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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Philadelphia Phillies Opening Day starting pitchers

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Matthewedwards 06:36, 21 February 2009 [1].

List of Philadelphia Phillies Opening Day starting pitchers

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Nominator(s): KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on!
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I am nominating this for featured list because I believe it exemplifies all of the featured list criteria. I know that I may be stuffing beans up my nose here, but I feel it necessary to address some concerns ahead of time. I am aware that the level of citations in the lead may be low compared to some other leads. The reason for this is due to the length of the Phillies' franchise history. The list is unsplittable by city or other non-arbitrary criterion vis a vis the Giants or Orioles lists. Some of the facts in the lead would require the use of between five and, in one case, fifteen references to fully verify. Though all of these references are available and presented in the article with their individual years, I feel that citing fifteen refs on one fact to be overkill per WP:LEADCITE and visually unappealing/distracting per WP:FL?'s Cr.6. Comments are welcome and will, of course, be addressed by the nominator. Cheers. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 22:59, 8 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Truco

Comments from Truco (talk · contribs)

Lead
  • The team's record in his five Opening Day starts is 4–1. - is -->"was"
  • Actually, the verb is what makes the tense past or present, so it would be grammatically correct either way. Since the record isn't going to change but still exists, it's like a world record or a season record; it doesn't change in history. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 23:13, 9 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Art Mahaffey has the best record in Opening Day starts for the franchise; though many players have won their only Opening Day start, Mahaffey started and won two Opening Day games, for a winning percentage of 1.000. - in this context, best record is POV unless you provide statistics right after it.
  • IMO it would make it sense to add the years in which the franchise used each stadium.
  • Steve Carlton won his Opening Day start against the Montréal Expos in 1980,[4] while Brett Myers received a no-decision against the same franchise (now the Washington Nationals) in 2008, a game that the Phillies eventually lost. - I thought Tampa Bay was in the 2008 World Series?
  • Grover Cleveland Alexander started Opening Day in 1915,[8] the Phillies' first World Series appearance,[1] while Robin Roberts started the first game of 1950,[9] and Terry Mulholland the first game of 1993. - Alexander's name is already mentioned before this, no need to mention his full name again.
Key
  • Each year is linked to an article about the Major League Baseball season;

numbers indicate game number during that Opening Day in the case of a doubleheader. - 1)if you mentioned the acronym of the Major League Baseball (MLB) in the lead, you can write MLB here to save space 2)"the" should be added before game number

Table
  • To be consistent, Grover Cleveland Alexander should be piped just to "Grover Alexander" [as well as in the lead]
  • Not so. All contemporary accounts refer to Alexander by his full name or by his nickname, Pete Alexander. In addition, his article is titled as such, so there's no need to use the redirect. Furthermore, the Phillies retired a "P" for him using his full name, so it's obvious that they considered it necessary as well. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 03:06, 9 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Footnotes
  • Ties were technically possible in baseball until several rule changes beginning in 2007; however, ties were rare in practice due to the extra-innings rules. - wouldn't beginning be "began"?
References
  • To be consistent with the other links, link USA Today
  • Its redundant to list the "work" as Retrosheet.org and the "publisher" as Retrosheet, Inc. when the URL is name after the publisher, so its best just to name it Retrosheet, Inc.''TRUCO 503 01:45, 9 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Not correct on this point; they are two separate things. The non-profit company Retrosheet, Inc. is distinct from the website Retrosheet.org, like Baseball-Reference.com is distinct from Sports Reference LLC. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 03:06, 9 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 00:49, 21 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)
* Dabs; please check the disambiguation links identified in the toolbox. Also, what makes Retrosheet a reliable source? Dabomb87 (talk) 23:16, 8 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Dabs are fixed. I am searching for the link that shows Retrosheet's reliability; however, I have seen this same question over and over again at FLCs, FACs, and GA noms. Does reliability have to be re-established every time? I would think that many of us have done enough FLs or reviewed enough times to know that this is something we see on a regular basis and know. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 00:12, 9 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)

  • "Recreation Park yielded a 1–2 record on Opening Day, while Veterans Stadium has the lowest winning percentage (.200), with two wins and eight losses." "while"-->and.
  • "Subordinating conjunctions also join two clauses together, but in doing so, they make one clause dependent (or "subordinate") upon the other." [4] In this case, "while" is used as a subordinating conjunction, and clause 2 is dependent on clause 1 to explain that the record stated is for Opening Day, rather than all-time or some other statistic. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 23:56, 15 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "the Phillies' first World Series appearance,[1] while Roberts started the first game of 1950,[9] and Terry Mulholland the first game of 1993." Same comment.

Sources

  • Ref 2 needs a format=PDF added to the template.
  • All the Retrosheet references have double periods.
I had a similar issue with a recent GAN. It is just a quirk in the citation templates that they add a period, even if the information submitted to the template already ends in one. I think the simplest fix is to just drop the period at the end of the abbreviations, which will make the information submitted to the template look funny, but will produce a citation in the article with just a single period. Rlendog (talk) 01:56, 15 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That is what I do too. Dabomb87 (talk) 01:57, 15 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sources look good. Dabomb87 (talk) 00:49, 21 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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