascus that you would be willing to contribute just upload them (upload button at left of screen).Yuber^(talk) 04:04, 15 May 2005 (UTC)

geography section expanded

I've done some work on the geography section, hope to get more info into other bits as well soon.

By the way, the article cites an Aramaic name for Damascus but it's written in Hebrew letters. Is there a reason it's not in Syriac letters? Or am I just showing my ignorance?Palmiro 11:33, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

Ghouta Cheease? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.207.0.5 (talk) 20:27, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Chino?--86.29.249.169 (talk) 02:11, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

history section expanded

I've put some more info into this, but it still requires some work (both editing the new material and filling in some gaps: there's nothing yet on the Ottoman period apart from the very beginning, the Muhammad Ali interlude and the very end, and nothing on the development of the modern city.Palmiro 18:30, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

"City planners preferred to preserve the Ghouta as far as possible", This was not implemented, although they should have. Mezze was part of ghouta. Kafarsousseh ( built with official approval in ghoutal, South West of the old city)shadyzay Mar 29 2007, 14:02 ( +2GMT )

I see an error in the line about the city's being raised to the rank of colonia. The date is given as 222 CE and the Roman emperor as Septimius Severus, but SS died in 211 so either the date is wrong or the emperor is wrong. Elagabalus was the emperor at the start of 222, but was succeeded by Severus Alexander during the course of the year. Rareanniversary (talk) 22:10, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing that out. I planning to get some info from a book on the history of Damascus, but if you could find any info from a reliable source, go ahead and fix the problem. --Al Ameer son (talk) 22:51, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Damascus' description

Damascus being described as the most beautiful city in the world totally fails to achieve an objective point of view. This should definitely be cut off for the sake of objectiveness.

I just took that statement out, it's highly POV. Even though many of us think Damascus is a beautiful city, we must remain NPOV. Regards, --Gramaic | Talk 20:45, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

Minor Quibble

The clause ... and is the oldest inhabited city in the world irritates me a little as this is hardly undisputed fact - it may be a contender of oldest continually inhabited settlement, although personally I feel that its claim to this title is rather weak. As it is at the beginning of the article, it made a huge impression on the extent to which I trusted the rest of the article. --Si42 16:38 19th October 2005 (UTC)

Now considerably restricted! Thanks for pointing this out. Palmiro | Talk 17:09, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

I don't know how a city can "claim" to be the oldest. I have changed the wording to "it is thought to be", although those are somewhat of weasel words. Yuber^(talk) 01:23, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Damascus is the oldest inhabited city in the world. Whenever I see documentaries about Damascus on TV, they always state that it's the oldest. --Gramaic | Talk 04:04, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Can we nail it down to a source? I've seen the same claim made about Aleppo myself, which makes me additionally dubious. Is there some book out there about The World's Oldest Cities? And why do I keep automatically getting logged out? - Palmiro

Whether or not Damascus is the oldest continually inhabited city in the world, it certainly does claim to be the old. It is also "frequently said to be" the oldest - this latter is definitely true. What are the other contenders? Jericho wasn't continually inhabited (and I'm not sure if modern Jericho is even on the same site as ancient Jericho). Jerusalem is old, but I've never heard it described as older than Damascus. Nablus is probably pretty old, but again, I've not heard it described as older than Damascus. Aleppo would seem a plausible contender, and maybe Hama as well. I don't think any of the ancient Mesopotamian cities have survived, nor any of the ancient Egyptian cities (Aswan, though, maybe? It was Syene to the Egyptians, but I'm not sure how old it was). None of the Indus Valley cities survived, and Shang China only emerged rather after the date we're talking about. So it's almost certainly a city in the Levant somewhere. What are the other contenders? john k 16:20, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Other possibilities would be the Phoenician cities, especially Byblos, which is, I believe, as Jubayl, still inhabited, although quite small, but which dates back to the 3rd millennium BC. If not those, Sidon and Tyre are quite old as well. Perhaps we could write an article on this subject, listing (for instance), all currently inhabited cities which date back before Alexander the Great or so (the Hellenistic and Roman periods give so many cities that it would be overwhelming). john k 16:28, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

