Talk:Michael Alig

"Angel" Melendez?

The article states that Melendez's nickname was Angel...rather than his real name. (There's quotation marks.) Everywhere I've looked says that Angel is Melendez's real name. I'm removing the quotation marks. Does anyone have a source that states otherwise? Long Away May (talk) 18:54, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

His real name is Andre as shown by the source in the article -- Esemono (talk) 14:54, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Citation needed?

There are an awful lot of "citation needed" markers, one after every sentence in some sections. Are these facts really in dispute, or is someone playing games? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.191.24.137 (talk) 12:42, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Most of the info in article is based on someone watching the fictionalized story of Michael Alig in Party Monster (2003) and then adding info from the movie into the article. The movie Party Monster (2003) can't be used as a source so the info has to be confirmed from other sources. -- Esemono (talk) 14:54, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

To clarify, the documentary movie could be used as a source if the material is in that but the feature film based on the book and documentary likely was fictionalized in parts so by itself is not reliable. The article could certainly used more sources and there are plenty out there as the case has been covered extensively. Benjiboi 20:55, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

OLD POST, BUT: WHICH DOCUMENTARY IS THE PERSON ABOVE REFERRING TO? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.138.95.59 (talk) 15:50, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

I just saw an "American Justice" episode on Michael Alig (non-fiction investigative TV show), and the facts presented there differ from this article. In short, I agree that the current article may be based on fictionalized information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.251.103.204 (talk) 00:12, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Part of the problem is there are actually TWO "Party Monters": Party Monster: The Shockumentary in which Alig stars as himself; and Party Monster (2003 film) in which Macauly Culkin plays as Alig (but the latter is "based on" Alig's life, and is thus fiction. Wheras the former could be used for sourcing, since Alig appears as himself in the film (alongside other sources, of course); the latter cannot be used adequately as a reference. (Except in so much as it states that the movie was "based on" Alig's life, but it cannot be used for anything further.) 24.33.248.110 (talk) 20:03, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

another 'in popular culture'

the owen book "clubland" (isbn 978-0767917353) is another popular culture appearance. Rmd1023 (talk) 03:46, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

wording in the lede is confusing

The second portion of the lede sentence is a tad bit confusing: "Michael Alig (born South Bend, Indiana, April 29, 1966) is the co-founding member of the notorious Club Kids, a group of young clubgoers led by long time best friend James St. James and Alig in the late 1980s and early 1990s."

Can someone fix this? Thanks. 70.61.247.31 (talk) 18:03, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a story-book (or in this case, a movie turned story-book)

This part reads too much like a Murder Mystery novel, or a rehashing of a scene from the fictional movie Party Monster....

"Then according to Freez he hit Melendez a total of three times on the head. Then Alig grabbed a pillow and tried to smother him.[8] When Melendez was unconscious Freez went to the other room and when he came back he noticed a broken syringe on the floor. However, Alig's story was that he injected Angel with Drano, while Freez claims that Alig poured it down Angel's throat and duct-taped his mouth closed.[8] After a few days, the body began to smell. Alig injected himself with heroin, cut the legs off the corpse, and stuffed him in a box and afterward threw the corpse into the Hudson River."

Can we add somethings like "Such and a Source states that, Mendezes head was struck three times by a blunt implement" and/or something like "Official Court Documents state that Alig also attempted to suffocate Mendez with a pillow." 70.61.247.31 (talk) 18:19, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree. Nearly five years later and this article still reads like a story. Lara 17:25, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

Shampoo Horns

In 1998, the deceased Spanish film director Manuel Toledano released a movie called Shampoo Horns with a story line related to Michael Alig's case. The interesting thing is that he himself appears in it briefly. I am guessing it was shot before his conviction but I can't find anything on the net, only the IMDb page. I don't know if it is important but nonetheless interesting to know he appeared in a movie. If anyone has more information and can put it in... Thanks. --Nauki (talk) 09:30, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

Puffery

Wikipedia is not a repository or publisher of promotional materials. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS) (talk) (contribs) 17:32, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

I've reverted your edits, which did not improve the article. Please get a consensus from the editors on this talk page for the changes you wish before you restore them. BMK (talk) 19:31, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Discuss

why you keep reverting my edits. Use words, please. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS) (talk) (contribs) 16:11, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20141221102048/http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/celebrity/michael_alig/15.html to http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/celebrity/michael_alig/15.html

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Infobox

It appears that the infobox is a little confused and has info both on Alig as an artist/personality and as a murderer. Since most of the infobox is about the murder, it may mislead casual readers. For example, it says he was active from 1984 - 1997, but that actually represents his time as a club kid, not as a murderer. There are two ways to resolve this, as I see it. This only effects the infobox; I'm not suggesting deleting anything about the murder from the body of the article.:

• Remove the information about the murder from the infobox and present him just as an artist and personality in the infobox. This is consistent with examples such as Phil Spector.
• Delete the "years active" information and make the infobox about him as a murderer. This is consistent with the Jared Fogle article. (yes not a murderer, but a known celebrity personality who went to prison for serious crimes). ^†Basilosauridae❯❯❯Talk 17:43, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

