Talk:Oscar Pistorius/GA1

GA review

I'm going to put the article on hold. Here's a list of things I think can be improved or looked at.

• The lead says he is world record holder at 100m, 200m and 400m, yet the infobox only has WR next to the first two.
  • Comment: The infobox parameter is for the athlete's personal best. The source in the footnote indicates that Pistorius's personal best for the 400 m is 46.34 s, but this is faster than the world records he has set at official tournaments.

• I feel the lead is too long in line with WP:LEAD. It looks to be about one-third of the size of the text of the main article.
  • Comment: It's going to be difficult to reduce the length of the lead without omitting useful information, and it doesn't really seem excessively long. Also, I note that "Wikipedia:Lead section#Length" suggests that for an article around 32Kb in length the lead should be about two to three paragraphs in length. It doesn't say anything about the length of the text.

• "He attended the Pretoria Boys' High School, where he played rugby union in the third XV, Northern States water polo and state tennis between the ages of 11 and 13." I don't understand what he played for who.
  • Comment: I think he played for his school – he played rugby union in the school's third team, represented his school in water polo in Northern States competitions, and played tennis for his state.

• "Never looked back." I'd suggest putting this in quotes or add a quote to the reference. Otherwise it's a bit cliched.
  • Fixed.

• currently studying, I'd get rid of currently - see WP:DATE
  • Fixed.

• "major competition" - either define major competition or change the wording. It looks a bit POV.
  • Fixed.

• What's the "T44 100-metre event"?
  • Fixed: It's a disability sport class indicating that the athlete has had one leg amputated below the knee. Have added an explanation and a reference.

• "Despite falling in the preliminary round for the 200 metres, he qualified for the final." How did he qualify despite falling.
  • Comment: He must have got up, continued running and completed the race within the cut-off time for qualification.

• "and in March 2007, he finished second in the same competition with an improved time of 46.56 seconds" Isn't this information repeated a couple of sentences down.
  • Fixed: Well spotted!

• "He finished behind Stefano Braciola's time of 46.72 seconds" I presume he was second to Stefano Braciola, I'd suggest rewording to "On 13 July 2007, Pistorius ran in the 400-metre race at Rome's Golden Gala and finished second in run B with a time of 46.90 seconds, behind Stefano Braciola, who ran 46.72 seconds."
  • Fixed.

• I'd consider renaming the "Dispute over perceived advantages" (it seems a little POV to me) to something like "Dispute over blades"
  • Fixed: Changed the subheading to "Dispute over prosthetics".

• "due to" - I prefer because of, "due to" is more time rather than causal.
  • Really? Not sure about that. But I've fixed the issue anyway.

• "Pistorius has been the subject of criticism due to claims that his artificial limbs, which are J-shaped carbon-fibre prosthetics called "Cheetahs" manufactured by Icelandic company Össur, give him an advantage, including the fact that the "blades" he uses are longer than is necessary, allowing him to cover more ground in each stride, that the Cheetahs return more energy per stride without ever becoming fatigued or requiring the same "investment of energy" and that they are not subject to metabolite or lactic acid build-up that slows down ordinary athletes." - Very long sentence.
  • Fixed.

• "that they lose 20% of the energy they absorb, three times the energy lost by an organic leg." Again I don't understand what this means.
  • Fixed: Have rephrased this, following more closely what was stated in the source.

• 400 m - It's previously quoted as 400-metre. Why the change?
  • Comment: Do you mean the use of "400 m" in tables and headings? It's more compact.

• Time comparision, consider as of rather than current. Also this whole section seems to me to be WP:OR
  • Fixed: The article already states that the world and Olympic records are "as at 6 March 2008", so I deleted the word current used in the table. I don't think the information in the section is original research. It's all information that is in existing sources and just put together in a table for purposes of comparison.

• Other awards and personal life, are both very short sections and could do with expansion. Maybe put the personal life stuff in the background setion.
  • Comment: Will this be a problem for GA? I can't seem to find much more information about the subjects in English (I can't speak Afrikaans). Hopefully other editors will be able to expand these sections. Also, the information in the "Personal life" section seems a bit out of place in the "Background" section.

Get back to me when you've done. Peanut4 (talk) 12:53, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for taking the time to review the article. I've indicated my comments above. — Cheers, JackLee ^–talk– 01:25, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

GA review part II

• The infobox and lead still seem to contradict whether he is world record holder at 400m. It seems confusing to me. Even if he's unofficial world record holder at 400m, I think the lead should clarify as such.
  • Comment: Pistorius is the official world record holder at 400 m – I've updated the infobox to reflect this in the "World Finals" section. However, the infobox also calls for his "personal best" to be stated. Pistorius's personal best at 400 m is 46.34 s, which is faster than his official 400-m world record.

• I still think the lead is also far too long. It doesn't summarise the main page.
  • Comment: Can you specify which elements of the lead you think should be left out?

