User talk:IJBall/Archive 21

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How often is it that...

...every single main cast has an article? Not very often! *gasps* Working on this now: User:Amaury/sandbox/A Million Little Things#Cast. Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:46, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

With American primetime TV shows, it happens fairly often, I'd say... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:47, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

That's that one done. Quick question: When it comes to announcements for whatever series, one paragraph or separate paragraphs? What do you personally prefer? For example, current way or "on February 6," "on February 15," "on February 20," etc. each on separate lines. Amaury (talk | contribs) 06:54, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

One paragraph – a paragraph should cover one subject, so all the casting stuff, etc. should go in one paragraph each. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:21, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Image size?

Is there a guideline on the allowed image sizes for images used to represent characters, either at parent or character list articles? All articles I've seen them used at, like at Jessie, let the size be handled naturally without defining a size, so I removed the 400px on Andi Mack, but it was re-added with this explanation. Given that you can click on images to expand them, that doesn't really seem to be a valid rationale for having the 400x. Amaury (talk | contribs) 21:06, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

It's complicated, and I don't understand it, really. Like, you're not supposed to use "px" for size anymore, but use an "upright" factor instead. But I don't think there are "hard" imagesize limits. It's one of those things that prob. comes down to Talk page consensus. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:33, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

James Fitzgerald (New York state senator)

Do you want to give a further comment at Talk:James Fitzgerald_(New_York_state_senator)? The other party has offered several alternatives and you could put in your preference. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 01:55, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

Responded there. Thanks... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:05, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

Puppy Dog Pals and affiliate.zap2it

This is a weirdness. The stated reference http://affiliate.zap2it.com/tv/puppy-dog-pals/episode-guide/EP02647450 works for me and verifies the information added. http instead of https maybe and zap2it may be doing some regional blocking. I'm using CenturyLink in Colorado and their default DNS. Production code is not in the reference though. Geraldo Perez (talk) 15:36, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: Yeah, when I click on this, it automatically enters my zip code, and I get a "Your current provider has become invalid. Please choose a different provider." error message... Anyway can a better source for this info be worked out? The "general" Zap2It page does not have the info claimed... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:38, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

The actual Zap2it site has been weird lately. Full October schedules should have been out around September 10 for Disney Channel since Zap2it gets Disney Channel info early, but full October schedules are still not out. Same thing happened with September. Full September schedules should have been out around August 10, and they weren't. It wasn't until September 6 that Zap2it updated the air date for Raven's Home Sleevemore 1 and it wasn't until September 11 that Zap2it updated the air date for Sleevemore 2. And Zap2it still has August 26 for yesterday's Bunk'd premiere. For a point of reference, full July schedules were out June 11, except for Bizaardvark because it was a new season, not just new episodes—Bizaardvark July schedule was out on June 29—though some changes were made along the way; full August schedules were out July 11. Amaury (talk | contribs) 15:52, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

It looks like affiliate.zap2it and tvlistings.zap2it have different content with the affiliate site being more up-to-date. It looks to be a reliable source so I think we should permit its use when the main site is lagging behind. I can verify that the reference supported the info that was added. I'm curious if different IP ranges see different content. Geraldo Perez (talk) 16:00, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

Seems likely, if it automatically knows your zip code... Any, feel free to restore, that I'm personally not great with using a source that only a fraction of our readership can actually see – if an alt. source can be found, it should be used preferentially over this one. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:04, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

I expect that the main column reference will soon reflect the data. I am seeing the affiliate branch being used in Big Hero 6: The Series for the last episode, same issue with main zap2it site not showing the info. Geraldo Perez (talk) 16:21, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

TV series disambiguation or episode range?

Are the years a disambiguation between different versions of the series or just a range for episodes? If its for episodes then the first two are placed correctly, if its for TV series, then the 3rd one is.

• List of Ripley's Believe It or Not! episodes (2000–03)
• List of Ripley's Believe It or Not! episodes (1982–86)
• List of Wild Kingdom (1963-1984) episodes --Gonnym (talk) 09:28, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: These are scenarios where doing this by season would be actually the way to go – as per List of The Simpsons episodes (seasons 1–20) and List of Pokémon episodes (seasons 1–13) & List of Pokémon episodes (seasons 14–current).

So, based on the above, the "date ranges" should go at the end, as per the Ripley's example. However, in the case of Ripley's, I'd

1. switch to seasons over year ranges, and
2. I'd revise the "split" of seasons so it's more of a 50-50 split.

In the case of List of Wild Kingdom (1963-1984) episodes, it should simply be moved to List of Wild Kingdom episodes, as the article actually covers episodes over the show's entire run, so the year range is actually unnecessary (disambiguation), and should simply be removed...

Hope this helps! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:04, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Ripley articles are treated as two different shows, both counting the first year as season one. So List of Ripley's Believe It or Not! (2000 TV series) episodes & List of Ripley's Believe It or Not! (1982 TV series) episodes? --Gonnym (talk) 16:15, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Yes, if they're being treated as separate series, that would be the way to go as per WP:NCTV... But are there two separate Ripley's Believe It or Not! TV show articles? If so, what are their titles?... Incidentally, if the 2000 version is only about two or three seasons long, it's possible-to-likely that its List of Episodes should simply be merged back to the parent TV show article – Problem solved!! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:20, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

No separate parent articles (though TBH they should, but both sections are stub atm. Merging might be a problem as they use different tables for the list. --Gonnym (talk) 16:34, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: The game show folks are... uh, "weird", in that they don't like to split off articles for separate versions of the same show. But I'm not sure I'd describe Ripley's Believe It or Not! as a "game show" – so, I'd be tempted to split those articles into Ripley's Believe It or Not! (1982 TV series) and Ripley's Believe It or Not! (2000 TV series), and then actually merge the List of Episodes back to the two parent articles... FWIW. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:37, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

There are 2 more versions that don't have stand-alone articles and don't have episode series. I'm sure if these weren't stubs this wouldn't be an issue... --Gonnym (talk) 16:46, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Ripley's Believe It or Not! (TV series) can still be left as an "overview" article (though, likely, it would have to be moved to Ripley's Believe It or Not! (franchise)...), and the other two short-run editions can be left at the "main" article... In terms of the 1982 and 2000 versions, I suspect there's enough sourcing out there to justify standalone articles – the 1982 version was quite popular in its day, and I'd bet it got plenty of coverage. The 2000 version had Dean Cain as host, IIRC, and must have gotten at least some coverage (though most of it hard to find on the internet)... But I think spinning those two articles out, and them merging the episodes lists into them, is the way to go here. We can always start off with {{split section}} tags to start this process off, and put the hard work of actually WP:Splitting off until later... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:52, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Elena of Avalor

