Talk:Biden–Ukraine conspiracy theory
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![]() | On 14 September 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved to Joe Biden–Viktor Shokin–Burisma conspiracy theory. The result of the discussion was not moved. |
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Suggest removing “false” from opening sentence
editI referred a friend of mine who supports Trump to this article. He noted that the first sentence says “false accusations”. He sees this as revealing bias in the article. I think removing the word “false” from the first sentence would reduce any resistance to accepting the rest of the article (which clearly documents that the allegations are false). 98.97.92.82 (talk) 14:59, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
- The first paragraph of any article on Wikipedia is a summary of the sourced content of the remainder of the article. So if the body of the sourced content emphatically says something is false, as supported in reliable sources, then the lead should reflect that. Whether somebody wishes to disbelieve the article isn't Wikipedia's problem. Acroterion (talk) 18:30, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
- Support. The problem is the political bias. The words "false" and "conspiracy theory", both in the lead, show such bias and should be removed. Fx6893 (talk) 01:13, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- No we will not be making changes, as the Wikipedia follows reliable sources. Also, consider widening your friend circle. Zaathras (talk) 01:51, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- The term "conspiracy theory" is defined as having a derogatory connotation (see Wiktionary, for example). Employing derogatory terms in the lead reveals the bias of the editors and their attempts to disparage those with differing views, similar to your personal remarks about the commenter's friends. It's politically motivated bullying, and erodes the credibility of the encyclopedia. Fx6893 (talk) 00:29, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- WP:AGF WP:CIV You need to stop personal attacks against editors with whom you disagree. Comment on content -- not on editors. O3000, Ret. (talk) 00:34, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- Those words are accurate descriptions from RS. We do not censor RS or whitewash content. Your gripe is with reliable sources, not with the myriad editors of all political persuasions who worked together, and discussed those words, to create this article. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 00:52, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- The term "conspiracy theory" is defined as having a derogatory connotation (see Wiktionary, for example). Employing derogatory terms in the lead reveals the bias of the editors and their attempts to disparage those with differing views, similar to your personal remarks about the commenter's friends. It's politically motivated bullying, and erodes the credibility of the encyclopedia. Fx6893 (talk) 00:29, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose. Not when RS say it. We document the facts. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 01:18, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose, we follow what the reliable sources have to say. What your mate feels about having reality shown to them is highly irrelevant. TarnishedPathtalk 07:12, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- What's the point of having a false article on Wikipedia? Someone should make up their mind.Maybe call it "The Biden-Burisma accusations" 2001:2020:4321:F453:7934:8176:A824:EA03 (talk) 07:59, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
- Support Agree, the article says it is false but then goes on to confirm that the pressure from the Biden administration to dismiss the prosecutor using economic extortion was true. This is extremely biased but what should we expect from Wikipedia? 2001:638:508:F003:D7AA:DA60:16DA:2D64 (talk) 12:08, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 July 2024
editThis edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Joe Biden himself is the most reliable source we shall take into consideration when committing this text. He did insist on firing Sorkin which he himself bragged about on the record. It is a serious allegation that this article must reflect and explain. 98.211.197.119 (talk) 23:51, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- Not done: Read the FAQ. – Muboshgu (talk) 23:55, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
New revelations in the Burisma case
editNew York Post: "Zuckerberg separately added that suppressing The Post’s exclusive report on Hunter Biden’s infamous laptop ahead of the 2020 election was a mistake.
He explained to the House Judiciary Committee, which has been probing Facebook’s content moderation standards, that prior to the decision to limit sharing of the bombshell October 2020 story, the FBI had “warned” Meta about “a potential Russian disinformation operation” related to the Biden family and Ukrainian energy giant Burisma, where Hunter sat on the board of directors... “It’s since been made clear that the reporting was not Russian disinformation, and in retrospect, we shouldn’t have demoted the story,” he acknowledged."
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I think in the meantime, "conspiracy theory" should be removed from the name of the article. Mhorg (talk) 13:41, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
- See WP:NYPOST. They are a terrible source.
- Meanwhile, the conspiracy theory isn't about the laptop or what social media did or didn't do with it. The conspiracy theory is the false idea that Joe Biden committed crimes involving Burisma when he was vice president. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:56, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
- "WP:NYPOST. They are a terrible source." Yes, but they are a great resource for comedy. They publish so many lies and exaggerations, and they pretend that they are not a propaganda resource. Dimadick (talk) 12:16, 28 August 2024 (UTC)
- It is not only reported by NYP, but by many others.
- CNN:[2]
Zuckerberg in the letter also said the FBI warned his company about potential Russian disinformation around Hunter Biden and the Ukrainian firm Burisma affecting the 2020 election. That fall, Zuckerberg said, his team temporarily demoted reporting from the New York Post alleging Biden family corruption while their fact-checkers could review the story. Zuckerberg said that since then, it has “been made clear that the reporting was not Russian disinformation, and in retrospect, we shouldn’t have demoted the story.”
Mhorg (talk) 17:40, 29 August 2024 (UTC)- What's your point? O3000, Ret. (talk) 17:51, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
- CNN is a fine source, but Zuck's comment doesn't change anything. The laptop doesn't have anything to do with Burisma. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:58, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
- "WP:NYPOST. They are a terrible source." Yes, but they are a great resource for comedy. They publish so many lies and exaggerations, and they pretend that they are not a propaganda resource. Dimadick (talk) 12:16, 28 August 2024 (UTC)
- Agree, this has enough truth to it to not be a conspiracy theory 2001:638:508:F003:D7AA:DA60:16DA:2D64 (talk) 12:09, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
- It is not an acceptable source and the laptop has nothing to do with Burisma anyway. O3000, Ret. (talk) 12:28, 3 September 2024 (UTC)