• School sports - it's still confusing. To me it appears he played rugby for school, and water polo and tennis at a higher level. Did he play water polo and tennis at school to qualify for state? That sentence needs re-writing, maybe even expanding and putting into two sentences.
  • Comment: From the Össur website, it appears that Pistorius participated in all these sports while at school. I've added this website as a reference and done some minor rephrasing.

• Fall at 200m. I would try find a source to say how he qualified for the final. At the moment the text appears he didn't finish the race but still qualified.
  • Comment: I haven't been able to find a specific reference. In any case, I don't think that's necessary. Clearly he completed the race despite falling and qualified for the final, otherwise it would have been impossible for him to go on and win the final.

• re: 400m. It's in the "dispute over prosthetics" section, in the second paragraph. I guess it should be 400-metre, but unsure.
  • Fixed.

• The small sections won't be a major problem. I still feel the personal life section can be put in the background bit, because it refers to his family, which are in the background section too.
  • Comment: I think it's fine to refer to a person's parents when talking about his or her early life, but information about the person's ancestors and other relatives is probably better placed in a "Personal life" section as it would appear odd for there to be a long description of these individuals so early in the article. See, for instance, "Laurence Fox".

• No worries, regarding the time comparison table, your explanation seems fine to me. I totally understand why you've added the table in, but I'd be ready to defend any other claims about OR.
  • Comment: OK.

• Do you have a reference for this "Pistorius and his coach, Ampie Louw, reject these allegations, saying that his prosthetics do not give him an unfair advantage. They have brought up disadvantages that Pistorius faces, such as rain (which leaves traction hard to attain), wind (which blows the devices sideways), and the fact that he needs more energy to start running than others."
  • Fixed: It's from the New York Times article already referred to elsewhere.

Otherwise great work so far. Peanut4 (talk) 12:58, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Have made some changes to the article and responded to your latest comments above. — Cheers, JackLee ^–talk– 01:35, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

More comments

• Re: 400m WR. I'm still a little confused. Would I be right to say his personal best is actually quicker than his own world record, and so his personal best is an unofficial time? If so, I would add a footnote next to his PB in the infobox, to say he also holds the world record. My concern about the contradiction, is that the infobox doesn't suggest he holds the 400m World Record.
  • Comment: Yes, that would appear to be the case. There is a news article stating his personal best time for the 400 m, but that would appear to be an unofficial time because it is faster than the official world record time that he clocked. I've added his world record time in parentheses behind the personal best time.

• Re: Lead. I would try summarise the following text in two sentences, and that ought to suffice.

In 2007, the International Association of Athletics Federations (IAAF) amended its competition rules to ban the use of "any technical device that incorporates springs, wheels or any other element that provides a user with an advantage over another athlete not using such a device". It claimed that the amendment was not specifically aimed at Pistorius. After monitoring his track performances using high-definition cameras and analyzing the information, scientists determined that Pistorius enjoyed considerable advantages over athletes without prosthetic limbs. On the strength of these findings, on 14 January 2008 the IAAF ruled him ineligible for competitions conducted under its rules, including the 2008 Summer Olympics. Pistorius is likely to appeal the decision.

• • Fixed: If I understand you correctly, you've suggested that I delete the following paragraph: "On 13 July 2007, Pistorius ran in the 400-metre B-race at the Golden Gala in Rome and was placed second with a time of 46.90 seconds. Two days later, on 15 July 2007, he ran in the 400-metre race at the Norwich Union British Grand Prix at the Don Valley Stadium in Sheffield. Pistorius finished last in wet conditions and was later disqualified for running out of his lane." I've done so. However, I think this paragraph was inserted because the Golden Gala and British Grand Prix marked Pistorius's début in international able-bodied races.

• School sports still doesn't make sense. From your reply above, I would suggest something along changing the following

He attended the Pretoria Boys' High School, where he played rugby union in the school's third XV team, water polo at the Northern States level, and state tennis between the ages of 11 and 13. into

He attended the Pretoria Boys' High School, where he played rugby union in the school's third XV team, water polo and tennis. He also played water polo and tennis at state level.

• • Fixed.

• Re: Fall at 200m. The actual fall isn't referenced. If you can find a reference then a minor tweak, which will be extremely easy because the reference to his win, already states his time.
  • Oh, I see what you mean. OK, fixed.

• On the whole, I think we're pretty nearly there. Peanut4 (talk) 00:27, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your useful suggestions. As always, my comments are above. — Cheers, JackLee ^–talk– 14:58, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Passed GA

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it reasonably well written?

   A. Prose quality:

   B. MoS compliance:

2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?

   A. References to sources:

   B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:

   C. No original research:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. Major aspects:

   B. Focused:

4. Is it neutral?

   Fair representation without bias:

5. Is it stable?

   No edit wars, etc:

6. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?

   A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:

   B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

This is a really nice piece of work. Obviously it would be great to get a picture of Pistorius himself, and make sure you're ready to defend the inclusion of the comparison table. But it's certainly a great start. Peanut4 (talk) 21:04, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Brilliant! Again, thanks very much for making the effort to review this article. — Cheers, JackLee ^–talk– 22:06, 26 March 2008 (UTC)