Talk:Census Designated/GA1

GA Review

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Nominator: Locust member (talk · contribs) 02:02, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: CatchMe (talk · contribs) 01:01, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

Taking this. Glad to see some movement in music noms (mainly old ones) due to the Backlog Drive. This seems interesting and... she was inspired by Ethel Cain? I will be reviewing this for sure. CatchMe (talk · contribs) 01:01, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

Yes, me too! I've been noticing a lot have been under review. Thanks for taking this on; definitely an interesting album and story behind the album from one of my favs. Locust member (talk) 01:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box

Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Well-written

Lead

• I think the lead is too detailed.
• The previous album receiving critical praise doesn't seem to be relevant here.
  • Y
• I would say: "After coming out as a trans woman and changing her stage name, Remover started working on Census Designated inspired by..."
  • The way this is worded makes the sentence run on quite a bit. I changed it to "After releasing her debut album Frailty in 2021, Remover came out as a trans woman the following year and changed her stage name. She started working on Census Designated after being inspired by a self-described "near-death experience" that she encountered while on a road trip through a blizzard."
• Shouldn't "blizzard" be linked?
  • Y
• The tracks receiving numerous revisions doesn't warrant a standalone sentence, consider changing to: "Going through numerous revisions, the tracks were recorded..."
  • Y
• "It was promoted with four singles" - There's only two in the infobox.
  • Another editor changed this, I'm not sure why. I reverted it though.
• "It also charted on the" - "The album charted on the" since the previous sentence was about a single, and the album didn't chart elsewhere to warrant an "also".
  • Y

Background

• "Jane Remover released her debut studio album Frailty during November 2021" - "in November 2021", as it was released once.
  • Y
• About the Fantano mention throughout the article, is it appropiate here? I mean, I wouldn't put him in the same level as Pitchfork or Paste really. WP:FANTANO isn't quite clear though; there is "rough consensus" on both positive and negative aspects...
  • His opinion on this album constitutes WP:DUE weight and adds another opinion to the article, while also helping describe songs in that section. His reviews are included in numerous other GAs. I can remove him from the background section about Frailty, but I would like to keep him in for this article specifically.
• "When she first started releasing music, she had always wanted to change her sound and wanted to" - remove the second "wanted".
  • Y I don't know how I didn't catch this jalopy sentence when writing
• "A month before Census Designated released, she moved to Chicago." - I don't see how this is relevant for the album, as it's not mentioned later or changed its course.
  • Y removed

Development

• Why are New Jersey and John Day, Oregon linked but not Seattle and Philadelphia?
  • Believe it would fall under MOS:OVERLINKING; they are both major municipalities (the most populous city in their respective states)
• "the snow became unbearable, and" - I think the comma is unnecessary.
  • Y removed
• "She wrote some of the songs at her house, some at school, and being on the road while she was on tour." - "She wrote some of the songs at her house, at school, and while being on the road as she was on tour."?
  • Y
• "She also said how a lot of it was written while being in a car." - Is this necessary? I mean, being on the road is most likely in a car.
  • Y removed
• "They are written about things Remover is afraid of happening instead of things that actually happened in real life." - Use past sense, since they are not still being written. Also, consider replacing one "happening"/"happened" to avoid repetition.
  • Y "They were written about things Remover was afraid of happening instead of things that actually occurred in real life"?
• "While writing and recording the album, she approached the process differently and experimented often." - Differently in comparison to what?
  • I remember it being differently when compared to her process in Frailty but I can't find anything in the Stereogum source. I think I forgot to add a source to the end of that sentence unfortunately, so I removed it.
• Consider spliting the sentence starting with "In describing the album as".
  • I just removed the first part of it; not really needed when looking back
• ""Lips" "served as a skeleton" - "The track "Lips" served as "a skeleton..."
  • Y
• There are a lot of quotes here; consider paraphrasing or even removing some of them. For example, I think ""suburban nightmare and macabre love"" is unnecessary detail.
  • Y paraphrased some
• "While speaking about"/"When speaking about" are so close to the other.
  • Y
• The sentence starting with "Remover cited the music" is so long. Consider spliting after "for material included on Census Designated".
  • Y

Composition

• Why are some genres more important than others?
  • If you're speaking about how I say "It is primarily shoegaze and post-rock", that is because more sources describe it as such. The other genres mentioned are only described by one publication.
• "It is an hour long" - Not exactly. "It is over an hour long"?
  • Y
• "Remover fears will materialize" - This is subject to change. "Remover feared would materialize"?
  • Y
• Again, consider paraphrasing some quotes.

Songs

• You could incorporate the Songs section under Composition as you do with other articles. It's not that large to warrant a standalone section and two subsections.
  • Y
• As an example of paraphrasing quotes, "Press-Reynolds put it as: "imagine My Bloody Valentine commissioned to soundtrack Fatal Attraction." could just be "Press-Reynolds perceived it as a combination between My Bloody Valentine and Fatal Attraction".
  • Y Let me know if you would like me to paraphrase more in this section.
• Since there are four consecutive post-rock tracks, you could begin that with "It is followed by four post-rock tracks".
  • Y

Promotion and release

• "however, the album features" - I don't think "however" is needed.
  • Y
• Was "Cage Girl" released as a B-side? Since the lead single is "Lips". If so, you may clarify that.
  • Just saw that was edited by other user some hours ago.. All previous songs are sourced as singles so it should be reverted.
    • Y
• Since there was only one release for the album, the Release history table could be incorporated here as prose ("It was issued through X formats").
  • Y
• When did the tour end?
  • Just changed to "throughout February 2024". It started and ended in February
• The chart should be mentioned.
  • Y

Critical reception

• Sorry, but again there's too many quotes here. And you should follow WP:RECEPTION.
  • Will get to this shortly
    • Let me know if this is good, I reworked it.

