Talk:Company scrip

Source for Mexico de Wal-Mart?

The only websites that support the claim about Mexico de Wal-Mart all seem to be based on one source, jurist.law.pitt.edu. The link on that site to the press release is broken. Does anybody have an independent verification? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.135.67.203 (talk) 04:34, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

NEED to expand this article

Hey there, I am creating an article on Coal Scrip and it is awaiting review. If it is determined that muy article could be used to expand this one, I hope thats fine. HOWEVER, I have a question. The current artcile is a post structuralist socialist descriptor I read in grad schiool, this is not an encyclopedic work. I dont care what the politics are, really, most of my ancestors used scrip and some died in the mines. The deal though is, wwe need to define what the scrip actually is as opposed to how it was (and I agree by the way) used to treat people like animals. So Hope this gets to the folks who monitor the articleCoal town guy (talk) 13:13, 17 July 2012 (UTC)

A lot of this material seems to be copyright.

"©1996-2013 Wisconsin Historical Society 816 State Street, Madison, WI 53706" Andyohio (talk) 06:04, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, and its NOT NeutralCoal town guy (talk) 12:23, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

I have rewritten the section. The only piece that seemed to have any opinion (to the positive) at all on this was the bit about workers using scrip for lumber purchases. I have made that clearly attributed to the Historical Society.Capitalismojo (talk) 18:23, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

No, they did indeed use govt issues currency and scrip. In most cases scrip was a credit against accrued wagwes. Some were paid in scrip. However, NOT in totum. This is documented in the National Scrip Collectors Association Cat by EdkinsCoal town guy (talk) 18:32, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

The section doesn't say that they were only paid in scrip. Where do you see that? Capitalismojo (talk) 18:35, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

I agree that the the scrip wasn't in totum. If you have a RS (and I believe the National Scrip Collectors would be) you should add something.Capitalismojo (talk) 18:38, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

I can speak to coal scrip, but as to lumber scrip, NSCA has another set of volumes on the topic. The section in question states that there was a preferance....This cant be claimed as some of the locations (those in WV for sure) had banks. Ergo the argument that currency was in low supply would not work. See coal scripCoal town guy (talk) 18:41, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

With all due respect, this isn't an argument I am making. This is history. In fact this is the Wisconsin Historical Society, the official state government historical agency. The Historical Society is also the state historical repository and archive. It holds much of the personal papers and the corporate records of the state's early lumber companies, among other things. It has a full collection of the state's newspapers from territorial times on. It holds the state government's archives. It publishes the state's lone historical magazine. I think we can safely say that it is reliable about the history and hence that the scarity of currency in the forests is accurate.Capitalismojo (talk) 23:27, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

As to banks. The mere existence of banks does not imply the existence of ready cash. (see also Depression (economics), Great Depression) Be that as it may, I collect some Wisconsin lumber company scrip. As I understand it, the companies generally issued these in logging camps as settlement was just beginning in Wisconsin and in company towns duringthe bust part of boom and bust cycles. Capitalismojo (talk) 23:34, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

With all due respect, you are incorrect. Basic finance, Banks assets are not ready cash. A banks assets are what it lends and its proportion to cash reserves. This been a fact for a few thousand years, great depression or no. As to Wisconsin, thats fine as well. I am rather familiar with lumber camps, and coal camps. I prefer to write about coal camps. Hence my user name, Coal town guy. The article is not about Wisconsin Lumber camps, its about Lumber camps, which, in Wisconsin, and PA, and WV and KY and OH and TN were a precursor to feed a coal camp. Its a fact, has been and will be. And there are a few people, with lots of letters after their names, who publish this data. The onus of proof lies with you. The logic is simple, the scrip was used to force loyalty. The stores maintained a freakish mark up on their merchandise. It favored the worker running low on funds and using scrip which by fiat meant, they had to be in that store. Having cash, was fine, but, sorry, the store was not a boom or bust cycle at all, it was part and parcel of maintaining a population of peope who worked the mines. If you cant feed a miner, they starve, Staving people die. Dead peoople cant mine or cut lumber, thats also a fact. Look up William Tams and as you collect, Exonumia is very specialised, even a state historical society will not have that data in totum. I collect as well. Its a rewarding hobby. Coal town guy (talk) 00:35, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Well in Wisconsin in the late 1800s and early 1900s lumber camps rarely had banks. When lumber camps became lumber towns they often developed banks. Those banks often, and I do mean often, failed during the bust cycles. This happened because of a lack of cash. The point about the Wisconsin Historical Society is about Reliable Source. It is reliable. I have added material with reliable source, I have fulfilled the "onus". You haven't yet added source and material. I invite you share your sources that talk about the vast flow of ready cash through the forests of early American settlements. I will be truly interested in reading it. Seriously though, I added one brief section. If you have anything sections to add please be Bold. This article is still too much of a stub.Capitalismojo (talk) 02:26, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

