Talk:Tyramine

Cleanup

Hi, I have had a go at cleaning up tyramine but appart from a lack of references (in particular in the last paragraph - we need to track down the "recent review article") I cannot see very much wrong with it. Could you give me more information on what you think is wrong with the article? Cheers, Andreww 09:58, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

The main thing is, it's really two independent chunks of text, with little to connect them. The second and third paragraphs say pretty much the same thing in two different ways, and the only section that covers restricted tyramine diets (only in passing) is the fourth, which is a solid wall of text poorly formatted for online reading.

I'm also really curious about where the material from [1] and [2] came from. My suspicion is that we technically shouldn't be using the last two paragraphs at all, and ought to rewrite them entirely. ‣ᓛᖁᑐ 12:09, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Citing a study that shows the absence of an effect should also give some indication of the power of that study, such as the number of participants. It's possible for a small but sound study to not detect a small effect. --122.107.243.206 (talk) 06:24, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

Hello. I noticed that the pronunciation on this page doesn't match that which is correct according to the Oxford Dictionary (/ˈtʌɪrəmiːn/). Would it be all right to change it? thanks151.236.224.84 (talk) 11:26, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Octopamine

I suspect that tyramine is not "degraded to octopamine" look at the structures; I think that the second paragraph should be cut out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Threelegduck (talk • contribs) 02:31, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Octopamine is degraded from tyramine, however the article states that octopamine does not activate alpha or beta adrenergic receptors, which is untrue. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.155.243 (talk) 02:26, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

Trivia

In Silence of the Lambs, at one point Hannibal Lecter talks about eating the liver of a census-taker, along with "some fava beans and a nice Chianti". I stumbled across this article and found it interesting that all three of these foods are listed as containing tyramine. Is there a deeper meaning in this? Was the author including a little in-joke for psychiatrists? My post is probably a waste of time, but I just thought I'd share this with y'all in the hope that someone else finds this as interesting as I did. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 16:49, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

I was wondering the same thing myself. The author might very well have done so; he includes quite a few obscure references -- the following site catalogs some of them:

http://silence.hannotations.com/ Afalbrig (talk) 13:09, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Acting so, Hannibal Lecter demonstrates he's off his medication, because he doesn't get a cheese effect taking in all this tyramine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.119.66.183 (talk) 13:00, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Merge from foods containing tyramine

Given that this article already has a brief "occurrence" section that lists foods containing tyramine, I think we can condense the multi-section format of foods containing tyramine and bring it into this article. --McGeddon (talk) 11:47, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

I support the merge, no need for a separate article Maen. K. A. (talk) 16:40, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

I prefer keeping them separate. Some people (including me) just want a list. 220.233.208.223 (talk) 08:20, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

support the merge--7amada'sback:) (talk) 19:00, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

• No merge'. A chemical compound and foods containing this compound are different subjects.Biophys (talk) 13:56, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

No merge - both articles are useful separately and would be too large as one. 25 Feb 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.196.120.74 (talk) 03:33, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

• No merge'. I would never have found the topic against food if the subject had been merged under Tyramine. —Preceding unsigned comment added by J'ai osé (talk • contribs) 10:46, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Synephrine

Synephrine is a drug, it's not a naturally occuring neurotransmitter. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.33.90.100 (talk) 18:16, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

If you want to be taken seriously, you are advised to back up your claims substantially.

As for the subject matter of the comment: Synephrine is a part of the biosynthetic pathway of the cathecolamines. It is clearly a naturally occuring compound.

I will remove the dubious tag from the relevant section of the article. Please comment here if this is opposed to.

Thank you.

Spectralyst (talk) 03:08, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Physical effects and pharmacology section

Firstly, thanks to Jytdog for cleaning up garbage from this section. However, the section is still a mess and would benefit from being taken care of. I have made an effort to restructure and source some of the material contained, but have left the paragraphs on medical effects to be evaluated by someone better qualified.

Additionally, I reinserted parts of the paragraph on migraine interaction as it is seemingly adequately sourced. Please state your case before removing this section again.

Further, I would like to propose a split of the section into two seperate sections Pharmacology and Physical/Biological/Medical effects, and expand on the Pharmacology section to include more in depth information on pharmacodynamics and pharmacokinetics. However, time restrains currently prevents this from being done by this user.

Thank you and good night.