While it isn't too bad, I don't think—definitely not as bad as The Loud House—its Characters section could probably be fleshed out, particularly the sections for non-main. Like with Henry Danger, a Villains section is unnecessary, just have a Recurring section and list anyone eligible under there. I honestly think sometimes it would be better if we just didn't list characters for animated series, at least not the non-main ones. Although even that's tricky, because there aren't generally opening starring credits. With the end credits, in most cases, the cast is just shown, but there's no distinction between main and not main and consequently between major non-main and and minor non-main. The only recent animated series that's been good on this has been Big City Greens, which makes it super clear who is who, as it has the main characters shown in the opening titles sequence. Then the end credits show the voice credits for the main characters and any major non-main characters (guest stars). Those with only minor roles are all listed under "additional voices." If only all animated series were like that. Amaury (talk | contribs) 17:01, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree that we probably shouldn't list beyond "main cast" for animated TV series, as listing all the "recurring characters" just ends up leading to massive "cast bloat" at most of the animated TV series articles, and it's questionable how many of the "recurring characters" are really "notable" anyway... Probably why I don't spend a huge amount of time at most of the animated TV series articles, aside from MOS:TV and MOS:BOLD-type fixes... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:04, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

MOS:TV

The last two discussions at WP:MOSTV might be of interest to you. Surprised I commented there before you did, honestly. :P Amaury (talk | contribs) 18:17, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Those two don't look like they need me to comment. (Though I disagree with the idea that "Guest star" vs. "Special guest star" crediting "doesn't matter" – and whether there should be a 'Special guest star' section separate from a 'Guest star' section should be left up to consensus at the article... Though, of course, you know that I don't like 'Guest star' sections in the first place.) --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:22, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Is Cosby's inmate number relevant?

Should we add Cosby's prison location and inmate number to the article? 2605:6001:E7DD:AC00:D022:802D:5248:401B (talk) 02:39, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Uh... I'm thinking probably not, but Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard would probably be the best place to ask this. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 02:41, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

You see, it was already added to his article as well as the sexual assault article. 2605:6001:E7DD:AC00:D022:802D:5248:401B (talk) 02:54, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Removed from Cosby article and not in Sexual assault article. --Ebyabe (talk) 03:02, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

If it isn't on that article, it was before. Should we also edit the prison's article? 2605:6001:E7DD:AC00:D022:802D:5248:401B (talk) 03:05, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Done. Anything else? --Ebyabe (talk) 03:07, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

I Am Frankie

Have you and Geraldo Perez watched the amazing and fantastic season two premiere yet? Amaury (talk | contribs) 01:11, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Not yet. Will probably get to that tonight. If not, then tomorrow. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 01:12, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: I bought a season pass on iTunes and they only had 36 minutes of the 43 minute episode there for that episode. I'm more bummed than anything right now as I didn't see the conclusion to the episode. I enjoyed it to the point where it just stopped and left me going huh? I might buy it on Amazon as they have the whole episode but I already paid Apple for it and want them to fix it. Geraldo Perez (talk) 01:38, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: That sucks! Definitely agree. They should fix it and even give you some sort of special discount for the trouble. In the meantime, are you with a cable or satellite provider or do you watch strictly online? If the former, Nickelodeon has the episode available here: http://www.nick.com/i-am-frankie/videos/i-am-eliza-s2-ep2-full-episode/ Just log in with your service provider and enjoy. Nowadays, it does it automatically, at least it does with me. We have DirecTV here. That would save you the money by not having to get it on Amazon. Amaury (talk | contribs) 01:44, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: I used to have DirecTV but dropped it and invested in fast internet to stream stuff so can't give Nick a provider. It is still cheaper overall to buy series I want or wait for free streaming. Nick will eventually make it free, I expect. If iTunes doesn't fix things I'm getting a refund and going to Amazon for the season. iTunes stopped just as things were looking bad for Frankie after the fight. I thought it was a cliffhanger until I checked into it some more. I'm trying to stay unspoiled. Geraldo Perez (talk) 02:17, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Hey, Geraldo Perez! Was that issue ever resolved? Have you gotten to see the full episode? Amaury (talk | contribs) 01:26, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: I complained to iTunes and they say they "are looking into it" but it is still broken as of now. From what the reviews said they had the same problem with the special at the start of season 1 and that did eventually get fixed. I spent my $21 to get the first 10 episodes and if this isn't resolved soon I'll demand a refund and get the season from Amazon. I haven't seen the end of the episode yet. Geraldo Perez (talk) 01:46, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Any updates, Geraldo Perez? (If still nothing, hopefully before it returns on September 10!) I'd love to hear what you and IJBall thought about the premiere, but I of course want to wait until you yourself have seen the full episode so as to not spoil anything. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:18, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: Thanks for reminding me. I reported the problem to Apple after I noticed it and they still haven't fixed the issue despite promises to do so. I demanded a refund for the season purchase and when I get it I will go to Amazon. Still haven't seen the whole episode yet and this is extremely annoying both with the problem and Apple's refusal to fix it. Geraldo Perez (talk) 17:13, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: Season two resumes tomorrow! 😁 Have you gotten your refund yet and switched over to Amazon to watch the whole episode? (If no updates yet, keep us posted.) Amaury (talk | contribs) 01:34, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: I finally got my refund from Apple. They still only have 35 minutes for ep 1. Told me to complain to Viacom and basically said they show what they get and not their problem. Bah. I finally watched the ep on Amazon. I enjoyed it and looking forward to tomorrow. Geraldo Perez (talk) 02:49, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: Yay! And wow. Talk about rude. Considering it's working on Amazon, it's certainly not what iTunes got; they're just making excuses. Amazon seems to be the way to go, as it was a lot faster on resolving the Andi Mack issue MPFitz1968 brought up on your talk page a while ago, and I'm sure he got more helpful responses.

