Talk:Nelson Agholor

Semi-protected edit request on 15 March 2021

Aghlor plays for the Patriots so team needs changing 2A00:23C6:279A:9A01:9BA:9759:7484:D249 (talk) 22:35, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Eagles 24/7 (C) 22:36, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 March 2021

The link below shows Nelson Agholor is on the Patriots. https://www.nfl.com/news/patriots-agree-to-terms-with-wr-nelson-agholor SteelerFan1933 (talk) 21:18, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

 Already done P,TO 19104 (talk) (contribs) 19:53, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

The wiki BLP policy in regard to allegations

Nelson Agholor was accused of raping an exotic dancer in 2016. The rape allegation is very real even though there was "insufficient evidence" to bring criminal charges against Agholor according to the district attorney of the city that he plays professional football in. This incident is a significant event in the subject's life, and is pertinent to this wiki.

https://www.inquirer.com/philly/news/20160719_No_charges_for_Agholor_in_strip_club_incident.html 2376453Z (talk) 06:04, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

This does not belong in the lede, let alone in the first line. And if he wasn't even charged, let alone convicted, then it is not likely even going to be mentioned in the article. Meters (talk) 03:36, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

I have protected this page as it appears to be the result of repeated attempted BLP disputes. Remember, Wikipedia's WP:BLP policy is serious, and dismissed and unproven allegations of crimes are serious, and should not be taken lightly. Per WP:BLPCRIME editors must seriously consider not including material—in any article—that suggests the person has committed, or is accused of having committed, a crime, unless a conviction has been secured. If this accusation is to be included, there MUST be a clear consensus to include it. As there does not appear to be any agreement to include the information so far, the people who wish to add the information MUST establish a clear and unambiguous consensus to do so. As soon as there is a consensus one way or the other on this talk page, ping me and I'll lift the protection. --Jayron32 19:01, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

This has been added to the lead seven times by User:2376453Z (three times in February, twice in March. and now twice in August). It has been removed by me, user:Pennsylvania2, user:Larry Hockett, user:Eagles247, and user:Yankees10. Yes, he was accused of sexual assault (or rape, depending on the source) of a strip bar dancer while they were in a private room at the club. Multiple reliable sources confirm this. Multiple reliable sources also state that the accusation was thoroughly investigated and no charges were filed. I won't add refs because a simple Google search returns multiple reliable hits for both of points. When this issue was raised at BLPN in March Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard/Archive325#Nelson_Agholor and User:Fences and windows pointed out a source https://www.nj.com/eagles/2016/06/details_nelson_agholor_rape.html#incart_2box_nj-homepage-featured which reported a claim that the accusation was the result of a dispute over money.

As has been pointed out several times, the lead is a summary of the rest of the article, so this does not belong in the lead, let alone as the first sentence of the lead as in the most recent additions (e.g., [1]) when it is not mentioned in the body of the article.

Even if this were covered in the body of the article, I do not believe that this would warrant being covered in the lead. A single accusation that did not lead to a conviction or even a charge is not lead-worth. Note that if this were to be included in the article, it would have to be neutral. Reporting that he was accused, but not convicted or even charged is a violation of WP:NPOV.

In my mind, the only question is whether a mere accusation should be in the article at all, under WP:BLP rules. He is a professional athlete, but does not seem to meet the definition in Public figure, so WP:NOTPUBLICFIGURE should apply rather than WP:BLPPUBLIC. He's notable enough for an article because he's a pro football player, but not really well known. From NOTPUBLICFIGURE: Material that may adversely affect a person's reputation should be treated with special care, and from WP:BLPCRIME (expanding on the above quote given by Jayron32): For individuals who are not public figures; that is, individuals not covered by Public figures, editors must seriously consider not including material—in any article—that suggests the person has committed, or is accused of having committed, a crime, unless a conviction has been secured. Given that that there is some evidence this accusation was motivated by money concerns, and that he was not convicted or charged I think we should leave this out completely. If it is covered we certainly need to report that he was not charged. Meters (talk) 20:31, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Agree. This is a WP:BLP violation, and may merit rev/deletion at every point, as does the header of this discussion. What's of concern is the persistent push to not only include the allegation, but to place it in the lede. I'm going to request an administrator's attention, if none has been sought thus far. 2601:188:180:B8E0:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 (talk) 20:39, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Jayron32 , who placed the full protection, has asked for a ping once consensus is established. Meters (talk) 20:43, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

I've pinged Drmies and Ohnoitsjamie for their thoughts. 2601:188:180:B8E0:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

User:Jayron32, can you please make the call on what to revdelete? I'm just really not sure--it depends on the strength of the sourcing, and on the wording, and I have not read up on the material. What I have done is look at the editor's contributions, and decided that it was high time. It's a mystery their block log was clean. Drmies (talk) 00:32, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

I have revdeleted all of the relevant edits on this matter. They were all reverted quickly, so mostly it was a clean revdel situation. I will be removing protection presently, as there appears to be a clear consensus to keep the material out of the article. --Jayron32 12:06, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Agree with all the above (most definitely does not belong in the lede; an accusation without charge probably doesn't belong in the rest of the article. It seems like there was a lot of reporting on the initial accusations in early 2016, though the subsequent dropping of the case got less attention; this USA Today article from July 2016 (among similar ones in from Sports Illustrated and ESPN) makes it clear that no charges were filed due to insufficient evidence. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 01:19, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

We can invoke WP:NOTNEWS, since this doesn't appear to have legs. If an investigation is reopened and credible charges are filed, this can be revisited. Until then, it's reasonable to ask what purpose is served by keeping mention of unproven allegations in the edit history, other than possible defamation. 2601:188:180:B8E0:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 (talk) 02:40, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

I think we're safe to err on the side of WP:BLP and omit an allegation that didn't go anywhere. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 03:17, 23 August 2021 (UTC)