Talk:True and Living Church of Jesus Christ of Saints of the Last Days

And

True and Living, or True & Living?

Ah. Good point. The sign says "and". Tom Haws 14:42, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)

Interesting things noticed in the A&E special

I noticed in watching the A&E documentary Inside Polygamy, I saw that the Assembly Hall had over the door "Holiness to the Lord, House of the Lord". Do they use this building as a Temple in the traditional LDS sense? Also, I saw that they have a small Baptismal font, and in the tile work, I saw an L and V, which I assume are the sign of the Square and Compass. I would like to know if anyone knows about these details. Bytebear 21:26, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

L and V and baptismal font

The L and V were actually symbols used in Mormon garments at one time, standing for "Liberty" and "Virtue." Additionally, they are related to the Masonic symbols of the square and the compass. The book "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View" and some others go into greater depth on the subject. For the rest of your questions, I think you'd have to ask them.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Iconian (talk • contribs) 05:27, 26 September 2006

Category:Apocalypticists

I'm not convinced that this church is any more "apocalyptic" in its views than most of the Latter Day Saint churches. Apocalypticism is certainly not the primary focus of the group. Those who left the church claimed that Harmston prophesied that Christ would appear on March 25, 2000, but the accuracy of how that was reported is now highly contested by Harmston and the church. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 04:29, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

The New York Times Magazine disagrees with you. The stated reason for excommunication was "preoccupation with armaggedon" Greg Bard (talk) 04:31, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

What's the reference? I don't see it in the article. The Sunstone article has quite a bit of detail. They are more focused on original temple ceremonies and plural marriage than anything to do with end times. Most Latter Day Saint churches teach it is the "latter days"—hence the name of the movement. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 04:37, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Ah, I see it now. It was a weird citation format with the title listed only. It's from 1998; there's been quite a bit of water under the bridge since then. In today's context, I think it would be considered controversial to refer to the church as an "apocalypticist", given what has happened. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 04:42, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

We don't have a "former apocalypticists" category, and that would be pretty silly. When the date comes and goes, we still call them "apocalypticists." Greg Bard (talk) 04:46, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Well, there's some question as to whether "the date" was ever set as some claim it was. Some of this came out in the docs from the trials. It's a bit more complicated than a one-paragraph NY Times Magazine article makes it out to be, but I realise WP often can't handle the nuance, especially when it comes to categories. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 04:48, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

OG, I agree completely with the sentiment of your last statement. Greg Bard (talk) 04:56, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Since there's a reference that says it, I agree that it should probably stay. I think my background knowledge was just getting in the way of the usual way to proceed. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 04:57, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

New Leader

Has anything come out on the new leader of the True and Living Church of Jesus Christ of Saints of the Last Days. Harmston died last June. Surly they have a new leader by now.--ARTEST4ECHO (^talk/_contribs) 16:10, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed

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