Talk:Robert Hand

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Arhatmedia (Robert Hand, biography owner. Email robhand@arhatmedia.com before making changes.)

Uhh--Wikipedia doesn't work that way--you can't just show up and delete 2/3 of an article, put together by a score of people over the last five years, without discussing it a bit. And what is this claim that Rob Hand "owns" this article? No one owns anything here. You need to discuss this a bit. So, please, let us know here, on this page, something about your intentions. Thanks.--Anthon.Eff (talk) 04:02, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

I have restored the autobiography tag I put on yesterday. Awaiting clarification on that matter.

In its current state this BLP is an AfD candidate. Needs 'independant' quality sources. The subject of a biography article is generally allowed to suggest new material or sources on the Talk page, but should not work on their 'own' article. MakeSense64 (talk) 06:11, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

This is clearly someone struggling to correct inaccurate information on their own biography - which quite obviously has not been created by them! The history and development of this page is available for anyone to examine. So I *am* removing that autobiography tag which should not be on this page. And I suggest that you allow this struggling new contributor to make their point unheeded, so that the content can be examined and corrected by editors who are capable of doing that. If the contributor - biography owner or not - wants to contest inaccurate information then allow them to do that, and don't delete or revert until they have been able to demonstrate the problem they are concerned about.

Rather than keep tagging, please pay attention to the tag at the top of this page: "This article and talk page must adhere to the policy on biographies of living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if there are other concerns about the biography of a living person, please report the issue to the biographies of living persons noticeboard. If you are connected to the subject of this article and need help with issues related to it, please see this page."

Here we see a contributor who has not yet realised that the link to the discussion page offers the solution to their problem. Yes you might think it strange that he/she doesn't understand WP policy. He/she might think you are incredibly obstroculous to keep reverting the edits as they are being made. Either way if the biography owner considers there is inaccurate information on the page, then since that information lacks citation, you are obliged to let them make whatever cut to the content required. And they can correct it also, if they wish Zac Δ talk 22:03, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

Like you, Zachariel, I don't want to be disrespectful to Robert Hand. But Arhatmedia could as well be the random teenager with a computer. So best to treat Arhatmedia like any other editor: he shouldn't make dramatic changes (neither additions nor deletions) without good sources to justify them.--Anthon.Eff (talk) 01:45, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

To all in this forum. My name is Aaron Crawford, and I represent Robert Hand and the corrections I made where to better present Mr. Hand, and give a more detailed outline of his life, career etc up to this point. Everything that I have done is under review by Mr. Hand himself, and no, Arhat Media isnt a teenager with a keyboard. Its Robert Hands company, which Im the VP of. If you have any issues or concerns, please contact us. Im in favor of neutrality, and encourage any relevant information to be added to this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crawaaron (talk • contribs) 22:51, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

You cannot claim exclusive rights to a Wikipedia page, see ownership policy and WP:BULLY. Also, please familiar yourself with paid editors, your edits need to maintain Wikipedia policy, which includes adding reliable sources, something your edits have failed to do. Joseph2302 (talk) 23:04, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Im not claiming any rights, just trying to get the page to look nice and state the information that represents Robert Hand. I'm still trying to figure my edits out. Why are you trying to push me around? Im not a "paid editor" either, nor do I appreciate the connotation. And what better source for an article on Robert Hand is Robert Hand? Who are you anyway? -Feb 26 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crawaaron (talk • contribs) 23:19, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Crawaaron Please read and follow the WP:COI guideline, and please learn the policies the govern Wikipedia content. You will find them in the welcome message I left at your Talk page. You are making very strong statements, but you do not understand the policies and guidelines that govern this website. If you continue, you will find yourself blocked. Please slow down and ask more questions. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 23:44, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

I will take closer look at the guidelines and get a better grip on the policies that govern wikipedia. I just wanted to update his content. Thank you for helping with the citations. Im curious though, were the awards and honors removed because of the difficulty finding sources? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crawaaron (talk • contribs) 23:53, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

right now they are unsourced, and unsourced puffery is as bad as (!) unsourced negative stuff. people trust WP as much as they do because we try to make sure everything is based on some reliable, independent source. it's really beautiful when you think about it. Jytdog (talk) 00:48, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Sources

Crawaaron I am sore tempted to nominate this article for deletion. It would be a pretty simple process, and the article would be deleted, since it has no sources to speak of. Please read Wikipedia:Notability (people) - that document describes the criteria for keeping or deleting an article about a person. The #1 thing we need, are independent, reliable sources about Hand. For example, this. Sources published by Hand are of very limited utility for proving NOTABILITY. So here is what you can do. Please find, and list here, independent, reliable sources about Hand. I and others can work with you to write article content based on them. But since you are getting paid, why don't you do the legwork. That would work OK. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 00:05, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Ok. I appreciate it. Here are a handful of sources.

• http://wiki.astro.com/astrowiki/en/Hand%2C_Robert
• http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_astrobyhand9_e.htm
• https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMc0Za1Atu8 (A&E TV Show)
• http://www.kepler.edu/home/index.php/about/who-we-are/bot
• http://astrologyking.com/robert-hand/
• http://www.astrosage.com/celebrity-horoscope/robert-hand-horoscope.asp
• http://www.astrology.co.uk/RobHand.htm
• http://www.stariq.com/astrologybyhandlib.htm
• http://www.accessnewage.com/articles/astro/hand1.htm
• http://history.cua.edu/graduate/PreviousCompletedDissertations.cfm — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crawaaron (talk • contribs) 00:42, 27 February 2015 (UTC)
• http://theastrologypodcast.com/2013/12/09/robert-hand-reconciling-modern-traditional-astrology/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crawaaron (talk • contribs) 00:26, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you! some people can be really combative, and i appreciate your willingness to work within the guidelines and policies. saves so much drama!! OK, please actually read WP:RS. wikis are not reliable. youtube is not reliable. things written by Hand are not independent. bloggy things are not reliable. things like the source I provided above, are what we need. This is not just shit I am making up. WP has been around a long time, and the community has developed these guidelines and policies, and they are what keep this place sane and credible. i hope that makes sense. if not, please ask! thanks! Jytdog (talk) 00:44, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

and please remember, everything in the article needs a source. So look back at the article, and if you want the article to say that he graduated from Brandeis (much less magna sum laude) we need a reliable, independent source that says that. stuff like his birthday too! everything. see WP:VERIFY and WP:BLP. thanks again. Jytdog (talk) 00:47, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for assisting me, and I understand the need for credible sources. At first I didn't understand, but now it makes me appreciate Wikipedia and what people like yourself are doing to maintain it. I will look through and gather what I can. Due to Robert Hands age, its hard to find anything from his early years online. I will also distance myself from articles with subject matter that's close to me in the future. Thanks again. crawaaron (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 18:03, 27 February 2015 (UTC)