Talk:Street prostitution

Removed this

Removed this: "Or maybe this is because every Friday and Saturday night mainstream media portrays sex workers as the easy target for violence on dull cop shows." Totally unnecessary. Nathanmurray1 (talk) 02:58, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

To be written:

• the dangers of being a streetwalker
• drug addiction as driver for need for cash
• privation of street prostitutes' lives as driver for addiction
• crack and heroin as particular problems
• pimps and panderers
• initatives to make life safer for street prostitutes
• initatives to help street prostitutes leave prostitution
• community problems created by street prostitution
• law enforcement initatives
• entrapment of street prostitutes and johns

Fake prostitution:

• the badger game and other scams

Mayor Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador was a prostitute?

"Mayor Andrés Manuel López Obrador, recognizing the dire situation faced by street prostitutes after a lifetime spent serving the sexual needs of men, announced in June 2005 the establishment of the Xochiquetzal Home for elderly prostitutes"

Wait, did I read that right?

Neutrality?

There's a note on the article page that says "The neutrality of this article is disputed. Please see discussion on the talk page." So where's the dispute? This article could certantly be more neutral, not to mention better organized, but I don't see any disputes on this talk page. A better tag would be {{cleanup}}

I don't see any neutrality dispute, so I changed it to {{accuracy}}. Mostly due to the following line:

Some countries have tolerance for street prostitution, although only in restricted areas. Some known examples are Holland, Thailand, the Philippines, Mexico and Brazil. In most of these countries were street prostitution is regulated, the girls get medical check ups every month, and follow safe sex procedures.

It seems like this sentence might be considered to lack a NPOV:

"Contrary to what is presented in movies (such as Pretty Woman), street prostitutes are sometimes the least attractive of all types of prostitutes."

It would be neutral to say that street prostitutes are often considered to be the least attractive (I'll assume that's true; I do not know). However, I'm going to vote that {{accuracy}} does seem like the deserved tag, for the article does seem very questionable and inconsistent. -Wild Bill 01:02, July 18, 2005 (UTC)

This sentence stood out for me also. It strikes me as unverifiable, and based on subjective views of beauty. Cnwb 10:42, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm in the Philippines and prostitution, though it exists, is not at all legal. I don't know where this article got that from. Perhaps that paragraph/section should be checked for accuracy or removed. TheCoffee 18:31, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Prostitution is technically illegal in Thailand too, but in practice it is tolerated. Does the same happen in the Philippines? WhisperToMe 06:47, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

Prostitution is technically illegal in Mexico too, but in practice it is tolerated.

IMO, This article is really POV... Like the drug addicts and stuff... Tons of generalisations. Someone clean this up. I'm putting the NPOV tag back on it. Thorns Among Our Leaves 01:43, 23 July 2005 (UTC)

Well, let's not skimp on tags. I have flagged it for all three. Sjc 07:27, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Removed paragraph

I removed the following pararaph, as it wasn't good at all. Some form of it could be put back, if it were greatly improved: "In the United States, New York City is the place that immortalized the image of street prostituation in the American psyche. In New York City, mainly Times Square and its surronding areas there is a dearth of prostitues when compared to the plethora seen in past years. However, prostitues still can be found if one is an experienced john. Many prostitues still do their "strolls" in the area a few blocks away from the heart of Times Square. They are dressed less conspicously and in some instances wait to be soilicated by the men. Often times the prostitues will give subtle signs about their profession such as winking at a potential client. One time hot bed areas for prostitution like 29th street and 11th Ave and the even more notorious 44th street and 8th ave do not have the overabundance of prostuites they once had. Finding a street walker used to be a "sure thing" in the Times Square area and while to some extent it still is, it is now hit or miss. Today the prime hours to look for street walkers in the Times Square area are between 12:30- 3:30. Outside of this area of Manhattan street walkers are present but are not nearly as prevalent. Prostiutes can be found in the Meat Packing district (which is pushing to be more "upscale" and "posh" thus causing a decilne in street walkers similar to that found in Times Sqaure) Hells Kitchen (which is a stones throw away from Times Square), the streets around central park on the lower west side (this location is very tenuous) and outside of cheap and less reputable hotels in midtown." --Xyzzyplugh 15:34, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Heh, I think the paragraph actually originally lamented the lack of prostitutes with words like "sadly" and so on. Might have been original research there :-) Something about how NYC did "immortalize the image of street prostituation in the American psyche" might be good to mention if sourced, movies like Taxi Driver and others I'm sure did shape the image of the street prostitute greatly. --W.marsh 15:36, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

this page

okay, by this comment I do not mean to offend any editors who may have worked on this page. I am also certainly not implying that the editors of this page are prostitutes, but after reading this article it seemed to me that the article was written by a prostitute. I'm sure this wasn't the case, but it talks about all the freedoms prositutes have and that it's only the pimps who exploit the prostitutes, and seems very very sympathetic to the prostitutes cause. Hence why it feels like it was written by a prostitute, I think perhaps a more balanced approach of liberal and coservative viewpoints should be used. TotallyTempo 02:18, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

