Talk:Bank robbery

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There's always things like the IRA robbery too. Not exactly sure what should be added here; significance/motivation/punishment/methods? Aanghelescu 06:42, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

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What about bank burglary, such as the Dinisio heist in California?

I agree, i think a separate page on bank burglary could be made. Darkwolf228 (talk) 22:58, 9 June 2009 (UTC) ÁÉ

I don't know, but burglary isn't robbery. Joey Q. McCartney 07:54, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Burglary is something like robbery.burglary is like when you break into ones house.

The difference between robbery and burglary has nothing to do with violence, it is to do with access.

Robbery is taking something that is not yours from a place where you are entitled to be. Walking in to a bank during opening hours and asking for the money is robbery.

Burglary is gaining entry to somewhere you are not entitled to be. Breaking in to a bank when it is closed is burglary. Cottonshirt (talk) 06:16, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Good Work Cleaning up the Article

Just saying thanks, the article looks much nicer than when I edited it last week. Algophobia (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 03:30, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Not all banks have armed security guards

I think that this page should mention that not all banks in all countries have armed security guards. I know that at least here in Canada, security guards aren't allowed to carry guns or other weapons. Flea110 20:20, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Researching crime studies would be a great start

...If anyone has time. Joey Q. McCartney 07:54, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Yes, indeed. I caught this line in the article:

"A 2005 study by Pastore and Maguire found that injuries occur in about two percent of bank robberies in the US, and about six percent of robberies in Australia, and that a death occurs in approximately one third of all bank robberies"

If a death occurs in 1/3 of all bank robberies, it begs to reason that more than two percent of bank robberies result in injuries, no? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.85.31.248 (talk) 05:59, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

---Since this came up on a msg board I frequent... The correct death rate should be 0.3% not 30%. Maguire & Pastore's actual numbers can be found at: http://www.albany.edu/sourcebook/pdf/t31512008.pdf http://www.albany.edu/sourcebook/pdf/t31492008.pdf --Anonymous Coward

Most Dangerous?

I do not agree that takeover robberies are the most dangerous type of robbery. In takeover robberies, the robbers are usually professionals or have planned their robbery, whereas a one-man robbery may be spontaneous and violent.

Why is the article for such a worldwide subject so U.S.-centric?

I agree, extremly US-centric, but then I don't have the knowledge or time to expand Mattlore 10:11, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Yep, way too much focus on America. How do you put something up for the systemic bias thing?HichamVanborm 01:59, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Incorrect description

This article is plain silly. Having done bank robberies and done prison time for it.. I will advise you to put away the DOJ handbooks and crime reports as they are fiction. The entire criminal justice system is fable ridden as far as bank robberies go. Like for instance a common occurrence. A guy gets nabbed for a bank job. He has done say one or two others, told his girl and she snitches him off. When he talks to the feds, because he isn't serious, but really scared, he tells them "I have done 3." and they say "we have film of you doing 12." they show him the film, it's not him... they don't care. He pleads and gets a lesser sentence as long as he lets them clean up their books. As for methods the MOST dangerous robberies are cowboy jobs where the robber runs into the bank and tries to take it over after it has been opened. This is dangerous due to the uncertainity of what can occur combined the personality or state of mind that it takes to do this. Imagine... You run into a room of say 8 people screaming with a gun... Statistically someone is eventually going to snap and do something unexpected. These are the situations where cocaine cowboys start shooting.

There are the following types of robberies:

1. Note jobs. Guy walks in and hands a note for cash. If he is smart he goes to a commercial till. If he is not he goes to a regular. They rarely are armed. They often serialize this. They average a grand. Might hit 20 or 30k with a good commercial till. Can you say drug addicts and the like. Usually loners, sometimes they might have a driver.
2. Cowboys. They either run in and announce themselves or slide in. Either way they will brandish or display a firearm. They will hit more than one till, but will strike so quickly they miss the majority of the money there. They are the fools who put everyone at risk and usually are on such a rush, the money is almost secondary. They can pull a hundred k but will average between 30 to 60k. Sometimes they work in groupsd, sometimes not.
3. Takeovers. The feds classify cowboys as takeovers simply because they announce their presence. A true takeover is where all parties in the bank are accounted for and secured prior to the money being taken. Takeovers come in a variety of methods. There are several methods out there that regardless of the security steps taken by a bank are tough to defeat. The bank is stuck in a no win. They have to seem open and friendly, not armoured vaults. Takeovers with a brain will always hit the vault. The fiction and urban myth spread by movies like point break are just that. If the bank is controlled-take over completely, there is no 3 or 5 mninute timelimit. 15 minutes is not uncommon. This will almost alway be crews that do this. Watch HEAT. It is flawed, but on many levels the most realisitic movie ever made on the subject. The job that goes bad is a cowboy job... not a takeover... why? They did not secure the bank. As I am not trying to write how to notes, but just correct some errors, I will leave it at that. A takeover should net between 150k to 500k.

