Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2015 April 24

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April 24

Translation of Italian phrase "meno male"

How does the Italian phrase "meno male" translate to "thank God", when "meno" means "less" and "male" means "bad"? Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 02:56, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

"Male" is a noun. A better translation would be "less evil". It's an idiomatic phrase so a literal translation wouldn't work well. "Thank God" has a more direct equivalent in "Grazie a Dio" or "Grazie al cielo". --151.41.185.32 (talk) 03:49, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

An idiomatic equivalent in English might be "It could've [or could have] been worse". — SMUconlaw (talk) 07:54, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

And in the case of "meno male che ..." an acceptable translation would be "it's a good thing that ..." The double negative used in "meno male" can also be heard as a form of litotes (and that article even mentions it as an example). ---Sluzzelin talk 10:13, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, all. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 19:00, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Basic Grammar

On the test, there is a question where we have to fill a blank with the word starting with e.

The question went like this:

When I studied at the university, I studied very hard. But a lot of my friends did very little work. Some of us worked hard just e_____ to pass the exam, but others didn't. Fred was one of them. He spent more time drinking in the tea house than in the library.

The answer is *enough* but I'm sure it is wrong. Is it? If it is or is not wrong, why? Is there a better answer starting with the letter e? Please answer soon ><. Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Someone with a Question (talk • contribs) 10:31, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

To begin with, you said you're sure "enough" is wrong, but you didn't say why you feel that way. Care to elaborate?―Mandruss ☎ 11:16, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

-uh... I filled the blank in wrong on the test :P, Im hoping to get some help. Also, it doesn't sound right.

The sentence isn't great, but it's clear from here that the answer is intended to be 'enough'. The sentence would be better grammatically/idiomatically if it said 'Some of us worked just hard enough to pass the exam.' - Cucumber Mike (talk) 11:18, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Wait.. so there is nothing wrong with the question? It doesn't sound right :/. I know it is the intended answer but there is nothing wrong with it? Isn't just like a special adverb or something? It can be applied to enough? Thanks.

(edit conflict) It sounds okay to my American ears. Like others have said though, it's slightly awkward phrasing idiomatically. If I were to say it, I would say "...worked just hard enough..." though I'd understand it both ways. Dismas|^(talk) 14:05, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

'hard just enough' is not nearly as idiomatic as 'just hard enough'. The question reads like it may not have been written by a native speaker. AlexTiefling (talk) 14:04, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

I agree there's a problem with "hard just e______" vs "just hard e______" if the word in question is supposed to be enough, but I also see another possible problem, which entails a very different reading of the meaning of the sentence that the questioner might be taking. The narrator says s/he worked very hard, but some friends did not. The next statement is some of us worked hard (so including the narrator, who's previously stated s/he worked very hard as contrasted to friends who didn't), but others, such as Fred, didn't, with an illustrative example of Fred spending all day at the tea house. So, the sentence could go more like "Some of us worked hard [comma missing] just expecting? endeavoring? to pass the exam [implying that even with hard work, no one thought they would ace it], but others didn't." I think it's iffy that was the original intent of the test writer, but maybe that's what's causing "enough" to sound like the wrong answer? some jerk on the Internet (talk) 14:27, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

• The problem goes away if you put a comma after "hard". μηδείς (talk) 16:03, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

• "Just hard enough", or better yet "just enough" makes it sound right. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 18:52, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Your suggestion ends up meaning something different from mine; in my case adding a comma after hard gives: "Some of us worked hard, just enough to pass the exam, but others didn't." This is identical in meaning to "Some of us worked hard (just enough to pass the exam) but others didn't." I'd find it odd if that original comma weren't there, it would indicate the test maker had a poor command of grammar. μηδείς (talk) 20:37, 24 April 2015 (UTC)