• Heh, check out this earlier version openly bemoaning the decline of prostitution in NYC [1]. As for bigger efforts to fix it, I dunno, it's tough. If you think about it, pretty much everyone who comments or writes about this does so from a pretty strong POV (either law enforcement/religious or pro-prostitution). It would be nice if Wikipedia could be neutral like we're supposed to be, you're right. If you can suggest any relatively neutral sources, or add them to a "further reading" section, that would be a good place to start. Sorry I can't be more helpful. --W.marsh 02:40, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

I can tell you, as a sex worker, this article certainly doesn't come across as 'sympathetic to the prostitute's cause'. Most of it appears to be based on all the standard myths and misconceptions I would expect to find in an article about street-based sex work - plus a few new ones, actually! The most unattractive? The lowest paid? Brothel girls ending up on the street after being disfigured by customers????

What concerns me most (I complained about this on the main 'Prostitution' article as well) is the suggestion that contributions by an actual sex worker would be considered not conducive to a neutral point of view. Can I ask - if this was an article about the construction industry, would contributions by construction workers be treated in the same way? More to the point, would contributors who are NOT construction workers be deemed more credible than those who ARE?

This article contains way too many stereotypes and gross generalisations. Even the parts which attempt to be neutral, such as the second part of the 'Pimps' section, still use disempowering/negative terminology. For example, it says that sex workers may prefer to 'work for someone' and 'give a cut' to their 'pimp' for protection. What this should say is that those sex workers work for THEMSELVES and EMPLOY SECURITY. We don't say that celebrities 'work for' their bodyguards and give them 'a cut' for protection, do we?

I'm sorry, but encyclopedias are supposed to present the facts and the only people who can provide genuine facts about sex work, are sex workers. We can't go discounting contributions from sex workers just because their experiences don't read like an episode of Law and Order: SVU. Ashkara sands 08:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

• I didn't say contributions from people who work in this field aren't welcome, I said that contributions from people who just want to argue for or against street prostitution aren't welcome. The article should inform, not argue a POV, that's all I meant. I don't really care who makes those neutral edits, though people in the field probably are more likely to be familiar with the sources. --W.marsh 14:59, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

I was actually referring to the comment before yours, where it says it feels like the article was written by a prostitute, so it should be changed to be more balanced. I'm sorry - I just haven't got a handle on using Wikipedia yet. I agree completely that the article should simply inform, not moralise (or glamourise). Changing the terminology is essential in doing that, though - as is getting rid of the generalisations and stereotypes. Ashkara sands 01:07, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Interesting you mention construction because that's what I do but I've never looked at a construction article (since I already know that stuff I have no need to look at it). To me the article was galmourising prostitution blaming pimps for most the violence and saying that if only the girls were free from pimps and the police there would be no problems. As I'm sure you are well aware it is not only pimps and the police who abuse prostitutes. Another part of the article was lamenting the decline in prostitution around times square in new york. I also changed a part in the prison section that said someting along the lines that in prison education was not appropraite for prostitues becasue they work because they choose to. Well maybe in Germany, or amsterdam, and that's fine,and should be included that they have abandoned these schemes for whatever reasons. but if education is deemed by the courts in Canada and the United States as appropriate it certainly should be considered so, since wikipedia cannot pass legal rulings, and if the court says it's acceptable, well then that's that. TotallyTempo 03:31, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

• Construction workers probably don't need to check whether they're being misrepresented in encyclopedias. :)

The points you raised demonstrate the major flaw in this article - it is way too US-centric. From street workers being named and shamed on the internet, to Nevada workers being kept in lock-down brothels like prisoners, I'm sure you realise that the way America treats the sex industry is different to most other countries in the world. Every country has it's own prostitution laws and each locality has laws within those laws (council regulations, local policing strategies, etc). Every sex worker has different levels of empowerment, generally according to the legal environment they work in, and that level of empowerment will dictate how she relates to police, clients and health services and how she performs her work. This is why it's so very important to ensure that only the facts of prostitution are provided, in a general overview that's applicable to all jurisdictions. It's not possible, or necessary, to go into minute detail about things like exit/retraining programs in each different locality. A broad section on the types of punishment meted out to street based workers around the world would be much more useful.

