Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2016 October 12

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October 12

Cholera in Haiti

I read that lots of people have been drinking bad water since the hurricane. Why don't they boil it first? There's lots of wood debris everywhere. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 09:41, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Questions that begin "Why don't..." are almost impossible to find good reliable source references for. However, if you want to learn more about some of the causes of Cholera outbreaks in Haiti, This article seems to be useful. --Jayron32 11:56, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks, . The "can" in the phrase "[...25 to 50 percent of cases can be fatal..." is a bit confusing. Anyhow, they said boil water for one minute. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:13, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

• Education seems to play a big role - following the 2010 epidemic, many patients told researchers hadn't been aware that they should boil water. Smurrayinchester 12:16, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Not to mention the practicalities of boiling all your water and keeping hands and utensils clean, while living in a makeshift shack with a large family. Not so easy even if you understand the issues. Alansplodge (talk) 12:34, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Hi Alansplodge. Good point about hands and utensils. But isn't drinking litres of bad water the main cause? Certainly food touching dirty hands and plates isn't good, but those are small amount. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:13, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

The main cause, but can be transmitted through food too. [1] Alansplodge (talk) 08:29, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Smurrayinchester, education indeed, it seems: "...residents of Santo Domingo showed that 89% had received cholera prevention messages..." Well, that's Dominican Republic. I think they are more advanced than Haiti, no? Anyhow, surely education is cheap to distribute -- easier than medicine anyway. They could drop flyers from planes that simply say "Boil water before drinking it or you will get sick." They could have made an effort to get that info to people during the years before the hurricane. It seems to me that all those cholera cases didn't need to happen. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:13, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Ever tried to light damp wood? Also I doubt many of the dwellings of Haiti's poor have well-engineered fire pits and good ventilation, which means fires are dangerous. And finally, boiling will kill pathogens, but it won't remove other pollutants which can make water "bad". --47.138.165.200 (talk) 21:53, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Damp wood? I saw lots of bright sunshine and debris. A couple of hours in the sun and loads of it would be dry, certainly. And after a hurricane, it is not other pollutants that make people sick, right? We're not talking about heavy metals. This is about bugs. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:13, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

See also UNESCO fights cholera in Haiti with educational cartoons. Alansplodge (talk) 08:29, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Good idea. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 23:47, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks all for the responses. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 23:47, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

I'm sure it was asked in good faith, but this question has elements of victim blaming that should be at least mentioned. Disaster relief is a complicated mess and an operational nightmare for even experts to deal with, let alone the poor sods who've just had their lives torn apart. Taking the victims to task because they didn't boil their water by burning the remains of their wrecked houses is, to say the least, a bit callous. Matt Deres (talk) 13:52, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

Do we have an article covering a potential transition to a cashless society?

There is quite a bit of media coverage about the possibility/potential/process for modern societies to transition to a cashless society (eg based on electronic only money, or with legal tender limited to some small amount), and significant views on it. But if we have an article covering this, I can't find it. I've looked at:

• Digital economy - more about the economy that exists in the digital world rather than the implications of a "real-world" digital economy" or transition
• Cashless society
• Legal tender

Any help appreciated! FT2 ^{(Talk | email)} 14:46, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

I realize that cheques are not cash, but there is some stuff on this general subject at Cheque#Declining use. --Viennese Waltz 14:50, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

• You're going to do best by following ideas from, electronic money, digital currency and the like. From my quick research "cashless economy" leads to two very divergent (technologically speaking) places: one based on electronic storage of value (either denominated in modern fiat currency like the dollar, or in cryptocurrency like the bitcoin) and the other direction based on studies of barter society. Another good place to look is at Money supply. --Jayron32 17:54, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Cashless society sounds to me like a suitable topic for an article. Some of the information scattered about in other articles could perhaps be folded into it. Note that today most money is already electronic. Bank accounts are entries in bank computers. Cash only represents a small fraction of the global money supply. --47.138.165.200 (talk) 21:47, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

I think we should have coverage of this. Even the article cash doesn't say anything about it. Larry Summers has been agitating to get rid of cash, ban the US $100 bill, etc. Articles about electronic or digital currency aren't the right place. If not a new article, then I'd add info directly to the cash article. 50.0.205.96 (talk) 00:51, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

• Thank you. Stub created - Cashless society FT2 ^{(Talk | email)} 11:43, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

US representatives to the UN in Geneva

According to our article, Pamela Hamamoto is the 18th and current Permanent Representative (Ambassador) of the United States of America to the United Nations and other international organizations in Geneva, assuming this office in May 2014. Apparently, the 17th Permanent Representative was Warren W. Tichenor. But the article on Tichenor says that he left office in January 2009. So who held this office between 2009 and 2014? --Viennese Waltz 16:08, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Representative of the United States to the European Office of the United Nations says it was Betty E. King. However, both articles say that Ms King (number 18 by my count) is the current incumbent, so need a bit of updating if anybody is bored. Alansplodge (talk) 17:25, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

I've changed the former article's mention of Betty King from "incumbent" to "?", since the reference for her being the incumbent was from 2011. Loraof (talk) 01:19, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks, I found a biog on the US Mission to Geneva website which gives "late 2013" as her termination date, so I've added that in pending something better. I've also added Hamamoto to the list using the same website. Alansplodge (talk) 20:00, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

D'oh! Forgot to change the image at the top of the article - now done, Ms King is now history. Alansplodge (talk) 20:06, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Btw there seems to be some confusion between Permanent Representatives and Ambassadors. List of current Permanent Representatives to the United Nations lists Samantha Power, but she is United States Ambassador to the United Nations, while the Permanent Representative to the United Nations is Pamela Hamamoto. This needs to be sorted out for consistency. Brandmeister^talk 21:13, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

That's because there are multiple Permanent Representatives/Ambassadors to the UN. Colloquially, the "Ambassador to the UN" is the one that represents the country in the General Assembly and the Security Council, and THAT is who Samantha Powers is, i.e. she represents the U.S. in New York. Pamela Hamamoto is the Representative of the United States to the European Office of the United Nations. So to simplify, Samantha Powers is the New York-based UN Ambassador, Pamela Hamamoto is a Geneva-based UN Ambassador. There are also others in other cities that host UN missions, i.e. I found David J. Lane (ambassador) who was until recently based in Rome. Also Keith Harper (lawyer), who is the United States Ambassador to the United Nations Human Rights Council also based in Geneva. --Jayron32 02:45, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for sorting that out, Alansplodge. The only slight wrinkle now concerns the numbering. Hamamoto is clearly the 18th Ambassador (see this official source), but there are 19 names on the list at Representative of the United States to the European Office of the United Nations. I suspect that James B Foley (a redlink) doesn't count as he was only the Representative ad interim. That would make Warren W. Tichenor the 16th, although our article on him lists him (unsourced) as the 17th, and King the 17th. Unless anyone objects, I will make those changes to the articles for King and Tichenor. --Viennese Waltz 08:04, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

Makes perfect sense to me. Alansplodge (talk) 14:26, 14 October 2016 (UTC)