The real threats to the modern day bank robber are not DNA, Cameras, SWAT teams or the like, but rather misinformation spread by the media and people who can't keep their mouths shut.

If you want to grasp bank robbery, methods and results, look at the architecture of the banks in question. Everything one needs to know is right there in front of you.

Contradiction

This article lists two separate events as being the first bank robbery in America. Which is correct? Sloverlord 10:29, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

In the introduction, the article says "In foreign countries bank robbery is high but in the U.S. only six have been successful." Later on, it claims that "Bank robberies are still fairly common and are indeed successful, although eventually many bank robbers are found and arrested."

"A bank robbery occurred just under every 52 minutes in 2001 . . . The clearance for bank robbery was 57.7 percent in 2001." Source: http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_02/html/web/specialreport/05-SRbankrobbery.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.27.111.125 (talk) 14:17, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

1798 bank robbery amount

The phrase "which was a very large sum of money at the time" strikes me as rather ambiguous and unencyclopedic. It also ignores the fact that 162 grand is still a pretty decent chunk of money. All that said, I'm going to go ahead and replace this phrase with another one which specifies the amount in 2006 dollars. 69.94.199.146 02:12, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Sections

This article needs more wiki internal organization through sections. I suggest that a section on 'robbery prevention' be created and include the content from safecatch that I recommended be merged into the article. Eliz81 04:25, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Safecatch merge

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the merge proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the merge proposal was do not merge.

Someone posted a merge notice on the safecatch page, suggesting it be discussed here.

• Just posting to say I Oppose merging the two. Anchoress 21:59, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
• SafeCatch is a new and powerful robbery deterent concept that is not based on new technolgy that can be learned and overcome or expensive physical deterents like bullet resistant Lexan or man traps. It is a new way branch staff operate and take controle of their environment, a new business model that delivers both high robbery deterent and great customer services at the same time. Due to the importance of this new idea developed by Larry Carr of the FBI and the need for it to be recognized in the US and across the world, it should stand alone untill it gains the required critical mass. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paulseibert (talk • contribs)
• Oppose Not only should it not be merged, I'm not even sure it's notable. Ewlyahoocom 06:36, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose although it might be worth a mention if a Bank Security section is made for this article. Algophobia (talk) 03:35, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

this is not an article about bank robberies this is about bank robberies in america —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.103.129.103 (talk) 07:54, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Deleting History

I have deleted all the "History" section about the break-in at the Temperance Hall Association because it was about a burglary, not a robbery. There probably is room in Wikipedia for at least one article about burglary from banks, but this is not it, which is why it is called Bank robbery. Cottonshirtτ 11:21, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

FDIC involvement

Contrary to the current version of the article http://en.wiki.x.io/w/index.php?title=Bank_robbery&oldid=523063380 , the FDIC does not cover robberies. http://www.fdic.gov/consumers/consumer/information/fdiciorn.html Does anyone have a good reason to cite for bank robbery being a federal crime? Epimetheon (talk) 17:59, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

Globalize tag (Nov 2017)

Hey @Pburka can we get some more details on this globalize tag. Back in May 2017, I removed a globalize tag from this article after several major revisions. At the time, the article was clearly written as if from a US legal perspective. Now, the article seems to feature history, studies, and statistics from numerous countries. Anything about the US is clearly labeled as such. Admittedly, a lot of sources surrounding the phenomenon of bank robbery seem to revolve around the US but I think fair effort has been made to include everything available. Do you have any specifics on changes you'd like to see improved? Thanks Scoundr3l (talk) 22:07, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

