Talk:Lord Gordon Gordon

incidents

The article currently describes a "first major incident", leading me to expect other numbered incidents to follow. But there is no list, no further use of the word "incident". Am kinda focused on this word as it appears in DYK nomination. doncram (talk) 18:50, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

I've tried to improve the article so it uses the word "Incident" more times. I hope this is better. ISD (talk) 19:29, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Heavy reliance on Carl Sifakis article

The primary source for the current wikipedia article about Lord Gordon-Gordon appears to be an article about the man in the book Hoaxes and Scams by Carl Sifakis, published in 1993. But this source isn't listed. The wikipedia article condenses and shuffles Sifakis' words enough to avoid outright copying, but the echoes of Sifakis are evident. For instance, Sifakis writes: "In supposed gratitude Gould presented Gordon-Gordon with $1 million in negotiable securities and cash in what was called 'a pooling of interests.' In other words, a bribe." In the wikipedia article this becomes: "Gould agreed to help him, on the condition that he gave Gordon-Gordon $1 million in negotiable stock in what he called, 'a pooling of interests': i.e. a bribe."

Another example. From Sifakis: "Gordon-Gordon, still posing as a personage of high blood, convinced Canadian authorites that Gould and the Minnesota railroaders were smearing him because he declined to invest in their lands. He proposed instead to buy his needed acreage in Manitoba, sums that would bring great prosperity to Canada." The Wikipedia version: "Gordon-Gordon took this opportunity to flee to Canada, where he convinced authorities that the allegations brought against him were false. Gordon-Gordon then offered to buy large parts of Manitoba; an investment which would bring prosperity to Canada."

A second issue is that Sifakis' article itself isn't very reliable, since it provides no references, and it makes some incorrect claims. So it's not a good choice to serve as a primary source. For instance, Sifakis describes a lavish farewell party hosted by Gordon-Gordon before he shot himself. This simply doesn't appear to be true. At least, the claim should be referenced, and contemporary newspaper accounts contradict it. And yet Sifakis' claim is faithfully reproduced in the wikipedia article as fact.

Basically, the entire wikipedia page about Lord Gordon-Gordon needs to be cleaned up. It should probably be rewritten from scratch. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alexboese (talk • contribs) 17:52, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

I created this article and I have never even heard of Carl Sifakis or the source you speak of. My main source was Brewer's Rouges, Villains and Eccentrics. ISD (talk) 20:42, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Then the article relies too heavily on "Brewer's Rogues," which I'm guessing relies very heavily, in turn, on the Sifakis article. Though I haven't seen the article in "Brewer's Rogues" to confirm this. Otherwise how to explain the striking similarity between the two articles? Same phrases used, same mistakes made. Just about every sentence in the "Career in North America" section reads like a slightly reshuffled version of Sifakis. For instance, Sifakis writes: "Brought to trial in March 1873, Gordon-Gordon made an imposing figure as he reeled off names of important European personages he was supposedly representing in the Erie deal." The wikipedia version is: "Gould sued Gordon-Gordon, with Gordon-Gordon put on trial in March 1873. Gordon-Gordon gave the names of his European personages in court, whom he claimed to represent, and was granted bail while the references were checked."Besides the similarity of the "European personages" phrase, both make the mistake of saying the trial was in March. It was actually in April. Another example. Sifakis writes: "The affair grew into an international incident, with the governor of Minnesota ordering the state militia to full readiness and demanding the return of the kidnappers. Minnesotans by the thousands volunteered for a military invasion of Canada." The wikipedia version is: "This led to an international incident between the United States and Canada. Upon learning that the kidnappers were not given bail, Governor Horace Austin of Minnesota demanded their return and put the local militia on a state of full readiness. Thousands of Minnesotans volunteered for a full military invasion of Canada." Again, both articles use the same phrases and make the same unsubstantiated claims. For instance, what evidence is there, from primary sources, to indicate that thousands of Minnesotans volunteered to invade Canada? Or did Sifakis simply make this up? And sources from the early 20th century indicate that it was actually Minneapolis mayor George Brackett who made the threats to invade Canada, not the Governor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alexboese (talk • contribs) 14:40, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Death Why is he listed under 1873 deaths rather than 1874? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.32.242.5 (talk) 15:38, 2 January 2021 (UTC)