On the season two premiere, is there anything in particular that wowed you? I got a good laugh when Dayton and Cole were confused about Frankie's rapidly changing personalities at the restaurant. Then of course the fight scene at the end and Eliza's escape was lit! What about you, IJBall? Amaury (talk | contribs) 02:59, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Actors

This is from the Wikia, and while it cannot be used to source anything, I don't doubt the info there, unless it's obvious a troll has inserted it which is quickly dealt with there. In case you are interested, some of the actors' ages:

• Alex Hook (Frankie): 16
• Kyson Facer (Andrew): 20
• Sophia Forest (Jenny): 12
• Mohana Krishnan (Tammy): 16
• Jayce Mroz (Robbie): 17
• Nicole Alyse Nelson (Dayton): 23
• Mark Jacobson (Voice of "PEGS1"): 29

And for Hunter Street:

• Stony Blyden (Max): 25
• Mae Mae Renfrow (Tess): 21
• Kyra Smith (Anika): 15
• Daan Creyghton (Sal): 16
• Wilson Radjou-Pujalte (Jake): 16

Amaury (talk | contribs) 20:07, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Raven's Home

Feel free to add any other info you feel is relevant to yesterday's press release. I just did the basics. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:52, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Grand Hotel, The Kids Are Alright

Working on my sandbox of Grand Hotel: User:Amaury/sandbox/Grand Hotel. Not sure how to deal with this. The casting announcements for Demian Bichir and Denyse Tontz say they will respectively portray Gonzalo Cardenas and Paloma, but the official series pickup announcement says they will portray Santiago Mendoza and Alicia Mendoza, respectively. Thoughts? Similarly, for User:Amaury/sandbox/The Kids Are Alright, the Deadline Hollywood articles have the last names as Dwyer, but the Disney ABC Press bios have Cleary. Amaury (talk | contribs) 00:54, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Side note: I don't think Nickelodeon is the first network to do it, but it is something new from my understanding. Check out what is in the promo for Saturday's Henry Danger. Amaury (talk | contribs) 02:30, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Go with the series pick-up names (and the Disney ABC Press bios), as it's more recent. Character names often change through the process – in fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the character names changes again before the show reaches air... As for the Nick ad, that is weird – don't think I've ever seen that before... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:06, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

On a related note, it seems that unannounced cast are also added. Unless I missed something, none of the casting announcements for User:Amaury/sandbox/The Neighborhood made any mention of Hank Greenspan portraying Grover, Dave and Gemma's son. The actor name was just in the credits, as well as here. Amaury (talk | contribs) 01:51, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Child actor – not so surprising that the casting for a part like that wasn't publicly announced. So, sometimes, you won't know everyone who's in the cast for a show until you look at the cast listing on the show itself. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 02:18, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

New Nickelodeon movie and president

• Movie
• President

Amaury (talk | contribs) 19:01, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

God Friended Me

Thanks for the help at my sandbox. That was so nice. I guess you're watching this series, too. I didn't have time to do everything before it premiered as it was a last-minute addition to my to watch list since I only found out about it the day of the premiere, so I started things backwards, so to speak, by adding the credits directly from the first episode. And later I'd go back and start to add all the production info. Usually, I add the production info first and general framework and then change the crediting to reflect what the series has. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:38, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

I'll watch this one when I'm not interested in Lifetime's Sunday night movie for the night... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:40, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Are you caught up with I Am Frankie, or have you at least reduced the number of episodes you're behind by? Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:43, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Still behind. May get through a couple today, and I'll try to watch through to the end this weekend... I'm also trying to keep watching Backstage season #2 though. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:49, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

I just hope we get a third season. If Hunter Street can get it, so can I Am Frankie. I think we're just going to have to accept the fact that 1.0 million~ is probably the new 1.5 million~. If we look at it like that, then maybe 600K~ isn't *that* bad and is equivalent to about 1.1 million back in the day. It's too bad Nickelodeon didn't realize that they should have lowered their ratings bars and canceled Game Shakers and School of Rock. And with Star Falls having been moved to TeenNick for its last nine episodes, it's probably canceled. It's a shame Nickelodeon doesn't follow the same formula as Disney Channel, where actor contracts are for three seasons, with two seasons being guaranteed and three seasons depending on other factors. Knight Squad S2 also deserves 20+ episodes. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:57, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Maybe there is hope. Look, Nickelodeon liked my comment! Amaury (talk | contribs) 17:59, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Question about an edit summary

Hello, just ran into this edit and the comment in the edit summary doesn't seem to make any sense. Was just wanting to see if you had an explanation of if something weird was going on. The discussion you are linking to doesn't appear to be about that article. {{u|zchrykng}} {T|C} 03:48, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

@Zchrykng: The relevant discussion is here. Basically, Wylie does not meet WP:NACTOR currently – her only "significant role" is Andi Mack, and as she's not the lead in that it's unlikely that she's independently notable. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:52, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

IJBall, got it, thanks! Found the discussion after I messaged you. Was only asking because I reverted someone earlier who expanded the redirect thinking the link in the edit summary was to an AfD discussion, obviously I didn't actually check it, and was confused when someone pointed out the mismatch. {{u|zchrykng}} {T|C} 03:55, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

BTW Zchrykng – while this earlier version of the article was at least borderline, this was unacceptable – the latter was basically WP:BLPROD-worthy, as IMDb is not valid sourcing, esp. for a WP:BLP, so you were completely correct to revert that. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 04:03, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

IJBall, I was about to BLPROD it when I looked and saw that it used to be a redirect so decided to just revert to that. Didn't doubt my action, was mostly just confused/curious. Thanks! {{u|zchrykng}} {T|C} 04:06, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

COPS animated tv series

Reading the discussion at Talk:Cops (TV series)#Requested move 6 February 2018 I found out that COPS (animated TV series) is actually "C.O.P.S.". I then checked what the other TV databases call this and IMDB, TV.com and TVDB all call it "C.O.P.S". Was there a reason why we didn't use it? --Gonnym (talk) 08:07, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Based on the title card of that one, I actually don't consider a move to "C.O.P.S." a "sure thing". If the title card had spelled it that way too, it would be a slam-dunk. However, most of the sourcing used at the article does seem to spell it "C.O.P.S.", so it's probably worth a WP:RM discussion. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:35, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, I saw a YouTube video and the title card is indeed not with the dots, though the very first sentence of the opening video is "COPS - Central Organization of Police Specialists" which make it more clear that "COPS" is an acronym. But yeah, this should go through a RM based on RS and other TV databases. --Gonnym (talk) 12:41, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: I've found one contemporary source that seems to call it "C.O.P.S.", so there's probably enough evidence to show support for this in a WP:RM. However, I couldn't find anything else, as searching for this is very difficult (search engines seem to be simplifying it to "cops"). The issue/confusion here seems to be that the toy line was definitely under "C.O.P.S.", but it's less clear (to me) if the cartoon was intended to be called the same thing (e.g. this also contemporary source just calls it "COPS"). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:55, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

In his book Television Cartoon Shows Hal Erickson calls it "C.O.P.S.". I'm trying to find a tv guide that might have been scanned from 1988-1989. --Gonnym (talk) 13:07, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

You've got mail!