A word about food. On the "sawdust trail" lumber camps clearcut the pineries. That land was then farmed, initially by the lumber companies themselves to feed (and supply work horses) to increasing numbers of logging camps. This seems different from the mine experience. Lumber companies fed their men directly in the camps at large cookshanties. (Later, as the edge of the forest receded and the logging camps followed, the farms and cleared land were sold to settlers.)Capitalismojo (talk) 02:26, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Most importantly this article is about company scrip not about company stores or the truck system. Company stores existed without company scrip. The "forced loyalty" bit you talked about could and did exist in the absence of scrip. All it required was putting workers into debt to the company. That could be through debt to the company store, company housing, company hospital, advances on wages, etc.Capitalismojo (talk) 03:00, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

In all candor, I agree with you. Albeit, I have lived in a few coal camps, rather, the death throes of a few coal camps. I have just over 2,300 (articles) instances of being bold. Most are coal camps in the US. My only peeve, or rather objection as an editor is that I agree, this could be a fantastic article, it is imbued, hindsight with lots and lots of myths, created by people who want to understand the subject, and do so by sticking it in an experience they find comfortable. I am not saying this to you specifically. I did not say that there was an abundance of cash, I said there was cash. History is in some way, supposed to be an accurate reflection of the past, but as I have tried many many many times to brig up FACTS about the actual environment where scrip is issued, I am told, to source it, which I did in the coal scrip article. I have tried afew times to make it known, that this article and few others in the mining culture are in some ways, in no way an accurate reflection of what was there. AND that is buttressed by facts, refs, etc etc. How do you want me to help? I am willing to do so, openly, BUT that means that this artycile will need some radical changes......Coal town guy (talk) 12:55, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Refs, we can do this

OK, looks like alot of refs .......actually its alot of refs to one source, that can be fixed, busy tonight, but will fix.Coal town guy (talk) 23:41, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

PART 2. Find the Amazon book and then the ISBN. THEN check out how to cite a text, with the ISBN so a reader can find the book by the ISBN alone, not by shopping on Amazon. Wiki is not an amazon sales place and refs like this will make it look that way. I can help here as well. I am familiar with the works of Greene, he is a socialist, and is NOT a balanced view UNLESS you supply another. AGAIN, this article is NOT neutral. AND, you have to get more data than Wisconsin...there were lumber camps on the whole planet. Try looking up Lumber camps in generalCoal town guy (talk) 23:53, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Merge?

Shouldn't this article, and Coal Scrip also, be merged with Scrip, as a section? It seems very redundant. 70.198.137.84 (talk) 23:28, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

That is a logical thought, I would however caution that its not all the same thing, there are many variants of company scrip and in some instances, they are an artifact to specific communities. The usage of the truck system, while accurate is a POV. There are actual instances where there were no other forms of currency and a such, scrip was used. PARTIAL SUPPORT, as long as the history is researched and not littered with unbalanced views...The current Company scrip article needs a hell of alot of work. It uses one industry heavily and as such, is not that accurateCoal town guy (talk) 21:33, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Merge does not mean butcher data to fit the schema of an article, merge means integrating the data into the article and advancing knowledge, content and why NOT actually improve the overall article??? Coal scrip was a separate article because the company scrip article was riddled with a POV with no refs. PARTIAL support was given with the naive proviso on my part that the data would not get replaced with a POV......SO, again, edit away, BUT if you remove refs and massage it to make it work, REGARDLESS of accuracy, UH NOCoal town guy (talk) 13:35, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Roblox, Robux, and Dev Exchange

Can someone (I presently lack the tone of writing, or any citation or formatting know-how whatsoever), classify Robux as this? It's the only thing Roblox pays its developers in, with an incredibly low equivalent in USD according to Roblox's own exchange system. Not only that, but the requirements for doing that terrible exchange are ridiculous! I would add it myself if I was any better at writing stuff like this. Phcgamer (talk) 14:23, 4 August 2022 (UTC)