Talk:American Athletic Conference

Endowments and rankings

A few small issues:

• In the current table, what are the "Conference Rank" and "National Rank" columns ranking? From looking at the table, it's clear that it's not endowment, nor is it U.S. News ranking. This needs to be addressed or the columns need to be removed.
• I'm assuming the "Percentage Change YOY" is referring to the endowments, but what is YOY?
• The U.S. News ranking for Memphis needs to be addressed in a footnote. I'm assuming "205–270" does not mean that the school is ranked 205 through 270, so does this reflect two campuses with separate rankings?

City boy77 (talk) 02:38, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

• The National ranking seems to be inappropriate for this use - especially since it varies widely from the rankings derived from the US News&World Report. Since these are all colleges/universities in the United States, I think they should be sorted by US News&World rank, not Shanghai. There is also no citation for the established national rank. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.143.123 (talk) 19:39, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Not a continuation of the "old" Big East?

What's the basis for that conclusion? Because I've got (emphasis mine)

The "old" Big East remains housed in an office building next to the Amtrak station in Providence. That league will unveil a new name in the next month or so and be led by such schools as Connecticut, Cincinnati, Memphis and Southern Methodist. The basketball schools purchased the rights to the Big East name, its logo and will even retain the basketball record books.

http://news.providencejournal.com/sports/college/2013/03/big-east-unveils-new-structure-in-new-york.html That very much suggests this isn't a brand new conference, but rather a continuation of the previous one (which ceases sponsoring football, sheds the AAC members, etc) Green-eyed girl (Talk · Contribs) 23:31, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Well, what happens to baseball,softball, golf and the other Olympic sports records?.......Pvmoutside (talk) 23:46, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

I don't know. Do you? Obviously basketball is the highest-profile sport of this conference, and the one that will get the most news coverage. Green-eyed girl (Talk · Contribs) 00:07, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Nope, guess we'll just have to wait......It will be interesting to see where the Rutgers mens lacrosse team goes next year, as well as the field hockey and/or womens lacrosse teams of UConn, Temple, and Cincinnati the following year....... Pvmoutside (talk) 00:51, 17 May 2013 (UTC) The way in which sources seem to be considering this event, and the way which makes the most logical sense, is that this is a split into two daughter conferences, each of which retain some connection to the old Big East conference. There is the "new" Big East conference (the Catholic 7 plus a few new schools) which retains the name, and the use of MSG for the basketball tournament, and the American Athletic Conference, which gets the rest of the schools, the old Big East Commissioner (Michael Aresco) and the Football status of the old Big East (including the AQ bid to the last remaining year of the BCS before the playoff takes hold). There isn't a clear single successor, and there are also clear connections between the two new conferences and the old Big East, so the Wikipedia articles should reflect this (admittedly somewhat complicated) reality. --Jayron32 03:37, 17 May 2013 (UTC) Retrieved from "http://en.wiki.x.io/w/index.php?title=Talk:Big_East_Conference_(2013)&oldid=555460678"

Bad name choice

The choice of the name and the insistence of being called "The American" seems to have been badly thought out and, perhaps, a bit of an ego trip. It has been suggested that the choice was made for the simple reason that "Conference USA" was already taken by the organization that most of the members of the new conference had left behind as somehow inferior to where they are now or plan to be in the immediate future.

Some people insist on using "AAC" in referring to the new group, claiming that, "everyone is doing it" even though an honest examination of a web-search for "AAC basketball" or "AAC sports" or any similar "AAC this-or-that" DOES, in fact, bring millions and millions of returns, BUT that the HUGE majority of those returns are NOT for the "American Athletic Conference" but, rather, for the "Appalachian Athletic Conference" or the "American Airlines Center" or the "American Alpine Club" or "Associação Académica de Coimbra" or the "Atlanta Athletic Club" or a couple dozen other options just here in the Wikipedia.