Hello, IJBall. Please check your email; you've got mail!
Message added 17:37, 5 October 2018 (UTC). It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Amaury (talk | contribs) 17:37, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

List of Will & Grace episodes

Hi IJBall,

I need help. How do I request a move for a season article? Which section should I put on Wikipedia:Requested moves? I am just requesting a move for Season 10 of Will & Grace because the season 10 have started already and it is still being redirected. — Lbtocth^talk 04:33, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

@Lbtocth: I'm not exactly sure what move you need to carry out, but it sounds like in this case you can probably use WP:RM/TR. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:32, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. It has been took care of by someone else. — Lbtocth^talk 19:58, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

New disambiguation issue

A topic we haven't touched yet and neither does NCTV. How does a disambiguation title work for a season article for a show that is disambiguated.

2 options:

1. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1987 TV series) (season 1)
2. Mission: Impossible (1988 TV series season 1)

If we need to pass this at NCTV, let's at least first decide between ourselves which one is the preferred style. --Gonnym (talk) 10:04, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Well there's some good news here – both of these articles should simply be Merged back to articles from with they came (I'll probably do that this weekend), as neither is justified as a standalone article. So that allows us to "punt" on the issue!!... But, as to the question, a "double parenthetical" doesn't make sense to me, so I think the first method is out, even though it sort of "follows" the lead of things like List of Mistresses (U.S. TV series) episodes. I think the second one is probably wrong without a comma – so I'd probably say the best iteration would be something like: Mission: Impossible (1988 TV series, season 1)... Thoughts? --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:12, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Heads up on the Ninja Turtle article, all 3 versions have seasons (10, 7 and 5) so not sure how you are going to handle it. The Mission Impposible issue is also a bit more complicated as I'm going to propose that the 1966 series be name changed as it's clearly not a primary topic even if all the other entries are named after it. So this will also have season articles. The style you suggested looks good (but I really had no preference here). If you can't merge these we will need to address it. --Gonnym (talk) 15:45, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Note that WP:PRIMARYTOPIC has two definitions – the second definition is: "A topic is primary for a term with respect to long-term significance if it has substantially greater enduring notability and educational value than any other topic associated with that term." Even if the TV series doesn't meet definition #1, it might meet definition #2 – so it's good to have a RM discussion about this, as it's possible that some may feel the TV series may meet definition #2. (On my end, I'll want to see how the conversation develops before chiming in...)

As for the Ninja Turtles articles, if there are that many to deal with, I will probably defer the issue until a holiday season, when I have more time to look at merging all of those... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:49, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

True, but the film (which is also called exactly that) qualifies for #2 much more. Oddly enough while I was skimming the article for the series, trying to find what the critical reception was, there is no section for that in that giant article. --Gonnym (talk) 15:57, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

And reviews nowadays would be hard to find! I'm not even sure even LA Times online goes that far back. Looking for reviews of the original would probably necessitate a "library dive" through old newspapers! BTW, the "Broadcast history" section can be pulled from that, as per WP:NOTTVGUIDE. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:02, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

I'm a bit of a fan of the natural disambiguation approach in this case, generally. It seems more appropriate where you already have parentheses: season 1 of Mission: Impossible (1988 TV series). --Izno (talk) 16:51, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

To be fair, thinking on this on occasion I did wonder why "season" became a disambiguator as it's actually the article title and scope and not a term to differentiate the topic (for me it was "Mission: Impossible season 1", as that's how I would say it in speech), but doing this style only for a specific scenario and not all articles is really inconsistent and just looks strange. --Gonnym (talk) 17:02, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Season articles are generally inconsistent on this point already (I don't think I've seen your possibility before). --Izno (talk) 17:28, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

I think we might be talking about different things. But just to make sure - "TV series (season #)" is the NCTV style. This is followed by all articles. My musing was just that, not a style followed by any article, but one which if started from scratch, I'd be proposing. What articles have you seen that aren't following the NCTV style (and are not just badly titled stub articles)? --Gonnym (talk) 17:42, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Television‎#"List of programs broadcast by (network)", etc.

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Television‎#"List of programs broadcast by (network)", etc.. I can't remember where, but we talked about this a while ago. Decided to start a discussion on it. Geraldo Perez and MPFitz1968, you're invited as well. Amaury (talk | contribs) 19:51, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Use of "present"

I'll let you handle it depending on what's correct as I should be doing homework now, but shouldn't these be 2–present? If I remember correctly, that's what you prefer from another one of our articles. I don't remember which one, but you mentioned you prefer that in an edit summary. Maybe because 2–3 gives the impression that season three has finished airing. Add: Actually, Luke Mullen should stay at 2 since he hasn't appeared yet in the third season. Likewise, Marty should be season 1 for now, though word is he is returning in season three. It was mentioned somewhere he wasn't in season two due to being busy filming General Hospital. Amaury (talk | contribs) 19:43, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

If they're still appearing (i.e. the expectation is that they'll continue to appear in new episodes), then, yes, it should be "season 2–present". If, however, say their character dies, and there's little expectation they'll appear again, then it can be changed to "seasons 2–3". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:47, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Coop & Cami Ask the World and Knight Squad

Will you be giving Coop & Cami try and keeping up with it? Or will you just watch, like, the first few episodes? Are you caught up with the new Knight Squad episodes since its return on September 22? Amaury (talk | contribs) 14:13, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

I'm going to sample the first Coop & Cami, but I'm not expecting to stick with it based on the premise... With both Knight Squad and Bizaardvark, I've only seen some of the most recent episodes, but haven't seen all of them (yet). (I think there may also be a few Stuck in the Middle episodes towards the end there that I also haven't seen yet...) I did see this year's "Halloween" Bizaardvark episode, though – I liked the middle "hair monster" segment of that one. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 13:26, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