We'd have to define what it means to be "continually-inhabited". If a city is destroyed then resettled centuries later it is obviously not continually-inhabited, but what if a city has a large population then for centuries is a mere hamlet? Damascus has been documented as an important city in every era, the earliest being Ebla's identification of it, so I definitely think it is the oldest continually-inhabited city. Yuber^(talk) 01:49, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Well, according to the retired director of antiquities of Aleppo, Dr. Mahmoud al-Haritani (I think) Aleppo is definitely, undoubtedly, incontestably the oldest continuously-inhabited city in the world! Palmiro | Talk 20:25, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

LOL.Yuber^(talk) 21:08, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Wow, what a surprising thing for a Syrian director of antiquities to say! ;-) - Also, I was wondering if Hebron would be a contender for the title - some of you probably know more than me about this... --Si42 23:25, 20 November 2005 (UTC)

"Whether or not Damascus is the oldest continually inhabited city in the world, it certainly does claim to be the old." The "city" claims this ? Stones don't speak. Who claims this ? The mayor ?Eregli bob (talk) 10:28, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Damaski

[1] There's the source. Yuber^(talk) 17:46, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

A source from Damascus-Online.com? Surely it's hardly accepted by all? Excuse me if I seem a little agressive on this topic, I am just aware that pages describing regions and cities such as Ash-Shams may be particularly subject to a few nationalist/localist tendencies.Si42 00:42, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

It's in "Syria in View" by Michael Jenner as well if you want to pick that up. Yuber^(talk) 19:59, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Fair enough, I have never said that it definitely isn't - and am happy to contend that it may well be the oldest continually-inhabited city in the world, and is very often (at least in the Western and Arab spheres) spoken of in those terms. The problem is, that coming out and saying it presents what is a constantly ongoing debate as established fact - the way the opening paragraph is worded at the moment seems fine to me, especially since I found Oldest cities little gem, which I have nominated for deletion for unverifyability, although now I am trying to think of ways we could change it to make it more appropriate - not least since a similar page was requested here some time ago.--Si42 14:46, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

OK, I am going to let this go now, here is an acceptable source: [2]--Si42 00:00, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Al-Hama

Al-Hama is a new article describing a suburb of Damascus. Can anyone verify the details in the article or expand it, particularly so that it doesn't focus on Israel? Melchoir 02:43, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Capital, but not Governorate!

This article is for the capital of the governorate of Damascus. An article should be started for the governorate, and the template should be modified. I will make it but I'm very busy this week, if any other would fix that, it would be appreciated. --Anas Salloum 12:50, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

The govenorate is the city! If a former suburb becomes a part of the governorate it has to be already a part of the city, and there's actually nothing in the governorate of Damascus except for the city itself. So, I don't see why we should start something other than a simple redirect page. Orionist 14:04, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

No my friend, you are wrong. The Damascus Governorate has many manatiq's and cities, and the capital of this governorate is Damascus, the city. What about Bloudan, Zabadani, Saidnaya? And if you check for other governorates, they have separate articles. Perhaps the Governorates of Syria article can clarify things for you. ↔ ANAS - Talk 18:19, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

You're talking about the governorate of Rif Dimashq. The towns you mentioned are all in Rif Dimashq. Damascus by itself is a separate governorate, but at the same time it is the capital of Rif Dimashq. You're mixing محافظة مدينة دمشق with محافطة ريف دمشق. This may be confusing, and it is. The capital is cluttered with government buildings, because every sevice has to have three separate buildings, one for the ministry, another for Damascus, and another for Rif Dimashq!.....Anyway, something should be written about this, I'll think of something tomorrow. This may be a chance to expand the Rif Dimashq article... what do you think? Orionist 06:23, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

I must have had a misunderstanding, thanks for clarifying things up Orionist. I agree with the edits you did, I think it's fine the way it is now. Concerning the Rif Dimashq article, I will be glad to work on its expansion with you. We can collect some sources and references and try to revamp the article. We can discuss this if you want, leave me a message if you're interested. Thanks. ↔ ANAS - Talk 12:10, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Sister Cities?