I have previously suggested that we wait and see how this shakes out before adding a conference "nickname" or short form to this article, but one unidentified, unregistered user insists on repeatedly adding the AAC tag, claiming that "all the networks and ESPN are doing it." I will, once more revert that user's latest edit with a request to come here for discussion. Perhaps we can then come to a consensus. GWFrog (talk) 12:41, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• I agree that we should wait before adding a nickname or short form to this article. I think it should apply to both "AAC" and "The American." References to either should be removed for the time being. City boy77 (talk) 14:27, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• Looks like this piece in USA Today settles it. Key quote: "Beyond the challenge of avoiding something that looked corporate, the league also couldn't build the logo around an acronym. From the very beginning, the conference office has been adamant that it wants to be known as The American instead of the AAC to avoid confusion with the Atlantic Coast Conference." HangingCurve^{Swing for the fence} 14:45, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• • I don't think it really matters what the conference says it wants to be called. What matters is how the media and spectators refer to the conference, and it's too early to tell. I still think we should give it some time. City boy77 (talk) 15:18, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
    • Actually, it does matter, as it will have a big influence on what media outlets deem acceptable on second reference at the very least. Take it from a journalism major. HangingCurve^{Swing for the fence} 16:39, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• Sorry GWFog, I don't edit that often, and I didn't know about Talk pages. Anyways, I kind of agree with all that is said above. I was just trying to add the acronym, because it is used in a lot places, and wanted the article to get picked up by it for search engines. I think the issue is that the conference did say in that one release that they want to pick their own nickname. Who picks their own nickname? :) I see AAC used on most college sports sites. I saw an article on NCAA.org this week (http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2013-06-11/new-american-athletic-conference-puts-mens-hoops-tournament-m) - if you look at the side for "Latest Articles" even the NCAA abbreviates it down to AAC - "Memphis to host first AAC tournament in ’14." Honestly, I think the issue boils down to the litigious society we live in - here is part of an interview with commissioner: CBSSports.com: What about calling this league "the American"? Who came up with that and how important is that to identifying and rebranding this league? MA: We felt this was a solid, durable name. I suggested that we didn't want to be the AAC. I realized that could cause confusion with the ACC, and I didn't want to pretend to be something that we're not. We wouldn't want to be accused of encouraging that kind of confusion in any way. I think they are just making sure they don't get sued by the ACC by saying we want to be known as something totally different. Anyways, I'm not making any further edits about it. I think we'll know for sure what is going to stick in a few months. - p — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.176.125.163 (talk) 20:14, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Population

Propose on population to use Metro area rather than city. Most metrics will be based upon Metro such as TV viewership. Only change if there is consensus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jleipold (talk • contribs) 23:21, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable to me... GWFrog (talk) 01:38, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

I agree that this makes more sense, considering the metropolitan area shows the true market. --Bobster687 (talk) 17:58, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

"Big East Conference"

The usage of Big East Conference is under discussion, see talk:Big East Conference (2013–present) -- 65.94.79.6 (talk) 01:12, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Does the AAC have automatic bids to the NCAA tournaments in sports they sponsor?

^^ topic. 173.160.130.14 (talk) 02:45, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Yes, as the legal continuation of the Big East Conference (1979-2013). GWFrog (talk) 03:31, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

College basketball team navboxes

Please join discussion at the College Basketball Wikiproject for forming a consensus on the creation of a basic navbox for college basketball teams. CrazyPaco (talk) 06:15, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

lacking a conference football champions article

FYI, this conference does not have a List of American Athletic Conference football champions article, as seen for many other FBS conferences in Category:Lists of college football conference champions. It would be much appreciated if anyone would like to take up the project and create this article. Cheers, UW Dawgs (talk) 15:06, 7 September 2016 (UTC)

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Locations map is incorrect

The Locations map in the sidebar should include Maryland, since Navy is located in Annapolis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.2.235.85 (talk) 21:13, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

UCF Football National Championhsip

In the "NCAA team championships" section of this article, please stop adding UCF's football national championship as FBS football is outside the scope of NCAA competition. No other conference article includes FBS championships in this section. When in doubt, refer to the top of that section that says "Excluded from this list are all national championships earned outside the scope of NCAA competition, including Division I FBS football titles..." Esb5415 (talk) 18:56, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

Also it is basically a self-awarded title, claimed by fans who are upset just because their school went undefeated against a cupcake schedule and think that somehow qualifies them as good as other schools who ended the year with a loss against a much more rigorous slate of opponents. Good removal. --Jayron32 02:28, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

FYI, the NCAA did officially recognize the championship in their media book for the season, as UCF was ranked No 1 in one of the NCAA recognized final polls, which is their current requirement. Mjs32193 (talk) 17:18, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

I'm not here to argue if UCF's national championship is legitimate, as it as already been discussed | here. My point is that FBS titles are outside the scope of NCAA competition and so should not be included in the "NCAA team championships" section of this article. Esb5415 (talk) 17:24, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

The NCAA has no control over the "College Football Playoff," which is a private organization. It is no more an NCAA championship than the AP poll title. The NCAA recognizes multiple selectors to award national titles and lists such in their official record book. For the Football subheading, the NCAA official record book is the only authoritative source for determining national championships. UCF is so recognized in the NCAA record book, and it should be indicated as such for the Football subheading on this wiki. CitrusCritter

FBS football is outside the scope of NCAA championships. While the NCAA lists champions from other selectors as championships, they are awarded outside the NCAA. You said it best that "It is no more an NCAA championship than the AP poll title." Which, the AP poll title is not an NCAA title. As such, don't put it in the table and don't edit the article. Esb5415 (talk) 19:46, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

For reference, see this article https://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/College_football_national_championships_in_NCAA_Division_I_FBS Esb5415 (talk) 19:49, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Then there should not be any national championships listed under the Football Subheading. The ones listed there were not granted by the NCAA either. The only way to be consistent is to simply deny that any FBS national titles exist or to refer to the NCAA Record Book, which is authoritative on the matter. http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/football_records/2019/FBS.pdf - page 117 of PDF document clearly indicates that the NCAA recognizes UCF's national championship. It is no different than the SMU national championships recognized on this page, which were not granted by the NCAA but also by recognized selectors.

