Talk:Snow tire

First post

Encyclopedia Britannica has a snow tire article. Chergles (talk) 21:18, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

This article can grow. We can include material on how the rubber is different, tread pattern, manufacturers, use of studs, where studs are illegal and why, etc. Chergles (talk) 21:19, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Aren't snow tyres compulsory during winter, in Germany? I came here to find out more about that, but the article is just a stub. Jason404 (talk) 15:55, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

No, they aren't. They are just compulsory if the conditions require them. Some areas of Germany get snow so irregularly that it would be pointless to have a blanket requirement for them. You're not supposed to drive in snow with summer tyres though.

Quebec first to implement snow tyre law? Winter/Snow Tyres have been a legal requirement in Sweden since Dec 1999. 188.223.101.209 (talk) 14:17, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Winter tires in Norway

I see plenty of websites saying that winter tires are not compulsory in Norway, but I tend to give more weight to this official U.S. website, which says that they are required "from November to April". I will see if I can find any official Norwegian source for this. Mikenorton (talk) 23:37, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Winter tires are required only on heavy vehicles. For light vehicles there is only a general rule saying that the driver is obliged to use tires that gives sufficient friction. Studded tires (tires wiht spikes) are allowed April-October only according to conditions. I have modified the paragraph. --Erik den yngre (talk) 09:07, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

When first marketed?

It would improve the article to give some history on snow tires, for example, when were they first marketed? Possibly before WW 2 (1939 - 1945)? Or after? I would assume that prior to the advent of snow tires, the installiation of chains was the primary method of obtaining satisfactory traction on heavy snow or ice.--TGC55 (talk) 01:13, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Some history: http://www.wintertyres-yorkshire.co.uk/winter-tyres-a-brief-history/ JSoos (talk) 10:45, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

Dead link

Please remove all links are dead! Thanks for earlier!--109.67.200.83 (talk) 23:21, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Disadvantages?

Presumably winter and snow tires have disadvantages, or they would be used throughout the year. Can anybody add information about this? --Ef80 (talk) 17:03, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

• They wear out quicker. Some claim they make more noise. They often have directional tread pattern. Load ratings and speed ratings are less. If you feel the need to add this, you can do so, but I don't have any of this sourced so any entry could be deleted. --Dana60Cummins (talk) 17:53, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

(ec)Studded tires are banned in some inner city areas of Scandinavia in the winter, because of the fine particles produced from the road surface when snow/ice is not there - this has been linked to an increase in breathing difficulties for some people. I got that from someone in Sweden, so I don't have a source to hand, but I'll take a look around. Studded tires are also only used in winter because of the damage they cause to the roads (it's also why several countries ban them completely). More generally with snow tires, they are presumably not optimum for grip and/or wear during non-winter conditions. Sorry not to be able to support any of that with sources, but If I find any I'll be back. Mikenorton (talk) 17:55, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Swedish laws

Here is the link to the office publishing the regulations: http://www.transportstyrelsen.se/en/road/Vehicles/winter-tyres/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.181.175.124 (talk) 23:14, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Needs to be extended

This article should be more detailed especially for something which is so much a part of everyday life for many of us. The section about requirements in Europe is insufficient considering there are 51 countries in Europe. Why no mention of Poland, Russia, Sweden and other countries?--ЗAНИA ^{talk WB talk}] 19:59, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Sweden is one of 15 countries that are listed, but we do need information on Russia, Poland, Serbia, Belgium, Denmark, Albania, Hungary, Luxembourg, Slovakia, Croatia, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova, Montenegro, Macedonia, Netherlands, Liechtenstein, Ireland and Iceland. Spain, Portugal and Greece probably use them in mountainous areas, although we can probably leave out Malta, Monaco, San Marino and the Vatican City. Perhaps a table would be good way of presenting this information, when we get it? Mikenorton (talk) 20:28, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Snow tires vs. winter tires

Somebody thought these articles were describing the same thing and combined them. Snow tires have been around for the better part of a century but winter tires are something new in the last few years being promoted by the sales people as having softer rubber compounds for use in cold weather. Snow tires have large lugs on them for grip in snow or sand. After some research I have never found the softer rubber compounds claimed by tire manufacturers. Some real references would be good to validate the sales hype . These articles or at least descriptions need to be kept separate. 174.118.142.187 (talk) 14:31, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

I disagree. In the Nordic context winter tires and snow tires is one and the same thing, and have been so for some 40-50 years. There are perhaps some special purpose "Mud & Snow" types made for offroad driving, I don't think these are used on public roads in the Nordic area. --Erik den yngre (talk) 09:11, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

