Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2023 January 6
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January 6
editPink Floyd, recording of 18 live albums
editPink Floyd as released 18 live albums recorded in 1972, see this article. Were they recorded professionally, i.e. with a professional tape recorder? Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 05:23, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- Presumably they were. I can't find any information, but in general bands will often record their live performances using a feed from the mixing board; if Floyd had that set-up for at least one of the shows, it would have been trivial to maintain it for the entire tour in question. I suspect they used the same equipment as they used to record Pink Floyd: Live at Pompeii, which was recorded the previous fall. --Jayron32 12:13, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- Well, I've listened to short samples of most of them and they sound like only audience tapes. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 01:56, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- I agree, though I only checked a couple. I'm honestly a bit surprised; it was very common for performers to tape their shows back then. Led Zeppelin, for example, has dozens of concert soundboard recordings out there, bootleg or official. Matt Deres (talk) 19:54, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- I checked several. Most were in mono. One was in stereo, but sounds like it was recorded from the audience with a stereo cassette recorder. In some, you can hear the audience talking. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 20:21, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yeah the consensus on the Floyd forums is that these are all audience tapes, no soundboard recordings. Not only that, they are merely repackaging existing bootlegs for legal (copyright extension) purposes. And I'm not sure I agree that it was common for bands to have their shows professionally recorded in the 1970s. It was an expensive undertaking involving sound engineers and mobile recording studios, and it would only have been done if a live album was planned (which there wasn't, in Floyd's case). --Viennese Waltz 10:45, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
- Soundboard recordings are kind of in-between audience recordings and a fully tracked studio recording. My understanding is that the recording took place between the microphones/pickups and the amps, so that they'd get clear recordings with little hiss or audience noise. If they wanted to track the recording later, they'd have the separate feeds, and if not, they wouldn't. I have no inside scoop into how frequently it was done, but there are literally dozens of Zeppelin soundboard recordings from throughout their history. It was obviously something they did often. Matt Deres (talk) 18:57, 10 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yeah the consensus on the Floyd forums is that these are all audience tapes, no soundboard recordings. Not only that, they are merely repackaging existing bootlegs for legal (copyright extension) purposes. And I'm not sure I agree that it was common for bands to have their shows professionally recorded in the 1970s. It was an expensive undertaking involving sound engineers and mobile recording studios, and it would only have been done if a live album was planned (which there wasn't, in Floyd's case). --Viennese Waltz 10:45, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
- I checked several. Most were in mono. One was in stereo, but sounds like it was recorded from the audience with a stereo cassette recorder. In some, you can hear the audience talking. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 20:21, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- I have a book to hand, Lord Byron Accounts Rendered (John Murray, 1974) by Doris Langley Moore, that closely examines the said poet's laundry bills and the like. I fear we are fast approaching a similar level of interest in musicians from 50 years ago. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 51.194.245.235 (talk) 20:57, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- Presumably they are not as good or as respected as the "Betty boards" from The Grateful Dead's live shows. (I love that term...) David10244 (talk) 10:01, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
Chopin, Ramin Djawadi, and the music of Westworld
editJust heard Prelude, Op. 28, No. 15 (Chopin) and I could swear I heard a bit of Djawadi’s music of Westworld in there, possibly a variation on "This World" (Theme for Dolores) or maybe another track. My question is, does Djawadi draw on Chopin as an influence in any of his work, or has he a particular affinity for Chopin? Viriditas (talk) 08:10, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- This article has Chopin's Piano Sonata No. 2 listed amongst the music used by Djawadi in Westworld, so he certainly knows who Chopin is. Alansplodge (talk) 12:25, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- The name Chopin is also mentioned in the series,[1] curiously with what I think is Debussy's Rêverie playing in the background. --Lambiam 13:39, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- Right, the question then arises, why does Delos hate Chopin? (2x2) My guess is that the piece that Dolores plays (funeral march) points to his mortality, which he is in deep denial of with his impending death and his corporate-wide ambition to become immortal in a new body. To me, at least, it seems like the use of Chopin here is deliberately pointing towards our fragile humanity in the face of the machine. Delos doesn’t want to hear Chopin because he is trying to shed his humanity. If it is indeed