What is it meant by "Sister Cities"? Why Yerevan is a sister of Damascus? And why should it have a section in this article without explaining all that? Orionist 14:14, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Obviously it's unrelated to Damascus at all, I removed it. If it is somehow related to Damascus and worth being mentioned, it should be justified. ↔ ANAS - Talk 18:23, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Deleted external links

External link or links have recently been deleted by User:Calton as "horrible Tripod pages which add little information, are full of ads, and fail WP:EL standards." No better external links were substituted. Readers may like to judge these deleted links for themselves, by opening Page history. --Wetman 14:57, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

infobox

There is currently a world heritage site infobox, but I think this article needs a city infobox, I will add that one above the current one. Asabbagh 04:04, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Update: Since the city is also a governorate, this means the article can have 3 infoboxes. Right now there are 2 (WHS and governorate) and I think it already looks messy. Any ideas? Asabbagh 07:38, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Via recta: Cardo or decumanus?

The via recta or "straight road" (known from the biblical book of Acts 9,11) is called the "cardo" in this article. Should it not be the decumanus? In the Roman City layout the Cardo usually runs north-south. The Bab-es-Sharqi/Midhat-Pasha-Souk road runs east-west which was the usual alignment of the decumanus. --Kipala 13:41, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Downtown Damascus

Asabbagh you are employing weak English when you say Downtown "of" Damascus, the "of" is not necessary and redundant. Now, your use of the word "of" in between these words is confusing considereing that you claim you're a Canadian from Syrian origins. Wherever you go in Canada and the US, you always hear and read, Downtown Montreal, Downtown New York, Downtown Boston. Asabbagh please educate yourself...I appreciate your work...but you're supposed to be improving the language not the opposite. go check out this dictionary link

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/downtown

Notice the dictionary link says "Downtown Manhattan" NOT "Downtown "of" Manhattan" 132.205.103.171 19:49, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Hey, yea I meant to do what you did, someone changed it earlier, adding the of, and I thought I was taking it out by my revert. It was late and I didn't notice that I was doing the opposite of what I intended to do. I tend to do that sometimes.... Thanks for the link, I won't be needing it though. Asabbagh 06:02, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Pictures are all free license now

All pictures in this article have now been checked to insure that they are free license and do not have any copyright restrictions. Please ensure that any pictures you add or edit in the future, conform to some form of free license agreement, thanks. Haxxor23 14:43, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Proposal: An 'Eschatology' section

I am proposing that an 'Eschatology' section be added. I had added it but then decided that this step might be considered vandalism by some so I undid my edit. I do feel, however, that since Damascus is mentioned in Biblical Prophecy (Eschatology) that any reader would be interested in seeing at least one reference mentioned in the Bible and how it relates to unfolding events today. Below is at least one link to an article that I had just read; which link comes from 'RaptureReady.com'

• [http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=57754] Prophesied destruction of Damascus imminent? by Hal Lindsay.

Below is the scripture reference taken from the New International Version:

Isaiah 17-9: "An oracle concerning Damascus: "See, Damascus will no longer be a city but will become a heap of ruins. The cities of Aroer will be deserted and left to flocks, which will lie down, with no one to make them afraid. The fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, and royal power from Damascus; the remnant of Aram will be like the glory of the Israelites," declares the LORD Almighty. "In that day the glory of Jacob will fade; the fat of his body will waste away. It will be as when a reaper gathers the standing grain and harvests the grain with his arm — as when a man gleans heads of grain in the Valley of Rephaim. Yet some gleanings will remain, as when an olive tree is beaten, leaving two or three olives on the topmost branches, four or five on the fruitful boughs," declares the LORD, the God of Israel. In that day men will look to their Maker and turn their eyes to the Holy One of Israel. They will not look to the altars, the work of their hands, and they will have no regard for the Asherah poles and the incense altars their fingers have made. In that day their strong cities, which they left because of the Israelites, will be like places abandoned to thickets and undergrowth. And all will be desolation."

It would be better to put this in an article on doomsday predictions where the passage you quote could be put in its proper historical context. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.232.91.86 (talk) 04:01, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

History section referencing

I found a book source that could be used to reference most of the history section but I don't have time right now to look through it. Here's the link though. Good luck whoever. I think we should go for a GA soon! --Al Ameer son (talk) 19:40, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Wow, i forgot to give the link. Here it is[3]

event links

any way to incorporate major events into this? today's 2008 Damascus car bomb has a wikipage. Lihaas (talk) 14:04, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Persia under Cyprus ?!