I agree that the current snow tires/winter tires distinction doesn't make sense. See for example Nokian tyres English page for passenger cars, it talks about winter tyres throughout. Similarly, Michelin and Goodyear also categorize all of their winter/snow tyres as winter tires. Additionally, all the current references of the article seem to be talking about winter tires, not snow tires. 109.204.245.233 (talk) 16:05, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Regional rules

Why is much of the article taken up with regional rules for use of snow tires? This appears to me to be much too detailed and particular to specific regions—not of general interest, especially where there is no requirement. There are no citations, as well. So, I propose drastically condensing this section. Anybody disagree? User:HopsonRoad 04:25, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Deletion of images

IP user 208.100.156.100 has twice deleted images here. The images illustrate the concepts described in Snow tire#Tire–snow interactions. Please don't delete these images without a good explanation. Sincerely, User:HopsonRoad 20:12, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

hi i removed a non-applicable picture of a car and added an applicable picture of a snow tire, along with improving captions and formatting, please check the edit diffs next time instead of assuming all IP edits are vandalism, thanks! 208.100.156.100 (talk) 20:49, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply, here, 208.100.156.100. I apologize if I misread your intentions. I did check your contributions history and it did not lead me to conclude that you were experienced in WP—a risk that an IP editor runs who doesn't edit from a single spot.

As to the Russian street scene, I chose it in place of some earlier, irrelevant images, because it was one of few images available on Wikimedia Commons that illustrated the need for snow tires in real conditions. Otherwise, the article only shows the tire and its immediate reaction with snow. Sincerely, User:HopsonRoad 21:31, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

commons has a bunch of better snowy roads roads than that one too, thats where i found the other snow tire pic, i will see what i can do 208.100.156.100 (talk) 21:59, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

I appreciate your interest in this, 208.100.156.100. I felt that the Russian picture showed tires on snow, whereas your recent choice shows only delayed traffic, which could happen with an accident ahead. The opposite lane has no traffic, so an accident may have occurred further up. Cheers, User:HopsonRoad 22:09, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for your continued efforts, 208.100.156.100. The Japanese image shows tire-road interaction, but the road is little more than wet—not that big a challenge for regular tires. Cheers, User:HopsonRoad 22:21, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

Russia already covered

An IP user keeps creating a special mention of Russia as follows: "In Russia light vehicles and buses must be equipped with snow M+S or 3PMSF tires on all axles from December through February and have a minimum tread depth of 4 millimetres (0.2 in)". This violates WP:UNDUE, since Russia is already covered in equal measure to other European countries in previous edits. I leave it to someone else to address this in order to avoid WP:3RR. HopsonRoad (talk) 21:04, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Studded tyres in Great Britain

FozzieHey, there appears to be no direct legislation, barring studded tyres in Great Britain. According to this source, "Although there is no specific legislation in the UK which references the use of studded tyres, they are generally considered not fit for use in the UK. Correct usage of studded tyres requires thick and even levels of snow on the road. So, under the laws that revolve around suitable use of items on automotive vehicles – studded tyres would most likely be found unsuitable. They also cause damage to the roads, so this too would likely result them being deemed not suitable." HopsonRoad (talk) 22:05, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

@HopsonRoad: Thanks, I found that source as well. This does seem to be the correct answer, other sources do say that it is illegal but provide no references to any specific legislation which would indicate that being the case. FozzieHey (talk) 22:09, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

Requested move 11 January 2025

Snow tire → Winter tire – Article is for both 'winter tire' and 'snow tire', but the former is by far the more utilized phrase. Further, people are regularly confused that snow tires are only for snow, and that there is no improvement in having winter tires when it is cold but not snowy, which is not the case, and dangerous. Excelsiorsbanjo (talk) 05:22, 11 January 2025 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). Steven Crossin ^{Help resolve disputes!} 13:49, 11 January 2025 (UTC)

• Weak support. I agree with the nominator's point that the term "winter tires" is more broadly applicable. The usual sources for assessing COMMONNAME, though, do not seem to support the move. This Ngrams search shows that "snow tires" is more common than "winter tires". Google Trends (searches, not sources) shows a very small preference for "winter tire". Jstor, not known for covering this kind of topic, shows significantly more results for "snow tires" than "winter tires". Toadspike [Talk] 15:21, 11 January 2025 (UTC)
• Oppose. Snow tire is the common name, per Toadspike's stats. There is no indication that winter tires and snow tires are two different things, rather than alternative names for the same thing. ~~ Jessintime (talk) 22:53, 11 January 2025 (UTC)