List of The Loud House episodes

Please keep a (temporary) extra eye on this. The pilot episode is "Left in the Dark"/"Get the Message." The shorts do not count as part of the series, one of the reasons why the section is standalone and not under "Episodes." Thanks. Amaury (talk | contribs) 14:35, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Big City Greens#Recurring

How many episodes does a character have to appear in to be "recurring"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by RobThomas15 (talk • contribs) 15:23, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

@RobThomas15: For a show with this many episodes, 5–6 episodes is a good benchmark. Three episodes is pretty much never enough to be truly "recurring" – it needs to be more episodes than that. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:08, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

It's not even the end of the first week, and...

http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/bureau-of-magical-things/listings/

Methinks networks need to lower their standards in these times. It's not necessarily the series doing bad, it's people being dumb and cutting and cord and Nielsen's inaccurate ratings system. I mean, look at the last two Saturday Henry Dangers. Amaury (talk | contribs) 23:21, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Reptilians

Thank you for the note; I don't often use the WP:RM process, so I had absolutely no idea that anything would break. However, by the time I got your message, someone else had fixed it, so I can't do anything :-) Nyttend (talk) 11:58, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

TV plays

Do you think maybe "TV play" should be its own type? Similar to "TV film"? --Gonnym (talk) 16:11, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

In terms of disambiguation?... No, I don't, because even "TV films" are disambiguated with just "film". And "TV plays" are basically just a form of "TV film". Finally, the latter come up so rarely that there's no reason to give them their own special "disambiguation term". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:13, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

I don't think they come up rarely, I just think they are a form of a bygone era, but of which there should be probably over a 100 plays. I'm just unsure of this, as they aren't really films in essence or form. --Gonnym (talk) 16:37, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

You could try bringing it up in WT:NCTV to see what others think... On my end, though, they're basically "filmed live plays" which is close enough to "TV film" for me to categorize them thusly. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:41, 14 October 2018 (UTC)

Any idea?

Any idea what the proper disambiguator for these is? Allegedly (Kathy Griffin special), Straight to Hell (Kathy Griffin special) and Balls of Steel (Kathy Griffin special). --Gonnym (talk) 09:19, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

I'm OK with using "(TV special)" in some cases, though I'm not sure I'd use that here. I think here I'd go with either "(TV program)" or "(film)". I don't think I can come up with anything better than one of those three options... The other question, of course, is whether they're truly independently notable, or whether they should simply be merged into Kathy Griffin. It looks like the first and last might be, but that Straight to Hell (Kathy Griffin special) might not be. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:20, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: Do you know what the relationship is between Kathy (talk show) and these specials is? Are they totally unrelated?... So it looks like List of Kathy (TV series) episodes could moved to List of Kathy episodes (and, if not that, then to List of Kathy (talk show) episodes), though I would strongly advocate simply merging all of that back to Kathy (talk show) – there's not enough content at the "LoE" article to justify as standalone article. Finally, it looks like List of Kathy Griffin stand-up specials would be the better destination for merging content from the above articles back to, rather than to Kathy Griffin. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:52, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

I think the only connection is that they are all stuff that Kathy Griffin did (similar to Louis C.K. with Louie and his specials (Live at the Beacon Theater). Haven't seen anything of hers, but it sounds like this is the connection. --Gonnym (talk) 12:55, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

I'm definitely leaning in the direction of merging List of Kathy (TV series) episodes. I'm also leaning in the direction of merging the "specials" back to List of Kathy Griffin stand-up specials – just get rid of the tables (or vastly simplify them, into an "overview table"), and have each "special" be a separate section in that article. But I see no reason that each of her specials merits a standalone article – it doesn't look to me like they got nearly enough coverage to justify that. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:59, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

There are a few others of hers I haven't listed here as they didn't have any disambiguation problems. Also, Straight to Hell and Balls of Steel were nominated for an Emmy according to the article. The list does seem like it can be indeed merged. --Gonnym (talk) 13:04, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

There's already an 'Awards and nominations' table at List of Kathy Griffin stand-up specials, so again it's reasonable that even those two should be dealt with back at List of Kathy Griffin stand-up specials rather than as standalone articles. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 13:06, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Talk:List of Victorious episodes

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

Why did you falsely accuse me of disruptive editing? I removed comments which shouldn't be there & added applicable project banners. Why did you reverse my edit twice, removing the banners & reinstating the useless comments, which you agreed should be removed? I made it clear what I was doing & why. Jim Michael (talk) 17:28, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

@Jim Michael: Two issues: You removed posts from the article's Talk page that another editor objected to – at that point you should go to the Talk page and seek consensus for their removal. Pretty much period, as per WP:TPO. The other issue is that you are WP banner "bombing" the article – a lot of editors, myself included, don't agree with the practice, so you should also go to the Talk page to seek consensus on which WP banners can/should be added. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:32, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

The other editor was wrong in claiming that I was wrong to remove the two useless comments. You agreed with me in your first edit summary, yet you reinstated them during the same edit. Those two comments are without doubt not of any use & are there against talk page guidelines. Why did you reinstate the two comments, despite agreeing that they should be removed?

Adding applicable banners isn't bombing - it's routine, correct practice. Consensus isn't needed to add applicable banners - it would be a ridiculously huge waste of time to have a discussion to reach consensus before being allowed to add applicable banners. The banners I added were Cal/LA, Comedy & US/USTV, all of which are clearly applicable, since it's an American comedy TV series set in LA. Jim Michael (talk) 17:44, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

It doesn't matter what you think – it matters what the consensus is. When Amaury reverted you, you should have either gone to the article Talk page or his Talk page to discuss. And feel free to add any WP banners you want – I'm simply going to remove any that I think are redundant or unnecessary if you aren't willing to discuss it. Also, please use the "review" button before posting to my Talk page – your multiple edits are causing multiple "pings". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:48, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

Consensus isn't needed to add applicable banners Incorrect. Virtually everything on Wikipedia works on consensus through discussion. Amaury (talk | contribs) 17:53, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

IJB, Consensus isn't needed to remove comments from article's talk pages which certainly shouldn't be there. You said yourself that they shouldn't be there, so why did you reinstate them? Also, there wasn't consensus to have such useless comments there in the first place, so you implying I went against consensus by removing them is ridiculous.

Why do you think that the 3 very applicable banners which I added are redundant - yet you don't think that of the banner of an inactive project which you didn't remove?