How can we say: "The Babylonian rule of the city came to an end in 538 BC when the Persians under Cyprus captured the city and made it the capital of the Persian province of Syria."

The Persia was not under Cyprus, but Cyprus was under Persia. 192.89.97.1 (talk) 07:15, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I'll change it back to "Cyrus" how it was earlier.. 192.89.97.1 (talk) 07:29, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

John Tzimiskes

Why is John Tzimiskes' recapture of Damascus not mentioned? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.105.128.56 (talk) 21:54, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Shrine of John the Baptist

This page suggests that the mosque is believed to hold the body of John the Baptist, but the page for the mosque itself refers to John the Baptist's head, not his body. Which is correct? 65.213.77.129 (talk) 15:31, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

I think tradition holds it that his head is in the building not his whole body. You should check a reliable source before making any clarifications in the article though. --Al Ameer son (talk) 19:06, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Damascus Collaboration

Hello Everyone, it's heart warming to see collaboration back at Damascus. Please list here the to-dos.

I'm gonna be starting important starts about the cities neighborhoods, and Damascus Metro, hopefully today. Yazan (talk) 04:55, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

Detailed To-Do list

I realize Damascus is much larger and more prestigious than other cities that we have worked on, but Hims, Latakia, and even Gaza—all GAs—could be used as references as far as structure is concerned.

• Expand and cite the post-Babylonian part of the "Ancient"section
• Cite "Antiquity" section.
• Expand and cite (perhaps merge) "Mamluk" section.
• Cite "Ottoman rule" and "Modern" sections.
• Cite Geography section. Also, a subsection on Climate should be added along with a climate chart.
• Create prose section on city districts/subdivisions/neighborhoods.
• Restructure "Historical sites" section. These lists are typically frowned upon. Let's consider converting to prose. Luckily most of these sites have their own articles so the prose doesn't have to be too extensive.
• Expand and cite "Education" section.
• Cite "Transportation" section.
• Continuity: Is BC/AD or BCE/CE being used? The article needs continuity.
• Expand "Culture" section. Damascus has an extremely rich culture and so we could include subsections on local cuisine, cultural centers and museums, local traditions, traditional costumes, cultural festivals, etc. The sections on "Sports" and "Leisure activities" should be merged into the main "Culture" section.

[4] could be an interesting source on the cuisine, although it is largely historical many of it stands true today. Yazan (talk) 09:41, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

• Get rid of "Nearby attractions" section. Article isn't a tour guide.

The nearby attractions should be mentioned between the Geography, Culture, Economy sections I think, because they are very linked to Damascus the city. (especially Zabadani, and Bloudan. They are a favorite summer getaway for Damascenes).Yazan (talk) 10:10, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Makes sense, but there shouldn't be a separate section on it. I prefer we have a passage on those sites (I actually heard about Bloudan from my Syrian friends) in the Geography sections. Yes, no?

•  Done Section on people born in Damascus should be relocated to a new article: List of people from Damascus.

--Al Ameer son (talk) 02:54, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

I added the date continuity one to the list above. I also did a major cleanup of External links and removed the image gallery. Spencer^{T♦Nominate!} 00:11, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

If this article is to make it to FA, we need to find some other reliable sources, one book will not be accepted. Ameer, what's the policy on foreign language sources? Yazan (talk) 11:33, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm not exactly sure, although I think they're frowned upon, especially if we're going after such a high status. I'll take a look see just anyway. Sorry for not being active recently. The semester is coming to a close and school work has become overwhelming. I have not forgotten the article and will continue work on it by next week. Keep up the good work everyone! Cheers, --Al Ameer son (talk) 20:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

From what I recall, foreign language sources are OK, but an English source is preferable. Spencer^{T♦Nominate!} 22:06, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Crusades section