As no one responded to this discussion, I have chosen to remove the "years active" info as it was the action that required the least amount of change. If you feel differently, lets discuss. ^†Basilosauridae❯❯❯Talk 23:17, 1 September 2018 (UTC)

Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion:

• James St James, Ingrid LaLa.jpg
• Michael Alig and Jason Chaos.jpg
• Michael Alig artshow.jpg
• Michael Alig hosting virtual party.jpg

You can see the reasons for deletion at the file description pages linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 07:07, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Michael Alig June 25,2015.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 19:52, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

Reason for changing the lead sentence

User:Emem1138, I disagree with your edit, which you've made twice, to the lead sentence of the article. It had read, accurately, "Michael Alig ... was an American club promoter and convicted felon." You changed it (with a misleading edit summary) to "Michael Alig ... was an American club promoter, artist and Individual who was Formerly Incarcerated." There's nothing wrong with adding that he was an artist, as, according to the body of the article, he was one, but I disagree with replacing the concise "convicted felon" with "Individual who was Formerly Incarcerated". First, I don't know what the capital letters are for. Second, it seems as though you're whitewashing his situation. He was a felon, a murderer. He was convicted for it. Your version makes it sound like his incarceration was something passive that happened to him, independently of anything he might have done. What was your intention? I'm inclined to change it back. Largoplazo (talk) 23:46, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Hello. I changed it for a couple of reasons. But first, I am not whitewashing Angel's death in the least. However the phrase Formerly Incarcerated or Individual who was Formerly Incarcerated is the actual Legal term used here in NY to describe someone who has been convicted of a crime and was incarcerated for it. The state passed this legislation last year and the governor signed it into law. That is one reason. Another is he was Not convicted of murder. It was in every sense or essence of the law Manslaughter. I knew Michael. And no I am not condoning what he and Robert did in the least. However much of the narrative in the form of crime docus and movies are one dimension and in some inaccurate. Yes he had his dark faults, and like I said I am not condoning what happened. However, did you know he addressed the state legislature and assembly post release detailing the debacle of solitary confinement and received standing ovations. I work in reentry and activism to end mass incarceration. No one, and I mean no one has gotten a standing ovation on the solitary confinement issue since then. And there have been some powerful speeches. And I took am formerly incarcerated, I am a Survivor of Domestic Violence for which I was criminalized for. Translation: my abusive ex husband committed a larceny for which I was blamed and arrested for. I got an obnoxious bail and a crap load of attorneys. So I took the plea for went to prison, here in NY. And played their little game and came home. I had my short time in solitary too. And I am Not just "someone who took the rap when he scummy ex set her up for a crime he committed " and by the way I couldn't have implicated him, or divulged that he had done it and I had no knowledge of it, which I did not until I was arrested. The ada had threatened to charge me with conspiracy and That comes with a state mandatory minimum of 15 years in prison. So I did what I had to do to come home. And I work tooth and nail so it doesn't happen to someone else. Michael was the only one who knew a correction officer raped me at knife point. He talked me down from nightmares and panic attacks and understood how I felt and my pain. We are not just the one bad mistake or whatever one wants to call it. So I changed the beginning to read what legally describes what he andnro Emem1138 (talk) 13:32, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Emem1138 (talk) 13:45, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Sorry I messed up there. What he and Robert did. The capital letters are because I was writing like I talk. Prison did not just happen to him. And anyone who has either been there or has been impacted in other ways, I.e the mothers and fathers, children and spouses of those incarcerated understands. However the disaster of our so called justice system here does no justice to the victims and survivors of the crimes or to those incarcerated and impacted. Eileen Emem1138 (talk) 13:49, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Is this pic ok to use?

File:Michael Alig's ICU Party flyer.jpg

... Jamplevia (talk) 11:27, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

Since no one has written anything, I'm going to ask James St. James on X (twitter).

-- Jamplevia (talk) 15:27, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

James St. James isn't the arbiter of what's OK to use in Wikipedia articles! If you specifically mean, to get his permission, his permission is irrelevant unless he holds the copyright to the posters in the photo. Copyright and fair use are complicated and I'm not going to get into them here. See Wikipedia:FAQ/Copyright. If the posters aren't yours and you don't have permission from the copyright holder to use them and they don't qualify under fair use, then the photo should be deleted.

As for whether I think the photo would be a good addition if it does qualify for inclusion: yeah, possibly. Largoplazo (talk) 22:42, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Do you think that I made a baldface lie about asking for permission on X (twitter)? Not only have I been using computers for 48 years, I've lived through the wild-west of the early Internet and on top of that I was a very minor club kid too, mostly in DC but with several excursions to NYC. Too bad timing is everything. I only showed up in the Limelight when he wasn't around. But his account did not reply. He only "liked" it. Who actually owns the rights to those flyers anyway?

-- Jamplevia (talk) 00:44, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Not to get weird (HAHA) but I happen to be celebrating Saturnalia 2023. Saturn is my god of lead poisoning and baby I have it bad.

-- Jamplevia (talk) 04:30, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

I didn't say anything resembling a suggestion that you were lying.

The rights would have been held originally by whoever created them or the organization on behalf of which they created them. Largoplazo (talk) 11:02, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Is there a Michael Alig foundation yet?

-- Jamplevia (talk) 00:45, 21 December 2023 (UTC)