Talk:Multiplayer online battle arena/GA1

GA Review

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: David Fuchs (talk · contribs) 17:05, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

In progress. Look for a review by next weekend. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^talk 17:05, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

In the meantime, EchoBlu, reverting perfectly fine edits is not the way to go. It wasn't a major edit regardless. soetermans. ^{↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK} 11:18, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Same as this edit. It's just minor work, but it fixes style errors, incorrect Wiki mark-up and link fixes. That's also needed to pass GA. But having edited it twice now, it still needs work. There is a citation needed tag from November 2016 and I've tagged two more. soetermans. ^{↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK} 11:36, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

This was article before my contribution: September 2019 I can't make everything perfect, so I asked here for suggestions (from people who are best in their job). I expected initial review from GA reviewer. You can feel free to improve this article to GA status after review. EchoBlu (talk) 19:32, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Also, you said that "I reinstated a bunch of incorrect stuff". "Bunch"? EchoBlu (talk) 19:58, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

"Incorrect"? Well, I don't know if it's incorrect or not. -iaspostb□x+ 06:51, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

My comments are as follows:

• Lead:
  • I'm not really sold on the use of "notes" here, especially as they assert facts that are thus not referenced. If the fact that Arena of Valor is an international adaptation of Honor of Kings (2015) for markets outside mainland China isn't important enough for the body, I'm not sure what very useful information it's providing down there.
    •  Done I have moved that part to the article body. EchoBlu (talk)
  • If you're reading this as a casual person who doesn't know anything about the genre, I think there's going to be some issues that crop up. "usually on a map in an isometric perspective."—what's an isometric perspective? It doesn't seem that relevant considering it's not actually mentioned in the article body. (MOS:LEAD).
    •  Done Removed from the lead section. It's not a defining characteristic of MOBA. EchoBlu (talk)
  • "The ultimate objective is to destroy the opposing team's main structure"—what structure? We haven't mentioned there are structures. I'm not sure why "game" is put in scare quotes for Aeon of Strife.
    •  Done Removed "the" and scare quotes. EchoBlu (talk)

• Body/Prose:
  • Prose isn't really there yet. You've got a bunch of sentences that just run on or string half-thoughts into comma-spliced, opaque sentences, e.g. Defense of the Ancients (DotA), a community-created mod from 2003, that includes a map based on AoS for Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos and Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne, was one of the first major titles of its genre and the first MOBA for which sponsored tournaments have been held., followed by It was followed by two spiritual successors, League of Legends (2009) and Heroes of Newerth (2010), and eventually a standalone sequel, titled Dota 2 (2013), as well as numerous other games in the genre, such as Heroes of the Storm (2015)., and Defensive structures, which are usually automatic "towers", are in place to prevent this, as well as relatively weak computer-controlled units, called "minions", which periodically spawn in groups at the base and marching down predefined paths (called "lanes") toward the enemy base..
    •  Done All of the three sentences have been rewritten. Additional clarification added. EchoBlu (talk)
  • Wordy sentences could be pared back and made clearer, e.g. In 2018 alone, the prize pools reached over US$60 million, which is about 40% of the year's total esports prize poolsin the same year
    •  Done EchoBlu (talk)
  • Likewise, there's issues with shifting tense throughout. We start off the DotA mention with past tense (was) but we shift into perfect progressive (and the first MOBA for which sponsored tournaments have been held.) when you could just simplify to were held or similar.
    •  Done EchoBlu (talk)
• Media: Media looks fine and appropriately licensed.
  • Checked

• References:
  • The article has big issues assuming knowledge and writing checks, making generalities about mechanics that the used references can't cash.
    • Each match starts with two opposing teams, typically made up of five players. Players work together as a team to achieve the ultimate victory condition which is to destroy their enemy's base[6] though some games have the option of different victory conditions.—cited to [1] and [2]. First off, the Dedimedo source is clearly not a reliable one, and the sources together don't mention that MOBAs usually have five players, or can cover the claim that the most common victory condition is to destroy the enemy base.
      •  Done Source updated to cover both claims; replaced with more reliable source. EchoBlu (talk)
    • The following passage make direct quotes of "towers" and "minions" despite the fact the Shacknews article used as a reference never uses that terminology.
      •  Done Additional source added that contains direct quotes of "towers" and "minions". EchoBlu (talk)
    • Other content is just straight-up not cited at all, e.g. Heroes typically fall into one of several roles, such as tank, damage dealer, healer, and support, each of which having a unique design, strengths, and weaknesses., a huge chunk of the rest of that paragraph, the paragraph two from that, etc.
      •  Done Significantly improved source coverage of the mentioned paragraph; added missing source in the second one. EchoBlu (talk) 13:22, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
  • A large chunk of the references used in the article have been discussed by the VG wikiproject and found to be unreliable, including Gosu Gamers and Dexerto. Others haven't been sufficiently discussed but don't appear to meet requirements, including Fanbyte, Diehardgamefan, etc.
    •  Completed  Note: Citations in the article have been significantly improved. Several references, including Gosu Gamers, Dexerto, Fanbyte, and Diehardgamefan have been replaced with higher quality sources. Further suggestions are welcome. EchoBlu (talk) 06:02, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

Given the weaknesses of the article, plus the instability of recent history, I'm failing the article at present. I strongly suggest rewriting the article from the top down to make sure it is properly referenced throughout. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^talk 21:35, 30 August 2020 (UTC)

@David Fuchs: I read all your suggestions and made improvements as mentioned above. Further suggestions are welcome. Thank you for the review! EchoBlu (talk) 13:22, 5 September 2020 (UTC)