I realize it is a very minor point in the history of Damascus, but I think the events of the twelfth century could be expanded. At the moment the Second Crusade, the siege of Damascus, and the rise of Nur ad-Din and Saladin are not mentioned at all, while many earlier events are mentioned in detail. I can help add some more information, if no one else has planned to do it yet. Also, I was wondering whether the book by Ross Burns (note 34) is correct - I doubt that the crusaders ever had 60 000 soldiers, especially in 1129. Adam Bishop (talk) 04:22, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Please feel free to do so. The work on Damascus has fizzled for a while, so I don't anyone would mind. Yazan (talk) 05:30, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Ok, I've added some paragraphs about the twelfth century. Adam Bishop (talk) 05:31, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Do you have the citations though? Yazan (talk) 05:39, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I'll finish those off soon. (Our Saladin and Third Crusade articles aren't very well-referenced, so I'll have to do a bit of work!) Adam Bishop (talk) 06:14, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Damascus is NOT the largest Syrian city

First of all, the area of Damascus is NOT 221 sq mi. This is insane. NYC is 304 sq mi. Sadly, I can't find the area of Damascus CITY in any official government website. However, I found a recent statement by the governor of Damascus to a government newspaper in which he said that Damascus is 10,832 hectares, which means 42 sq mi. This is a logical number, and you can confirm it by looking at Damascus in Google Earth and comparing it to NYC.

Now the other important thing is that Damascus city is almost HALF the size of Aleppo. Here is another article in which a Syrian minister says that Aleppo is 19,000 hectares, which means about 73 sq mi, i.e. about double the size of Damascus. This seems to make sense since the UN Demographic Yearbook gives the population of Aleppo as about double that of Damascus.

Unfortunately, I can't find any better citations for the area. But I am almost certain that Damascus city (without the suburbs, which belong to another governate, the Rif Dimashq) is no more than 50 sq mi or so. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.178.224.176 (talk) 18:41, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Roman rule potential innacuracy

According to the article, Damascus was under Nabataean control into the early second century. But according to "A Guide to the Ancient World" by Michael Grant, it reverted to Roman rule in 62 C.E. Some fact-checking needed there, perhaps? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.167.235.51 (talk) 03:24, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Damascus metro population

The article indicates that the metro population of Damascus is 4.8 million which is not accurate. The figure 4.8 million refers to the whole population of Rif Dimashq governorate (including the city of Damascus). Rif Dimashq is a separate governorate, spreaded on a wide range far away from the city of Damascus and is not the metropolitan area of Damascus. The administrative divisions in Syria include Governorates (Mohafazas) with smaller districts (manatiqs). For example, Aleppo city has a population of 2.1 million and its metro population is 2.5 million which is the population of Jabal Semaan district (Aleppo mantiqah), while Aleppo governorate has a population of 5.5 million which is not considered as metro population of Aleppo. Kevorkmail (talk) 05:14, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

I corrected this and other statistics. However, although the 4.8 million number was not accurate, it was well-sourced, and deleting it was not acceptable. If you're going to delete a sourced statement, you have to get a better source first. So please be careful in such cases, especially since you appear to be extensively editing this article. Regards, -- Orionist ★ talk 06:51, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

fourth holiest city in Islam?

An editor continues to try to instert that "Damascus is the fourth holiest city" in Islam, without a source. Damascus, of course, is gigantic city in islamic history, but i've never heard anything about "holiness." A good source, at minimum, for this rather odd claim is needed before it's added again.Bali ultimate (talk) 12:18, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Stated 2009 population is not supported by source

I was surprised to see Damascus named the largest city in Syria, since the article on Aleppo says Aleppo is the largest, and it's always been my understanding from multiple sources that Damascus ranks second. And the source for that population - 4,211,000 - does not give that figure. Instead, Table 3 gives the city's population as 1,711,000 and that of Aleppo as 4,624,000. (That Aleppo figure itself is far larger than the 2.3 million stated in the Aleppo entry, so I think this must be the governorate population.) There's another figure for "Damascus Rural" - whatever that is, I don't think it means the city itself. So unless someone can back up that 4.2 million population, I'm going to change it to reflect what the source actually says.Wlegro (talk) 16:39, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

I was just wondering, as somebody pointed me to the totally different numbers here and in German WP. The source given here (quite official looking) has the same numbers as the German WP.. --TheK (talk) 15:06, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Image of Citadel of Damascus