Amaury, Most things are obvious & don't need to go to discussion or consensus. There's no doubt in regard to the 2 comments I removed - there's no controversy or grey area there. If consensus were needed for every change, WP couldn't function properly - only a very small minority of changes on WP even need a discussion, let alone consensus. Jim Michael (talk) 18:21, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

Regardless, you should have been discussing the matter after the first revert, per WP:BRD. Amaury (talk | contribs) 19:03, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

I removed 2 comments which certainly shouldn't be there - the talk page guidelines are clear about that. They should have both been removed over 7 y ago. Why do either of you want those comments to be on the page? You're both very experienced editors who know that those comments shouldn't be there & that I was correct to remove them.

Even though a discussion shouldn't be necessary, I have discussed it in edit summaries & here.

Why did you both remove the banners of 3 very relevant projects? Neither of you have tried to explain why you think that Cal/LA, Comedy & US/USTV aren't applicable projects for an American comedy TV series that's set in LA. Jim Michael (talk) 20:12, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

OK, enough – you've made your position clear. Move on to the article Talk page, or drop it. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:14, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I Feel Bad

Both Lily and Louie have now appeared five times and therefore qualify as recurring. The problem is that Louie's actor changed for some reason after the pilot, meaning that Callan Farris has appeared once and Rahm Braslaw has appeared four times, but the character himself has appeared five times. Granted, it's just my sandbox, but I like to treat these the same as regular articles. How to handle this? Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:28, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

I prefer handling this kind of thing like this:

• Callan Farris (episode 1 [or "I Don't Want to Turn into My Mother"]) and Rahm Braslaw (from episode 3) as Louie

I strongly dislike handling this on two separate lines, like this:

• Callan Farris (episode 1 [or "I Don't Want to Turn into My Mother"]) as Louie
• Rahm Braslaw (from episode 3) as Louie

The latter way just doesn't make any sense to me, as it implies two different characters named "Louie"... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:47, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

NPR Newsletter No.14 21 October 2018

Chart of the New Pages Patrol backlog for the past 6 months.

Hello IJBall, thank you for your work reviewing New Pages!

Backlog

As of 21 October 2018, there are 3650 unreviewed articles and the backlog now stretches back 51 days.

Community Wishlist Proposal

• There is currently an ongoing discussion regarding the drafting of a Community Wishlist Proposal for the purpose of requesting bug fixes and missing/useful features to be added to the New Page Feed and Curation Toolbar.
• Please join the conversation as we only have until 29 October to draft this proposal!

Project updates

• ORES predictions are now built-in to the feed. These automatically predict the class of an article as well as whether it may be spam, vandalism, or an attack page, and can be filtered by these criteria now allowing reviewers to better target articles that they prefer to review.
• There are now tools being tested to automatically detect copyright violations in the feed. This detector may not be accurate all the time, though, so it shouldn't be relied on 100% and will only start working on new revisions to pages, not older pages in the backlog.

New scripts

• User:Enterprisey/cv-revdel.js^(info) — A new script created for quickly placing {{copyvio-revdel}} on a page.

Go here to remove your name if you wish to opt-out of future mailings. — Insertcleverphrasehere ^{(or here)} 20:49, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

FBI

Finally finishing this up. Are the descriptions part of the character names? (FBI Special Agent or FBI Special Agent in Charge.) And either way, should they be included? Missy Peregrym as FBI Special Agent Maggie Bell, etc. or Missy Peregrym as Maggie Bell, etc.? While the casting announcements do, The Futon Critic doesn't: http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/fbi/ Amaury (talk | contribs) 21:10, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

Controversial. Some WP:TV editors think that "titles" should never be included. I'm in the camp that thinks it depends on the TV series itself. FWIW, the official website does include the "titles" with the character names: [1]. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:16, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

And now I haves omething I can use for all of CBS' series. It's like the equivalent of using Disney ABC Press' bios for Disney series. Although I still wonder if there are press release sites for other brands as well. Disney ABC Press is for Disney-brand networks, like ABC, Disney Channel, etc., and it's incredibly useful because you can use it to source character names, which I will use to replace the Deadline sources once I rework Splitting Up Together as I prefer the bios. In any case, what is the press release site for Viacom-brand networks like Nickelodeon? What are the press release sites for whatever brands CBS and NBC fall under? Maybe none exist. Maybe we'll never know. Amaury (talk | contribs) 21:26, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

For PR stuff that I can't find at Futon Critic, I usually look at http://www.prnewswire.com – it doesn't always work, but sometimes you can find stuff there... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:30, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

Looks like CBS does have a site: https://www.cbspressexpress.com/cbs-entertainment/releases. So does Viacom: https://news.viacom.com/press-releases/all/all/all. And NBCUniversal too: https://www.nbcuniversal.com/newsroom/press-releases. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:32, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

Spring cleaning in the fall

User:Amaury/CSD log#October 2018. 😎 Amaury (talk | contribs) 04:06, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Freaky Friday (2018 film)

May need you. I think we've run into them before. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:12, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, I don't agree with those edits either – in addition to removing a WP:Primary source, I think they removed the Deadline source for absolutely no reason... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:13, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

@Amaury: If they revert again, feel free to go to WP:ANEW – I probably won't have time for that today... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:24, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

A question on the cast portion: Aren't films different than series? We only list the poster billed stars in the infobox, but list everyone starring under Cast, regardless of role? At least that is my understanding of films since they don't distinguish main, guest stars, and co-stars. Amaury (talk | contribs) 16:34, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

This is basically covered by WP:FILMCAST – we are under no obligation to list every credited cast member on a "film" (and generally do not). Generally the "cut-line" is actors playing "named characters". So generally, entries like "John Smith as Tough #3" are not listed in the cast listings for films... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:36, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Just Roll with It

Literally. And appropriately titled, given Disney Channel lately. Geraldo Perez, MPFitz1968. Amaury (talk | contribs) 20:58, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Street Legal

Thanks for the heads up. Quite separately from the "one article or two" issue, that draft was also so deeply advertorialized that even if standard practice were to give a revived series a separate article, that version still wouldn't be approvable... Bearcat (talk) 01:52, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on edit warring. The thread is Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:Spshu reported by User:Amaury (Result: ). Thank you. Amaury (talk | contribs) 14:50, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