And people abuse sex workers - especially street workers - simply because they CAN. Illegality and stigma create a pool of women who can be raped and beaten with complete impunity, because the perpetrators know full well that the victim will not report the crime. Saying that sex workers should be able to work as independent businesswomen, with the full support of the law and access to legal recourse, is not 'glamourising' prostitution. It's a basic request for human and civil rights. Ashkara sands 01:26, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I didn't comment on why people abuse sex workers, I'm a construction worker, not a mental health professional. All I said was that it is not only pimps and the police who abuse sex workers, it is also clients. This cannot be argued, because it is a fact, a good example is the guy who lived next door to my highschool. He evidentley killed 26 prostitutes right next to the school. However, his trial is ongoing so I'm not entirely sure he is guilty though the evidence suggests so, or at least suggests complicity. (those bodeis got there some how). I am also sure that not all of the sex workers problems come from illegality. Nonetheless, saying that sex workers should have lwas changed in POV. Perhaps it should read instead of "laws should change to allow sex workers such and such" it should say "many human and civil rights organisations have argued for changing the prostitution laws in "these" countries because these human rights groups believe that "these" laws violate such and such of some UN stuff blah blah blah..but hey.... it's friday baby...have a beer.

This article extolls the benefits of street prostitution compared to other types of prostitution. That's hilarious. Also its POV and unencyclopedic. CJ DUB 23:09, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

This craziness

Its insane a profession like hooking would have "fancruft". This article reads like a teenage boy adding remakrs about his favourite automobile on a Ferrari page. FIX IT, AND DON'T GLAMORIZE THIS PROFESSION. Jeez after reading this I feel like submitting a resume. Some totally preposterous remarks or claims:

• " This type of sex work offers the most freedom while it can sometimes be the least respected and most dangerous form of prostitution."

• " Street prostitution is easy and sometimes more profitable than other types of sex work in a society which is generally hostile to transsexuals and young sex workers. "

• "Street prostitution is a viable alternative for many young poor women who otherwise wouldn't be able to make a decent living, because of the lack of opportunities. "

A quick look at the lives of hookers, who were eventually killed by Robert Pickton/otherwise, shows how awesome this profession is. CJ DUB 00:41, 15 July 2007 (UTC) \Yo that's the guy I was talking about, my highschool was about 5 lots down from his farm. Crazy huh? TotallyTempo 14:53, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

The ORigination of the Term "Hooker" should be included

I just saw a documentary that said the term hooker originated in new york or ny city in an area geographically shaped like a hook along the water maybe manhattan? that is called hook. . . something? Any New Yorkers out there, help out a bit with the name of this strip of land along the coast in New York. Lots of sex workers used to frequent there hence the term "hooker".

Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.108.94.103 (talk) 20:55, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Pimp Section and Gender Bias

I removed the pimp section because it seemed to be pure stereotyping and original research, and had an unreferenced section template that had been there since October. If anyone finds legitimate sources on pimps, then I encourage you to add the section back in.

Also, I made some changes to remove gender bias. There were several parts of the article that implied that all street prostitutes are women and all customers are men, which is most certainly not the case. It would be nice if this article had information about male (transgender or otherwise) prostitutes, if it differs from the information about female prostitutes. Ketsuekigata (talk) 03:22, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Removed globalise tag

I've removed the globalise tag from the Risk & Research section. Info from Bangladesh, Canada, Colombia, Germany, Mexico, South Africa, Thailand, Turkey, UK, United States, and Zambia would seem to satisfy a global outlook. John B123 (talk) 13:24, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Coloring the legality status stuff

I would like a colorable map where I can draw up the street prostitution legality statuses. Where can I get a colorable map? I also would like to make sure the country borders can be pre-done so that I can insert colors in with no problems. Qwertyxp2000 (talk | contribs) 05:08, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

Hi Qwertyxp2000, try File:BlankMap-World.svg. Regards. --John B123 (talk) 06:39, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

John B123 Cool. Do I use Inkscape to color in the SVG? Qwertyxp2000 (talk | contribs) 02:51, 19 April 2021 (UTC)

Hi Qwertyxp2000, that's what I use. --John B123 (talk) 06:17, 19 April 2021 (UTC)

More current language

This article is pretty out of date with the current acceptable language used for this topic. Although prostitution as a topic might be acceptable, sex workers and sex work are more of the main stream words used to describe people in this area of work. Would anyone be opposed to changing it or adding a new section that talks about the more modern words we use?

--Janestring (talk) 20:19, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi Janestring. Whilst sex work/sex worker is the modern 'politically correct' term, there are those that are opposed to the term. In particular supporters of the Nordic model, who view the inclusion of 'work' as legitimising prostitution which they oppose. To confuse things further there are variations of sex work/er, for example UNAIDS uses FSW (female sex worker) for females but MSM (men who have sex with men) for males. Others use FSSW (full service sex worker) to differentiate between those engaged in prostitution to other types of sex workers. In more general terms, using sex work/er instead of prostitution/prostitute can lead to confusion in certain circumstances as sex work includes pornography, stripping etc. as well as prostitution. There was a previous discussion about this following edit warring on several articles between those who supported the use of sex work/er and those supporting prostitution/prostitute. The general feeling during the discussion was that either terminology was acceptable but that existing articles should not be changed to use different terminology. Regards. --John B123 (talk) 23:08, 6 December 2023 (UTC)