I also note that https://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/College_football_national_championships_in_NCAA_Division_I_FBS says: "Because there is no one governing or official body that regulates, recognizes, or awards national championships in college football, and because many independent selectors of championships exist, many of the claims by the schools listed below are shared, contradict each other, or are controversial.[5][6]:107–119 In addition, because there is no one body overseeing national championships, no standardized requirements exist in order for a school to make a claim on a national championship, as any particular institution is free to make any declaration it deems to be fit. However, all known national championship claims are for seasons in which a national championship, or share of a championship, was believed to be awarded to that particular school by at least one independent third-party selector." And then lists UCF as having a national championship awarded by a third-party selector. CitrusCritter

Again, I am not doubting that UCF had a national championship in 2017. The point is, as you say, they are third party selectors. The top of the table even says "Excluded from this list are all national championships earned outside the scope of NCAA competition, including Division I FBS football titles". FBS titles, while listed by the NCAA, are not sponsored by them. I agree that it would be appropriate to include this information in another location, but that table is for NCAA awarded titles. Stuff like AIAW titles, while claimed by the school, are not designated by the NCAA as NCAA championships. If you want, you could create a second table for championships awarded outside the scope of the NCAA. The SMU championships in football are not in that table - their four championships are in golf and track and field. Esb5415 (talk) 20:08, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Actually, looks like we are arguing about different things. My bad! lol. Esb5415 (talk) 20:10, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I was about to point that out. I definitely agree that the football championships should not be listed as NCAA championships. But to be consistent and to rely upon an authoritative source to ensure Wikipedia: accuracy, the UCF championship should be recognized and listed in the column. It is granted by a third-party selector the same as SMU's 3 championships and Navy's 1. CitrusCritter

Locations Map Incorrect Once Again

UConn left the league in July, and the map still shows Connecticut as a member of the league. NJ Jurrjens (talk) 17:32, 7 October 2020 (UTC)

Orphaned references in American Athletic Conference

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of American Athletic Conference's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "endowment":

• From University of Cincinnati: Retrieved June 18, 2023. "Audited Financial Report 2022" (PDF). Retrieved June 18, 2023.
• From Rice University: As of June 30, 2020 U.S. and Canadian Institutions Listed by Fiscal Year 2020 Endowment Market Value and Change in Endowment Market Value from FY19 to FY20 (Report). National Association of College and University Business Officers and TIAA. February 19, 2021. Archived from the original on February 21, 2021. Retrieved February 19, 2021.
• From Georgetown University: As of June 30, 2022. Georgetown University Consolidated Financial Statements (Report). Georgetown University. Retrieved December 10, 2021.
• From Vanderbilt University: Lorin, Janet (September 23, 2021). "Penn Endowment Posts 41% Return, Buoyed by Stock Market Gains". Bloomberg. Retrieved October 8, 2021.
• From University of Alabama System: As of June 30, 2021. U.S. and Canadian Institutions Listed by Fiscal Year 2020 Endowment Market Value and Change in Endowment Market Value from FY19 to FY20 (Report). National Association of College and University Business Officers and TIAA. February 19, 2021. Retrieved February 19, 2021.
• From Virginia Commonwealth University: As of June 30, 2021. U.S. and Canadian Institutions Listed by Fiscal Year 2020 Endowment Market Value and Change in Endowment Market Value from FY19 to FY20 (Report). National Association of College and University Business Officers and TIAA. February 19, 2021. Retrieved February 19, 2021.
• From Conference USA: As of June 30, 2020. U.S. and Canadian Institutions Listed by Fiscal Year 2020 Endowment Market Value and Change in Endowment Market Value from FY19 to FY20 (Report). National Association of College and University Business Officers and TIAA. February 19, 2021. Retrieved February 19, 2021.
• From Florida International University: "Miami Today". August 28, 2008. Archived from the original on February 2, 2009. Retrieved August 28, 2008.
• From Southern Methodist University: As of June 30, 2020. Southern Methodist University Investments Office (Report). Southern Methodist University. September 28, 2021. Archived from the original on September 28, 2021. Retrieved September 28, 2021.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. Feel free to remove this comment after fixing the refs. AnomieBOT⚡ 10:30, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

This robot deleted about a dozen footnotes from this article. Was that expected? @Mattdaviesfsic: the robot's fixes were in response to referencing errors that one of your edits created. Did you expect the removal of all those footnotes? Should they be replaced? @Anomie: can you explain the bots actions in tihs change? Why was it necessary to delete those footnotes in order to "fix" them? -- Mikeblas (talk) 01:01, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

Those {{efn}} calls were equivalent to <ref></ref> due to being screwed up by a human in the previous edit. Such empty tags result in errors like , so the bot removes them. When the error was due to vandalism or human error, the bot's edit should be reverted along with the human's. Anomie⚔ 02:24, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

Removing them is the wrong call, since they can be trivially fixed. The bot made a mistake and nobody monitors it; subsequent changes have been made so it's not easy to revert the bot's unhelpful edit. Is your reocmendation that we proceed by manually replacing the footnotes? Or is there some way the bot can clean up the damage it did? -- Mikeblas (talk) 21:57, 21 July 2023 (UTC)