Hello, I'm not sure if you've seen Spshus talkpage but they were attempting to argue, unsuccessfully, that you and Amaury should have been blocked too. It's disappointing that they're unapologetic for their actions and would rather shift blame away from their own behavior. Obviously there's no obligation for either of you to respond but if you have a few minutes for some light reading. Esuka323 (talk) 19:20, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

I like how they continually persist to try to claim that BRD is optional—it's not!—when violating BRD easily lands editors blocks, as was the case here. Amaury (talk | contribs) 19:39, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

I get back to my point that Spshu doesn't seem to understand that Wikipedia is a collaborative environment – when a change is rejected, you discuss what part of the edit might work, and which part of the edit wasn't good. If they'd done that, they might have actually been able to implement at least some of their changes. But, in this case, Spshu keeps insisting that they were "totally right" and there was nothing about their edits that could be improved or were objectionable. With editors like that, there's nothing you can do, because there's no way to figure out a "consensus solution". It's just, "WP:IMRIGHT! WP:IMRIGHT! WP:IMRIGHT!", ad nauseam... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:47, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

They Think It's All Over (TV series)

Is this a TV series - They Think It's All Over (TV series)? Seems to be a disagreement according to the page move history. --Gonnym (talk) 21:50, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

@Gonnym: We're back to a "panel game", which to me means a "panel game show". As such, it should be "game show" IMO. But, as there's a conflict over it, it needs to be sent to WP:RM to settle the issue once and for all... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 22:46, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

Pilot vs. regular episodes

So you know how we ignore actor crediting and crediting order in the pilot, right? Like Jordan Calloway (Kevin) from Beyond or the twin characters' actors' credit ordering on Stuck in the Middle. The Beyond pilot lists Jordan Calloway as starring, but the later regular episodes don't, so we don't list him as starring, what is being correctly done in my sandbox. Now, should that apply to ALL credits? For example, A Million Little Things. See my diff here.

• Executive Producers: The first four you see are in the pilot (scroll to actual infobox to see all); the addition (in green) is from episode two onward, but David is listed FIRST, followed by the rest, so ignoring the pilot, he should be listed FIRST?
• Producers: Top two are only listed in the pilot; the two additions in green are listed from episode two onward, so ignoring the pilot, only Kathy and Jonathan should be listed?
• Director of Photography: Bruce is only listed for the pilot. G. Magni is listed from episode two onward, so ignoring the pilot, only G. Magni should be listed?

Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:35, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

I don't know what I'd do for crew, rather than cast... I think I'd still be tempted to go with the post-pilot ordering over the pilot ordering, for the same reasons. For the producers, I'd be inclined to list even those from the pilot. Ditto the director of photography. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:40, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

For the producers and cinematography, I assume post-pilot ordering as well? So Kathy and Jonathan first, followed by those producers from the pilot. Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:46, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

No, there I would go with the correct ordering – this is not a case where the "credits order changed, post-pilot" like with the EPs. This is: "these two were credited for the pilot, and then these two were credited starting with episode #2". The Beyond case is different because it involved a "change in crediting-type (going from "main" to 'guest/recurring'), post-pilot" – that is a very rare case/exception. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:50, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

On another note, do dramas not have camera types? Like here, it just lists drama for the genre. But for Raven's Home, for example, it lists the genre followed by the camera type in parentheses. Add: Camera types are not mentioned in the sources, like Deadline Hollywood, for dramas either, but they are for pretty much all comedies; if they're not, they are on The Futon Critic. Amaury (talk | contribs) 04:01, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

All primetime dramas are filmed "single-camera" I believe – the "multi-cam" vs. "single-cam" distinction only exists with sitcoms. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 04:07, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

To add on what IJBall said. Multi-cam is basically for television sitcom and non-scripted shows such as talk shows and game shows, as it allows for reaction shots and master shots and requires less camera setup time (its also used for reality but for different reasons, as that needs to be dynamic and has more people to follow), whereas single-camera require making cinematic choices in camera placement and lighting. These productions also usually film on-location. In recent(-ish) years, a trend has started taking place with the demise of traditional sitcoms (as Friends, Married with Children) and a rise of a Cinéma-vérité television series, such as The Office, Parks and Rec, and others. I believe that for children shows the more common would still be a traditional multi-cam sitcom for the cost and speed benefits (it also helps bad acting). --Gonnym (talk) 10:44, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

What about a case like User:Amaury/sandbox/The Rookie? Both Nicholas Pepper and Liz Friedlander are not listed as executive producers from "Crash Course" onward, but they stay listed per above. What about this, though? In the second episode—and onward—it is Jon Steinberg, but in the pilot, it is Jonathan E. Steinberg. Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:21, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

I'd go with "Jonathan E. Steinberg" Jon Steinberg as Steinberg obviously asked to change the crediting with episode #2, so that's likely how he wants his name listed. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:26, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

You got it backward, but roger that! I gotchu! :P Amaury (talk | contribs) 03:28, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

The Bureau of Magical Things redux

Semi-related, but this IP is back with their trying to send people on a wild goose chase instead of just proving it. Amaury (talk | contribs) 23:32, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

The only solution here is to try to find an Aussie TV schedule site, to verify that. You may need to check with WP:TV'ers from Aus., possibly AussieLegend... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 23:35, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

Butterbean's Cafe

There was a cast list with information about Butterbean's Cafe. The document of that information can be found below.