When you say there are statistics from numerous countries, I assume you mean Australia and Britain. Apart from the 'Overview' section, the article is about American bank robberies. We've got the first bank robbery in the US, bank robberies in the American frontier, getaway cars in California, and historical American bank robbers. Where's the famous 1907 Tiflis bank robbery? What about the biggest bank robberies in history, which took place in London, Fortaleza and Baghdad? The prevention section is almost entirely about US banks. Even the 'Film' section only mentions one non-American film (and doesn't even mention the first such film, The Bank Robbery (1908)). This article suggests that bank robberies a distinctively-American activity, but they happen world-wide? Pburka (talk) 22:32, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

Yes, several examples of statistics from England, not to mention getaway cars in Paris. The history section is all well sourced. Surely you're not faulting the history of bank robbery, or bank robbery films no less, for taking place largely in America? Do you have contradictory sources for the first bank robbery? They'd be welcome. In the history of banking, I sincerely believe there was another first, but the sources speak for themselves. And what exactly would you like included about Tiflis? For one, it was a stagecoach robbery (specifically omitted, per the opening paragraph) and this is not an indiscriminate list of famous robberies, but an attempt to list historical firsts. What can we fix other than what the sources say? Scoundr3l (talk) 22:53, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

I've got some material on the way re: other country firsts and famous robbers. I'm also gonna re-remove the intro bits about federal crime in the US or at least broaden it. I'd like to include something about the 1907 film, but I haven't looked yet and I'm not gonna drop a red link unless I've got something to say. Thanks for the feedback. Scoundr3l (talk) 23:02, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure the 1831 robbery was the first in the US. It would be very surprising if there are no robberies between the Amsterdam Wisselbank's 1609 establishment and 1831. Pburka (talk) 23:17, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

Surprising indeed. But you let me know if you find anything. I started cleaning up this article about a year ago and it might surprise you how shallow the history books are. Scoundr3l (talk) 23:27, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

From a cursory examination of the sources, it seems like there's a particular fascination with bank robberies in the United States, possibly related to the rise of robberies during the Great Depression and the cultural myths built up around famous robbers at the time, such as Bonnie and Clyde and John Dillinger. Outside of the US, I think bank robberies may be less romanticized, and perhaps are treated more like any other robbery. (Although robberies in general may still be romanticized, e.g. Great Train Robbery). It may make sense to include some background on this in the article, to justify why the history section is so heavily tilted towards a US perspective. Furthermore, I think the pedantic focus on robberies (as opposed to burglaries, stagecoach thefts, armored car thefts, etc.) detracts from the article. It's difficult to write about the history and significance of a phenomena when we arbitrarily limit ourselves to one form. The general reader, I think, wants to know about thefts from banks (but probably not frauds). Limiting ourselves to a strict definition of robbery is inconsistent with how most sources cover the material, and, I think, inconsistent with what readers will expect. Pburka (talk) 15:54, 4 January 2018 (UTC)

Yes, I found that as well. I actually began editing this article with the intention of expanding the history prior to and outside the American frontier/depression-era, but the sources were pretty mum. It would seem the phenomenon of bank robbery itself begins and centers mostly on America and only the last few centuries. Romanticization is definitely a factor, but it's also fair to say that America was just a place where bank robberies often happened. Chicken and egg, I suppose. But this article does make several allowances for "not technically" robberies, such as Carpenter Hall. I am also planing to add the Bank of Australia robbery, which tunneled into the vault. As a rule of thumb, I'm usually ok with it as long as the public (i.e. sources) refer to it as a robbery. Within reason, of course. I think too much creep of stagecoach and train robberies will drift far and away from what the public thinks of when they think "bank robbery". Expansion to come as soon as I have time, though please let me know if you have any other ideas. Scoundr3l (talk) 23:03, 4 January 2018 (UTC)

Burglary, Not Robbery

This article begins by correctly defining the difference between burglary and robbery. Surprisingly the rest of the article incorrectly describes burgalries as robberies.

At first, that may not seem significant, but it is. Robbery is more violent and personal because it is when you hold up the persons themselves. Burglary is when one steals without direct contact with people. It matters because they each have such a different nature about them, with robbery being a fearful and often violent event.

It is my understanding that in the United States the first actual bank robbery was committed by Jesse James on 02/13/1866 at the Clay County Savings Association in Liberty, Missouri. All previous events had been burglaries until then. 2600:100C:B231:17E8:45EE:D3C8:4FCB:BDA1 (talk) 04:09, 22 February 2024 (UTC)