This image is included in the section on Seljuk and Ayyubid rule to illustrate the Citadel of Damascus. However, I am pretty sure that it was actually taken at the Citadel of Salah Ed-Din. Can anyone confirm this? -- Zoeperkoe (talk) 18:26, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

The fact that its signed in the bottom is enough to remove it. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 18:45, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Removal of Dubai from Sister cities

Dubai is a sister city:[5], there is no reason to remove it. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 20:34, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

No Aretas but Herod Agrippa I

The person who have written under ‘Antiquity’, he misinforms to us. I don’t know where he has gotten his facts, but really Roman Emperor Caligula transferred Damascus to his friend, Herod Agrippa I. Look http://www.livius.org/he-hg/herodians/herod_agrippa_i.html. I have corresponded with worthy Finnish Classics researcher Jaakko Frösen and he says in the same way. I ask to correct this mistake! Juhanive (talk) 05:48, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

Footnotes

You need to go back over all your footnotes and make sure they appear in your references list or give the complete reference. For example footnote 12 to a page in something by somebody named McMillan is a complete mystery because there's nothing by him/her listed further down. 4.249.63.128 (talk) 17:57, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

Oldest continuously inhabited city in the world...?

I have a source (Laughlin, John C. H., Fifty Major Cities of the Bible, New York: Routledge, 2006: p. 99) which says "It is popular to refer to Damascus as the oldest continuously occupied city in the world. However, there is no archaeological evidence to support such a claim." I'm sure it is readable in part on Google books. He also says that the relevant literary references also fail for "establishing an early date for the existence of the city" (p. 100). In an attempt at being bold, I'm just going to remove the claim in the introduction, since it does not seem to have any good source claiming it and now there is a good source denying it. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.--Atethnekos (talk) 09:08, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

When I visited Damascus last year (2010), the locals said that Damascus is the "oldest continuously occupied capital city in the world". Surely that can be reasonably easily verified. Kmasters0 (talk) 07:06, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

No, it would be very difficult to verify, because many cities were around long before there were any written records. Til Eulenspiegel (talk) 12:01, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

File:Damascus overview1.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

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Small text

The text about the Damascus skyline in the tan box in the infobox is very small and difficult to read at 100% zoom. Could this be fixed, and how? —HueSatLum 17:24, 24 July 2012 (UTC)

Edit warring

Can people please keep an eye on this entry? It seems to be a target for all kind of passions that lead to the insertion of partisan and unsourced words & texts.Super48paul (talk) 08:37, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

Yes, I have removed text that suggested the government was deliberately massacring the Damascan population. I will remain vigilant on this page and make sure there is no vandalism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.189.85.38 (talk) 18:00, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Caligula and Damascus

I've removed a section that claims that Caligula gave Damascus to the Nabataeans. There is no evidence of such a transfer, though it has been conjectured to explain how Aretas IV could want to kill the apostle Paul in Damascus. -- spin|^control 08:38, 5 August 2014 (UTC)

Damascus as part of Roman province of Syria

Ross Burns in this 2007 edition of Damascus: A History Routledge pg 52 writes:

"The Augustan peace gave new impetus to Syria's economic development after centuries of disruption and fragmentation. Damascus, returned to Roman control, recovered quickly after the successive wars of the past ten years. It still enjoyed the theoretical status of a Hellenised self governing city within the Roman province of Syria and now embarked on an unparalleled era of prosperity."

This current scholarly source clearly states that Damascus was "within the Roman province of Syria" in the time of Augustus. I don't know where this Decapolis claim is coming from but since it is unreferenced it is useless.--216.223.234.97 (talk) 18:47, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

If burns didn't mention that damascus was part of the decapolis then it is his fault, I have provided the sources. its also by routledge and written by Warwick Ball, now you need a source for herod controlling the city, find it and add the sentence about herod without deleting the decapolis part.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 19:30, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Herod controlling the city is also in Ross also on page 52. Furthermore, "Pompey incorporated the cities of the Decapolis into the province of Syria and granted them autonomy" [...] "The other cities of the Decapolis were considered part of Syrian territory until 105-106 CE"- Fred Skolnik, Michael Berenbaum ( 2007) Encyclopaedia Judaica Volume 5 Granite Hill Publishers pg 527 Per Wikipedia:Conflicting sources and Wikipedia:These are not original research you can NOT choose one reliable source over other if they conflict but rather explain the conflict in a NPOV manner. Skolnik explains that the whole of the Decapolis was incorporated into the province of Syria explaining the apparent conflict between Ball and Burns.--216.223.234.97 (talk) 03:16, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

