Talk:Nike-X

Zeus EX

The article currently contains a section titled 'Zeus EX'. The term 'Zeus EX' is introduced in the second paragraph. The only source provided for this second paragraph is ABM Research and Development at Bell Laboratories, Project History, page I-41. Page I-41 of this source does not use the term 'Nike EX'. This page is part of 'Part I: History of ABM Development'. The term 'NIKE-X' is used there, but not 'Zeus EX'. If no reliable source can be provided for the term 'Zeus EX', I will remove this section. - Crosbie 12:14, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

I checked the other reference in this section, page 10-1 of the same report, in support of the claim 'In the highest layers of the atmosphere there simply isn't enough matter for this to occur, and the x-rays can travel long distances. Enough of these hitting a re-entry vehicle can cause damage to its heat shields.'. The referenced page does not mention heat shields. This material was contributed by User:Maury Markowitz in this edit [1]. There is a serious problem here with references not checking out. - Crosbie 12:32, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

Perhaps you could take the time to type "zeus ex missile" and "abm xay heat shield" into google before removing perfectly accurate material? You'll find that both "issues" are already covered in references in the article. So if you really feel these "serious problems" need to be addressed, by all means, add another SFN to any of the multiple excellent suitable refs already there. Start with Bethe, for instance. Maury Markowitz (talk) 14:39, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

The serious problem to which I refer is that you made claims in this article for which you provided inline references which do not check out. - Crosbie 20:33, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

And I provided you with ones that do, specifically Gawrin/Bethe p. 25, and, for instance this. Now you can continue complaining about these "serious problems" I'm causing and continue to be part of that problem, or you can insert them or any others you like into the article and be part of the solution. We're here to improve the wikipedia, not debate it. Maury Markowitz (talk) 23:21, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

In your comment, you have provided a Google books link to Johnson, McNamara, and the Birth of SALT and the ABM Treaty 1963-1969 - this is published by dissertation.com - this is a self-publishing service. The link you provided is to self-published material - it is not a reliable source. - Crosbie 04:12, 9 June 2015 (UTC)

So are you admitting there is a reasonable cite available for the heat shield issue? Please be clear. Maury Markowitz (talk) 10:49, 9 June 2015 (UTC)

No cite for the claim that X-rays damage re-entry vehicle heat-shields has been provided. The current reference provided in the article, page 10-1 of the Bell labs report, does not support the claim that X-rays damage re-entry vehicle heat-shields - there is no mention of heat shields on this page of this report. I have marked this claim as having failed verification. - Crosbie 18:14, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Gawrin/Bethe p. 25. I've pointed to this three times now. Here, I'll quote it: "If the explosion is outside the atmosphere, the X rays travel unimpeded to their target. On striking the RV(3a) they are absorbed by and intensely heat a thin layer of the RV's heat jacket. This creates a shock front that travels through the jacket (3b, 3c) an may cause the jacket to break up or detach from the RV." Maury Markowitz (talk) 23:30, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

I see that now. Thanks. - 05:07, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

Not to put too fine a point on this, but after five of these contentious "I'm going to delete!" issues, you've been wrong on every one. Perhaps you might take the time to actually read the references before making these posts? I suspect you will find them as interesting as I do, and as most of these issues are already covered, you can just fix these "serious problems" yourself. Maury Markowitz (talk) 14:11, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

This is not the forum to discuss my conduct. As you have criticized my conduct in this particular public forum, I note here that your criticism is incorrect. - Crosbie 15:29, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

LOLZ, sure. Maury Markowitz (talk) 16:00, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

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A reference to the historical context would help IMHO

Nice technical site with a history of the programme. May I suggest linking in a reference to the [SALT I [2]] treaty that limited ABM sites to one each in the USA and USSR.

86.185.35.194 (talk) 08:46, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

That is covered pretty well in the next article in the series, Sentinel. It was during Sentinel that the first steps to SALT were taken. Maury Markowitz (talk) 11:16, 14 June 2018 (UTC)