Verifiable

WP:RS

• I don't think Flood and Coup de Main are reliable/relevant.
  • I got Flood confused with The Forty-Five somehow, but I would like to keep Coup de Main in as it falls under WP:ABOUTSELF, as I only used information that Remover was describing about herself/her music.
• The same with Fantano, but awaiting for your response above.
• I have never seen Ondarock used before. And it's on several statements so how is that usable?
  • It is an Italian website that is used all over it.wiki. This discussion shows that they have an editorial team and is founded by somebody educated with a long background in journalism, and their editor has good credentials. There haven't been many discussions on it, mainly because it is just not an English website. On their website, it shows that they have a large editorial team.
• All the other sources are reliable.
• As I was told today, ""near-death experience"" should have a citation even in the lead per MOS:LEADCITE and WP:WHENNOTCITE.
  • Y reworded it as "she almost died" does this work? doesn't read how I'd like it to but I would rather a reword than a citation in the lead.
• Ref 5 needs |url-access=limited.
  • Y

No WP:OR, spot-check (with numbers as of this revision)

• Ref 11. First use verifies the "near-death" experience, second use verifies the album's concept. For the third use, the source says that it was the lead single, not third single.
  • I would like to talk about this; though "Cage Girl" and "Contingency Song" were released previously, should they be counted as singles? They both feature different versions on the album, and with this source saying it's the lead single, should I change the album to only having two singles?
    • Considering that the source is The Fader and not Billboard or OCC (see WP:SINGLE? note "a"), I would prefer keeping them as they are. If the same or other user change it back, then you should discuss it in talk or perhaps at the WP:ALBUM talk. CatchMe (talk · contribs) 04:09, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
• Ref 12. First use verifies the "near-death" experience. The second doesn't verify the sentence before, so just remove it from there since other ref does. Third use verifies the "reality check", fourth use verifies the album used a different version of the song, fifth use verifies the album's release date and label.
  • Removed it from the one you told me to.
• Ref 13. First use verifies where the songs were written, second and third uses verify Madden's opinion, fourth use verifies the cover description, fifth use verifies the interview thing. Y
• Ref 27. First and second use verify the text; however, this is close paraphrasing. Third use verifies the Lindert's opinion. For the fourth use, it says that it is as a single, but does not state its release date. You could also add "<ref name="pitchfork2"/>"; that one does.
  • Changed the first one to "deals with struggling with the present and being anxious about what is next in her life" since that is more of a summary? changed the second use to "chaos and noise"? and added in the Pitchfork citation. left in the original one to show that it is a single to verify WP:SINGLE?
• Ref 30 doesn't verify that Quadeca is "her labelmate". Other than that, Y
  • Removed labelmate
• Ref 32 verifies the tour announcement and dates. Y
• Ref 33 verifies the chart position. Y
• Refs 37 and 38 verifies the listicles positions. Y

No WP:CV

• Earwig's Copyvio shows Violation unlikely with the highest at 37.5% Almost all the similar text are quotes, I will check this again after the changes regarding these are done.

Broad

• The article addresses the main and relevant aspects of the topic.
• A few things fall under unnecessary detail, as mentioned above. This should be improved easily.
• I still think there's unnecessary details for the lead in the first paragraph. Only mention the previous album if Census Designated served as a follow-up. The coming out might be relevant here, but doesn't need it's own sentence as it seems like it had nothing to do with the album. This comes to mind: "It was released by DeadAir Records on October 20, 2023, as the follow up to her debut album Frailty in 2021. After Remover came out as a trans woman and changed her stage name, she started working on..." That she was inspired by horror movies also seems irrelvant here, at least for a standalone sentence. Let me know what you think.
  • I changed it to something similar you gave me, I think the horror movies is relevant as it inspired the content of the album. Let me know if you would like me to trim it more. I also made it say she came out as she was working on the album, as she started recording in February and came out that June.

Neutral

• This is neutral, yes.

Stable

• Other than the recent two unsourced edits, this is stable. I don't think this would happen again.

Illustrated

• Only one pic, cover art. I would upload that again with a PNG rather than a JPG, and citing Apple Music, since it's a better source than a dead Instagram link...
  • Apple Music also uses JPEG. I think the image itself is fine; Wikipedia would rather have low-qual regardless because of the non-free rule, but I changed the source on it.
    • I said that because I have seen more PNG files on GAs/FAs. You can convert a JPG to PNG and compress it in a site (I use this).
      • Y Changed
• Pics under Jane Remover Commons category don't seem useful so it's ok.

Overall comments

Will review the other criteria soon. CatchMe (talk · contribs) 04:50, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

I will put this  On hold until the issues raised above are resolved or discussed. CatchMe (talk · contribs) 05:57, 8 January 2025 (UTC)