Dolores’ theme which has elements of Chopin contained within it, this speaks volumes about the arc of her character. Viriditas (talk) 22:29, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- While the sombre third movement of Piano Sonata No. 2 is referred to as the "Funeral March", Dolores is playing its gentle and lyrical trio when Delos walks in, so if the intention of the creators of the TV series was a reference to mortality, it is subtle. Speculating here about the unrevealed motives of fictional characters is IMO pointless. --Lambiam 11:38, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- Agreed. What I was hoping for with my initial question was to find an expert intimately familiar with Djawadi’s work, and to uncover if he has ever talked about his interest in Chopin in an interview or otherwise. My secondary interest that I have not yet discussed here until now, is in the beautiful piano arrangements that are found in the post-episode credits, but I have not yet broached that topic, preferring to stick with the topic of Chopin. Viriditas (talk) 09:03, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
- The pool of active editors here is rather small, so finding an expert on a niche subject here is something of an unrealistic expectation. But if there is some published work on a given subject, we can usually find it for you. Not in this case, it seems. Alansplodge (talk) 23:25, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
- In any case, I want you to know that I very much appreciate your efforts. Viriditas (talk) 09:26, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
- The pool of active editors here is rather small, so finding an expert on a niche subject here is something of an unrealistic expectation. But if there is some published work on a given subject, we can usually find it for you. Not in this case, it seems. Alansplodge (talk) 23:25, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
- Agreed. What I was hoping for with my initial question was to find an expert intimately familiar with Djawadi’s work, and to uncover if he has ever talked about his interest in Chopin in an interview or otherwise. My secondary interest that I have not yet discussed here until now, is in the beautiful piano arrangements that are found in the post-episode credits, but I have not yet broached that topic, preferring to stick with the topic of Chopin. Viriditas (talk) 09:03, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
- While the sombre third movement of Piano Sonata No. 2 is referred to as the "Funeral March", Dolores is playing its gentle and lyrical trio when Delos walks in, so if the intention of the creators of the TV series was a reference to mortality, it is subtle. Speculating here about the unrevealed motives of fictional characters is IMO pointless. --Lambiam 11:38, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- Right, the question then arises, why does Delos hate Chopin? (2x2) My guess is that the piece that Dolores plays (funeral march) points to his mortality, which he is in deep denial of with his impending death and his corporate-wide ambition to become immortal in a new body. To me, at least, it seems like the use of Chopin here is deliberately pointing towards our fragile humanity in the face of the machine. Delos doesn’t want to hear Chopin because he is trying to shed his humanity. If it is indeed Dolores’ theme which has elements of Chopin contained within it, this speaks volumes about the arc of her character. Viriditas (talk) 22:29, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- The name Chopin is also mentioned in the series,[1] curiously with what I think is Debussy's Rêverie playing in the background. --Lambiam 13:39, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
When does a feature film in development get its own article?
editI've been tracking the productions of several films lately, two of which are scheduled to start filming this year. At what point is there enough information about a film for it to receive its own Wiki article without it being a stub? Manofsteele941 (talk) 23:42, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
- See Wikipedia:Notability (films). In general, these requirements are not met until a film has been released and received significant coverage in reliable and independent sources. Shantavira|feed me 09:18, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- There is nothing specific to the nature of the topic that determines when there is enough reliable encyclopedic information covering the topic in sufficient depth to warrant more than a stub. The question can also be asked about archeological discoveries, or zoological specimens. If the usable material grows to more than four paragraphs, outgrowing the ideal length of a lead section, and it can naturally be split into separate article sections, this is an indication it may be time to proceed to "start-class" status, the first step on the long path to "good article". For more, see Wikipedia:What is an article? and Wikipedia:Content assessment. --Lambiam 10:23, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- Lambiam has the better advice, the best time to create an article is when there is enough in-depth reliable, independent source text to support writing an article. After all, Wikipedia has decent articles on films which have never been made (see Akira (planned film) for example). Don't worry ever about what the article is about (like being about a film, or a person, or a company, or a mathematics concept, or whatever) and ONLY worry about what kind of source text you can find to use to write the article from. That's all that matters, everything else about the article-writing process unnecessarily confuses the process.--Jayron32 20:36, 7 January 2023 (UTC)