I didnt choose anything, and I dont care if Herod controlled anything, you were just too quick to delete the Decapolis part and I just wanted to show you not to be hasty ;)

by the way, I dont think there is a conflict between the decapolis and the province, after all the decapolis were just an organization of cities and they had to follow a province :)--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 03:55, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

By deleting Burns in your edit you DID choose one source over the other. Also per Wikipedia:Verifiability "Any material that needs a source but does not have one may be removed." The Decapolis material did not have a source and I found one that appeared to say otherwise and so the Decapolis material was removed. You found a source that backed up the Decapolis claim BUT you messed in deleting Burns. You should have found a way to reconcile Burns and Ball rather then choosing Ball over Burns as you did.

As for the cities Decapolis having to follow a province not all works out there are clear on this and some maps show them as a separate entity from any province.--216.223.234.97 (talk) 04:10, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Timeline of Damascus

What is missing from the recently created city timeline article? Please add relevant content. Contributions welcome. Thank you. -- M2545 (talk) 14:53, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

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Civil War: Impact on Built Environment

From the view point of Urban Geography, it would be interesting having more information about the impact of recent bombings. For instance, to what extent was the historic centre ("Medina") damaged? After a (as we all hope) soon piece era: Will city maps still be usable?

Salam/Pace.

The problem already starts with the definition of "Civil War". This is hugely problematic since it insinuates that there are no foreigners involved. But this is factually wrong - there are foreigners fighting. So how can this be a civil war? In particular when there are more outsiders fighting against a government? Aside from this, the article is heavily biased. It starts with current history about "The uprising started with peaceful protests in the spring of 2011" and this is factually incorrect. There have always been armed people. You can not then write "peaceful protests" when it is factually incorrect. You can see massacres committed by ISIS and other terrorists against government workers on youtube. Last but not least, the goal of the terrorists is also to damage the infrastructure. I do not think that it does wikipedia any good to become a tool for terrorist propaganda as long as they are actively causing more damage. Articles on Wikipedia should be as objectively as possible. 2A02:8388:1641:4700:BE5F:F4FF:FECD:7CB2 (talk) 17:44, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Well the Spanish Civil War managed to pass muster as a civil war, despite being a famous meddling ground for all sorts of people from outside Spain, as did the Russian Civil War with non-Russians, so there's at least some precedent with a civil war having foreigners chipping in. Now, terminology aside, does anyone know what it's doing to the urban landscape? I too was moderately surprised to see that a proposed motorway was still a significant threat to the old city given everything else that's going down... 93.145.221.210 (talk) 18:05, 8 January 2018 (UTC)

Dialectical Spelling Disagreement

'Centre' (British-English) is used most frequently in the article and for the entirety of the lead, but usage of 'center' (American-English) is occasional in the article as well. I'm not sure whether there are any other issues with regards to dialectical spellings - there may be. Work should be done to identify and remedy dialect disagreements and standardize them throughout the article. (personally don't have the time, sorry!)
Refer to WP:SPELL for rules on dialectical differences in English and how to deal with them in articles

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Photos of Damascus on Wikimedia Commons

For years, Syria has been the scene of a bloody civil war resulting in hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, and the destruction of entire cities. The recent image donation by the Nationaal Museum van Wereldculturen (the National Museum of World Cultures) in the Netherlands shows another Syria. Many of these photos were taken in the 1980s and show scenes of daily life and images and cities not yet devastated by war. Other images show objects from the collection of the museum. A number of these photos were taken in and around Damascus and may be of relevance here. Together, they form a valuable resource on Syria for the various Wikimedia projects. The upload consists of 352 photos in total and can be accessed here. It coincides with a photo exhibition in the NMvW on Aleppo. The upload was part of the project The Netherlands and the World, which aims to make accessible Dutch collections on non-European heritage. Kind regards, --AWossink (talk) 11:09, 30 May 2017 (UTC)

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Climate

I checked the climate box against the Koeppen classification and found that desert better fits Damascus' climate than does semi-desert. The map may show a steppe climate, but the Koeppen classification (10 times Celsius average for a winter-maximum zone), and Damascus falls well short of the threshold of even a semi-desert climate.