Extended content

Cast Bios and Character Descriptions Margaret Ying Drake (Butterbean) -- Margaret Ying Drake is the voice of Butterbean, a fairy who owns and runs a neighborhood café and magical bakery with her best friends, in Butterbean’s Café. A natural leader, Butterbean is friendly, caring, generous and eternally optimistic. Early in her career, Drake discovered a passion for voice acting and found a niche playing children’s voices for radio, TV, toys and video games, following her dream of working in animation. Drake studied theatre at Skidmore College in Saratoga Springs, N.Y., and following several years of judo training, she studied stage combat at Shakespeare & Co in Lenox, Mass. After returning to her native New York City, she worked in theatre, dance, commercials and film. Most recently, Drake traveled the film festival circuit for the award-winning independent project They Look Like People and she will star in The Rusalka, set to premiere later this year. Gabriella Pizzolo (Cricket) -- Gabriella Pizzolo is the voice of Cricket, Butterbean’s spunky little sister who is energetic, curious and always eager to help. Above all, Cricket looks up to her big sister Butterbean and wants to make her proud. Pizzolo’s professional theatre credits include: Matilda the Musical (Matilda) and Fun Home (Small Alison) on Broadway; The Secret Garden (Mary Lenox); Sunday in the Park with George (Louise) on off-Broadway; and Alabama Shakespeare Festival’s Because of Winn Dixie (Opal) locally. Her television credits include singing for Michele Obama at the White House for the television special Broadway at the White House (TLC), Braindead (CBS) and Beaches (Lifetime). This summer she will appear in the Adirondack Theater Festival’s production of a new musical, Loch Ness. Olivia Grace Manning (Dazzle) -- Olivia Grace Manning is the voice of Dazzle, Butterbean’s best friend and the café’s operations manager who keeps everything organized and running on schedule… and always with a smile! Dazzle has a big heart and would do anything for her friends. An 11-year-old honor student at the Professional Performing Arts School in New York City, Manning currently performs with the Young People’s Chorus of NYC (YPC) and is a soloist with The Voices of Grace. Most recently, she appeared in the documentary film, My Name is Pedro, and did voiceover work for Toys“R”Us. Manning enjoys singing with her two sisters Victoria and Gloria, who are also members of YPC, as well as playing the guitar, dancing and traveling the world. Kirrilee Berger (Poppy) -- Kirrilee Berger is the voice of Poppy, the no-nonsense café chef and head of the kitchen. She is a creative problem solver who will not only figure out a way to get the food orders done, but also make sure they are delicious. The Australian-American actress’ career began on the Broadway national tour of Mary Poppins where she became the youngest actress to play the role of Jane Banks. Berger also played the role of Susan Parks in the Broadway national tour of Billy Elliot. Her television career took off when she booked two concurrent recurring roles on Amazon’s Just Add Magic and Disney’s K.C. Undercover. Berger took on a more complex project, portraying several characters in Netflix’s The Who Was? Show and will lead the original ensemble drama series $1 for CBS All Access later this year. Berger’s talents also include singing and she is a dancer trained at the world-renowned Joffrey Ballet School. Koda Gursoy (Jasper) -- Koda Gursoy is the voice of Jasper, the café’s speedy flying delivery boy. He does everything at top speed, which occasionally leads to accidents and hijinks, but he has a good sense of humor about everything. Gursoy began his acting career at the age of seven as the voice of Tommy on Tickety Toc, and soon after he landed the role of Boots on Nickelodeon’s Dora the Explorer. He has also lent his voice to many other series and projects for Nick including Dora and Friends: Into the City! and Team Umizoomi. In addition, Gursoy has done on-camera work for Scholastic Books and Sesame Street. Gursoy regularly performs as a singer, guitarist and keyboardist and loves to record and mix his music, including original songs he has written. He is also dedicated to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu which he not only trains in, but assists in instructing others. Alysia Reiner (Ms. Marmalady) -- Alysia Reiner is the voice of Ms. Marmalady, Butterbean’s greedy competitor who runs a café across the brook. Ms. Marmalady desperately wants everyone to love her café the most, but she doesn’t put in the hard work to get there. Instead, she relies on underhanded shortcuts and schemes, sending her sidekicks Spork and Spatch to do the dirty work. Best known as Fig on Orange is The New Black, Reiner won a SAG award as part of the cast, and appears in all six seasons. Reiner also plays Sunny, on FX’s critically acclaimed and Peabody Award-winning Better Things; D.A. Parks, on How to Get Away with Murder; and Kiki, on HBO’s The Deuce. Reiner has appeared in countless critically acclaimed and award-winning films, theatre and TV projects. She has also acted in over 30 features, including Egg and Equity, both of which she produced and starred in. Reiner loves working as a changemaker for women and is passionately committed to protecting the environment (livariclothing.com). In 2017, she was honored with the Voice of a Woman Award, the Moves Power Woman Award, the Pioneer in Filmmaking Award, and the Founders Award for Support, as well as a recipient of the Muse Made In NY Award presented by the Mayor's Office and NY Women in Film and Television. Chris Phillips (Spork and Spatch) -- Chris Phillips is the voice of Ms. Marmalady’s sidekicks Spork and Spatch, a pair of goofy cooks that she sends out to sabotage and spy on Butterbean. A prolific voiceover actor, Phillips’ television credits include: Pinkalicious & Peterrific on PBS, Bubble Guppies and Team Umizoomi on Nickelodeon, PB&J Otter on Disney, and Beavis and Butt-Head on MTV. He has also appeared in animated films such as Doug’s 1st Movie and Osmosis Jones, directed by Bobby & Peter Farrelly. Phillips’ voice can regularly be heard in promos for Nickelodeon, CBS, TV Land, VH1, Comedy Central and more, along with TV and radio commercials for brands including Comcast, eBay and Honey Nut Cheerios, to name a few. His on-camera credits include roles on FX’s Rescue Me and Comedy Central’s Contest Searchlight. Additionally, Phillips produced and wrote music for Denis Leary’s FX TV show Sex & Drugs & Rock & Roll. As a regular songwriting partner with Leary, Phillips has produced or co-produced all of Leary’s CDs, earning gold and platinum certifications for numerous singles.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Tiffany.chao (talk • contribs) 19:51, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

@Tiffany.chao: You still are not indicating where you are getting this from. In other words, we need the source (i.e. at least a URL link) where you are getting this info from to verify that it is from a WP:RS... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:57, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7833624/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast Cast is here. The above is from Nickelodeon. It's not on a URL or out to the public yet. Let me know if that IMDB page suffices. Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tiffany.chao (talk • contribs) 19:01, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

@Tiffany.chao: IMDb is WP:NOTRS as per WP:RS/IMDb, so that is not usable at all as a source for this... Best advice? – Just wait for the series to air: it's only two weeks away. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:04, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

There are full episodes/ sneak peeks on Nick.com. The credits are all at the end. http://www.nick.com/butterbeans-cafe/videos/s1-ep12-fluttercakes-full-episode/ Also please see the comment that was in this source stating Margaret Ying Drake is voicing Butterbean. http://nickalive.blogspot.com/2017/02/voice-cast-of-nickelodeons-new.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tiffany.chao (talk • contribs) 15:59, 31 October 2018 (UTC)

The episode credits are a legitimate source to use, as per WP:PRIMARY. But if you do that, I would actually cite the link to those as an inline source (at least for now...). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:11, 31 October 2018 (UTC)