• Support: Just looking at this it seems that 'snow tyre' is a very rarely used combination (indeed not one that I've ever heard used in the UK). I'm not suggesting we turn 'tire' to 'tyre', but I think there is an argument to use 'winter' per WP:COMMONALITY. YorkshireExpat (talk) 19:44, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

  Now that is an interesting new rationale, and one I can get behind. FWIW, this might be a European thing: The German, French, Italian, and Spanish Wikipedia articles are all at "winter", not "snow". Toadspike [Talk] 05:23, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

  @Toadspike, that's interesting. I assumed it was a marketing thing, because in the UK we don't get massive amounts of snow (apart from last week, or maybe in Scotland) but it does get cold enough to justify a winter tyre. The other countries you mention do get significant snow, however. YorkshireExpat (talk) 16:31, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose. WP:COMMONALITY says to use universally accepted terms rather than those less widely distributed. But I am doubtful that 'winter tires' is universally accepted. For example, Wikipedia's articles use 'snow tires' by a very large majority. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 20:57, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

  Our article is at the title "snow tire", so obviously all the links go to "snow tire" (including Julier Pass, where the words "snow tire" were added by yours truly).

  Your point stands, though: A more accurate search compares [1] to [2], which gives 67 hits for "snow tire" and 10 for "winter tire" (not case sensitive). Toadspike [Talk] 21:05, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

  Well, for a start 'tire' is not a universally recognised spelling. Secondly, using Wikipedia itself is off limits because WP:WINARS. Thirdly, you being doubtful is not evidence. YorkshireExpat (talk) 22:32, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

  I'm not saying 'tire' is universally recognized. I'm just saying that WP:COMMONALITY pertains to cases when there is a universally recognized spelling. And if WP:COMMONALITY does not apply, then we ought to heed WP:COMMONNAME. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 19:22, 19 January 2025 (UTC)

  Indeed, and 'snow tyre' is not widely used in the UK, but 'winter tyre' is. Both 'winter tire' and 'snow tire' are both widely understood in the US, even if 'snow tire' is more common. That's WP:COMMONALITY. YorkshireExpat (talk) 19:35, 19 January 2025 (UTC)

• Weak oppose at least in the USA it seems snow is slightly more preferred but used rather interchangeable. google trends shows a definite bias towards snow. But again lots of mixed useable between winter and snow, partially due to some of the reasons provided above. TiggerJay (talk) 16:45, 19 January 2025 (UTC)

  I think unfortunately this is just a case where Google Trends is being unclear. Although it is clear about how it is unclear, as at your link it states "This comparison contains both Search terms and Topics, which are measured differently.". You are comparing the "search term" of 'winter tire' with the "topic" of "snow tire". But there's much more to it than that.

  The problem with using Google Trends to see which of two frequently interchangeably used terms is that for many results both terms will be used on the same page. In the past this could be accounted for by having Trends compare, for example, '"winter tire" -"snow tire"' to '"snow tire" -"winter tire"', basically explicitly excluding each item from each result, and also quoting to ensure the entire phrase is what's considered, rather than the two words 'winter' & 'tire', or 'snow' & 'tire'. Google Trends does not seem to facilitate this type of comparison any longer, at least not straightforwardly.

  Anyway if we modify your link to use a "search term" for both 'winter tire' and 'snow tire', the two become much closer.

  https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=winter%20tire,snow%20tire&hl=en-US

  If we put them in quotes, they become closer still.

  https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=%22winter%20tire%22,%22snow%20tire%22&hl=en-US

  The real issue is that these two terms aren't being properly separated from one another, even at this point.

  If you look at any of these links, the results simply do not match reality, and this is easily verified by doing two separate Google searches and looking at the number of results:

  • winter tire : 177,000,000
  • snow tire : 137,000,000
  • "winter tire" : 2,560,000
  • "snow tire" : 693,000
  • "winter tire" -"snow tire" : 2,540,000
  • "snow tire" -"winter tire" : 601,000

  When you compare these ordinary results to Google Trends', there is an inverse relationship, where Google Trends' results are the opposite of ordinary search results. This is because Google Trends simply is not able to differentiate between the two terms usefully enough. It really was and is not designed for this purpose.

  As you can see from the ordinary search results, 'winter' is really overwhelmingly more used. Excelsiorsbanjo (talk) 06:19, 22 January 2025 (UTC)