Maps may be good for showing broad climate zones with homogeneous patterns of temperature and rainfall, but they are inadequate for mountainous areas in which the climate can change very much in a short distance. Damascus may be in a zone in which most locations have the BSk climate, but Damascus is in an anomalously-dry area in which that zone. Climate boxes are more reliable than are crude maps. Pbrower2a (talk) 21:10, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

Wilhelm's speech in Damascus

@NewYorkActuary: The speech was given in Damascus, there is no indication about the speech in Wilhelm's article !

After his first visit to Istanbul in 1889, Kaiser Wilhelm II had his second political visit to the Ottoman Empire as a guest of Sultan Abdülhamid II. The Kaiser started his journey to the Ottoman Eyalets with Istanbul on 16 October 1898, then he went by yacht to Haifa on 25 October. After visiting Jerusalem and Bethlehem, the Kaiser went back to Jaffa to embark to Beirut, where he took the train passing Aley and Zahle to reach Damascus on 7 November. The following day, the Kaiser made a famous speech while being at the Mausoleum of Saladin, in which he said:

“ In the face of all the courtesies extended to us here, I feel that I must thank you, in my name as well as that of the Empress, for them, for the hearty reception given us in all the towns and cities we have touched, and particularly for the splendid welcome extended to us by this city of Damascus. Deeply moved by this imposing spectacle, and likewise by the consciousness of standing on the spot where held sway one of the most chivalrous rulers of all times, the great Sultan Saladin, a knight sans peur et sans reproche, who often taught his adversaries the right conception of knighthood, I seize with joy the opportunity to render thanks, above all to the Sultan Abdul Hamid for his hospitality. May the Sultan rest assured, and also the three hundred million Mohammedans scattered over the globe and revering in him their caliph, that the German Emperor will be and remain at all times their friend. ” — Kaiser Wilhelm II,

References

Unsigned posting left by User:153.232.254.52 (talk) on 03:07, 2 April 2018

And how is this speech important for Damascus? Thousands of people visited that city in the course of its history and we cant put their speeches here. This speech belongs in the article of the German monarch; it has no importance for Damascus.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 07:33, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

I agree with Attar-Aram -- this belongs in the article on Wilhelm, not here. And if it isn't already in that article, you might want to engage with the editors there to discuss how it might best be added to the article. NewYorkActuary (talk) 14:54, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

We really need to help syria. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 23.168.0.44 (talk) 00:30, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

Sources required for non-English translations and scripts

Hi, we need reliable secondary sources that specify the name of Damascus and other terms in the other non-English languages that are listed in the article. This is the English Language Wikipedia, and we do not expect our editors or readers to know other languages. Our verifiability policy requires this. Google Translate is not a reliable source. Elizium23 (talk) 20:52, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

Coins minted at Damascus by Armenian King Tigranes the Great

Tetradrachm, Silver, Damascus, Syria, Tigranes the Great (83 BCE - 69 BCE).

Coins were minted at Damascus by Armenian King Tigranes the Great during his rule over Syria, including Damascus, from 83 BCE to 69 BCE. This is missing from the Damascus page:

"Armenian rulers prior to Tigranes didn't issue coins; he was the first one to do it. He took up the Seleucid tradition and struck coins of great interest. These were minted at Antioch and Damascus, cities under his rule during his occupation of Syria from 83 to 69 BC. They consist of tetradrachms and copper coins having on the obverse his portrait wearing a decorated Armenian tiara with ear-flaps. The reverse has a completely original design. There`s the seated Tyche of Antioch and the river god Orontes at her feet. There are even specimens struck in gold."

Mørkholm, Otto (1991). Early Hellenistic Coinage from the Accession of Alexander to the Peace of Apamaea. Cambridge University Press, p. 176.

Worth adding to this page.

BiblicalArchaeologist (talk) 18:22, 6 February 2022 (UTC)