Spectralyst (talk) 19:54, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Questionable section on foods containing tyramine

There are no citations for the foods containing tyramine section and there are numerous modern studies that contradict the information in this article, showing that very few foods contain a significant level of tyramine and that people taking maoi's can eat foods like chocolate, pepperoni, many cheeses and drink alcohol without issue.

I myself am on 90mg Phenelzine and I have no pressor response to large amounts of alcohol, pizzas with the meat toppings mentioned in this article, chocolate, and cheeses like cheddar, if the information in this article was true I would have died from a hypertensive crisis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.225.64.61 (talk) 02:09, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

I noticed an ambiguity which I think is potentially misleading, also in the 'Occurrence' section: it states tyramine is found in alcoholic drinks, but according to other websites I've checked, it is absent from distilled alcoholic drinks such as vodka. I'm afraid the best source I could cite for that is WebMD - I'm not sure whether that's considered a strong source to cite? Also I was wondering about the above comments about chocolate etc (unfortunately the edit was from an unsigned IP, but still, it's a pity nobody has addressed these directly...?). PaulineDataWard (talk) 18:33, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi @PaulineDataWard

That part was compiled form diet-targeted sources (structured as donts and dos in food preferences). For encyclopedia purposes one may delete all claims starting with "Lower in tyramine:", the article wouldn't suffer from that. By the way, yeast -- e.g. as food supplement or fermentation starter -- isn't mentioned in the list. Tosha Langue (talk) 13:49, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

The last item on the list is "Foods high in MSG" and the source is a paywalled Encyclopedia Brittanica article, and it looks like it's actually on a different page than the one linked, it seems to be a blurb extracted from the "mental disorder: Antidepressant agents" article (also paywalled). I am personally very skeptical that a broad category like "foods high in this one amino acid that's not the amino acid this article's actually about" is a useful thing to include in this list without a lot of extra information. Or better sources. Speculation: tyramine shows up in the abstracts of papers studying chemically-induced headaches almost in the same sentence as MSG in lists of things reported to cause migraines. I suspect at some point "MSG-rich foods and tyramine might both be triggers for migraines" morphed into "tyramines are in MSG-rich foods". Here's an example of what I mean: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8681169/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3302666/ . "Tyramine is high in foods with lots of MSG" seems to be an unsupported assertion as the article stands. I suggest removing this entry from the list. Dinferno (talk) 01:40, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

@Dinferno, I agree. This item is as funny as a suggestion that gin, rum, and vodka may contain any of tyramine. And as I said previously, I would remove all "lower in tyramine..." sentences. Because the article is not about Low tyramine diet; it is sufficient to avoid the higher in tyramine food. I find that not ethical to point at specific food in a such way: "Some meat products are lower in tyramine: fresh or frozen meat, poultry, and fish; eggs", while the source makes disclaimers: "Ensure proper handling, storage and refrigeration of protein rich foods (e.g. meat, poultry, fish, eggs, and dairy products)" and many other things to follow. Moreover, it seems that the topic is wider than tyramine and MAO-inhibitors. See Management of chronic headaches, section Changes in diet. Tosha Langue (talk) 06:31, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Broken link

The link for reference 17 "Tyramine-restricted Diet 1998, W.B. Saunders Company." is producing a '404 page not found' error. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PaulineDataWard (talk • contribs) 18:27, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Tyramine and pancreas enzymes

An IP-user pointed (https://en.wiki.x.io/w/index.php?title=Tyramine&oldid=1149220164) at the questionable statement (that pancreas enzymes of the body can reduce tyramine formation) as misleading. He or she changed the statement, and it became:

The body may be able to reduce tyramine formation by trypsin and chymotrypsin, digestive enzymes in the pancreas, however the evidence for this has only been proven in the lab not in any living creature(No studies yet in rats, humans etc. only in a test tube).

References

I have removed the whole statement, because the authors of this research modeled the food system, not the body system. You may say that after all the body can prevent formation of tyramine by its (the body's) trypsin and chymotrypsin... However this function of digestion is not a tyramine-specific strategy. Viewing from this angle, it is a side effect of the main goal to break down polypeptides into amino acids. Time of food residing in the body before it starts to reduce tyramine formation is relatively short (compared to shelf life), and if tyramine is there, it is too late... Tosha Langue (talk) 10:17, 11 April 2023 (UTC)