Talk:List of works by Frank Weston Benson

Comments - editing appreciated

This is still a work-in-progress, but it's at a point where comments and edits are appreciated!

I know I need to get more links to museums and galleries - I'll take care of that.--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:57, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Table format

I see that the table format for the Portraits of family members section was modified, which is fine and makes for easy sorting.

If there's not an intention to put the other tables in the same format, though, it should be reverted so that the article is consistent.

Is there an intention to update the other tables, too? Thanks!--CaroleHenson (talk) 00:44, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

In my opinion it would be more useful to have a single table which could be sorted in various ways (date, title, current owner). Having multiple tables means that it's not possible, for example, to see a chronological ordering of Benson's works.

It's unusual in a list of works to have as much biographical information which duplicates the Benson article. 99.232.61.43 (talk) 16:06, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

Sure, makes sense! Go for it!--CaroleHenson (talk) 16:21, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

Partial?

The title of this list indicates that it is comprehensive, but the lead uses the word "examples". This is confusing and should be clarified. Toccata quarta (talk) 20:30, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

Split?

Article is over 300 kB, and should be split. Thoughts? --Jax 0677 (talk) 22:49, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Oh, my goodness. I was offline much of the summer and had no idea what happened to the article - which used to be 40kb of works by Frank Weston Benson&oldid=551384390 this version.

Here are my thoughts:

• External links: There are a lot of external links, but they [many of which] tie back to the SIRIS system [and others link to images of works on web pages]. Since many of the external links are to be avoided within the article per WP:External links and WP:Manual of Style/Visual arts, my recommendation would be to remove the external links within the tables and add an external links to the External links section for SIRIS and Frank Weston Benson. Then, folks could search on their own. External links for images may also be SPAM issues.

• Great work on expanding works and images: It's great to have some many images and works now included in the article, so it would be good to sse what the size is after that.

• If the article is still too large after that, there are clear demarkations with "portraits..." sections to break into smaller articles and link at the top of this current article.

I'll go ahead and start removing external links -- to see how much of a difference that will make. Of course, earlier versions are available in history. Thoughts about this?--CaroleHenson (talk) 04:00, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Updates:

1. Since noone has weighed-in on this since November, I split the article into separate articles, see Template:Frank Weston Benson.
2. I created Category:Frank Weston Benson so that the "list" articles didn't show up on each of the categories numerous times (19th century painters, etc.).
3. Two of the lists are still very long List of waterscapes by Frank Weston Benson (72 kB) and List of wildlife works of art by Frank Weston Benson (137 kB).
4. The size can be reduced by removing the SIRIS search links, which are quite long.
   • I resolved that for the List of portraits by Frank Weston Benson by removing the links, putting the IPA#s into their own column, and having a note at the top of the column with the link to SIRIS to search by IPA#.
5. It seems that the links to websites for images are helpful, yet also seem to be issues for 1) bulking the lists up with the search criteria, 2) go against WP:External links and WP:Manual of Style/Visual arts guidelines about external links, 3) in some case potential WP:Spam issues and 4) are treading into WP:What Wikipedia is not territory.

Any thoughts about removal of the SIRIS links and the external links to web images?--CaroleHenson (talk) 09:22, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

I posted the question about the use of external links at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Visual arts#Use of external links to images on web pages--CaroleHenson (talk) 17:57, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Based upon the feedback there, I am formatting the external links as citations an putting the SIRIS numbers + a citation in the comments field. To make it easier to identify watercolors, etchings, etc. I've put that information into a separate field.

• Interiors and still life  Done--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:26, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
• Landscapes--CaroleHenson (talk) 04:53, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
• Murals  Done--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:26, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
• Portraits  Done--CaroleHenson (talk) 06:48, 6 April 2014 (UTC)
• Waterscapes
• Wildlife
• Other works

I'll keep working on it, and have it here to keep track.--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:26, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Related split / FWB works pages

There is also List of etchings by Frank Weston Benson - 177 kB - more than 3 times the guideline for max. size. It doesn't have SIRIS search links, but it has links to images on web pages.

There was List of paintings by Frank Weston Benson which was about the same size, and a subset of what had been the List of works by Frank Weston Benson, so I redirected it rather than having multiple pages with the same information. It was also tagged for a split.

Any thoughts about these pages?--CaroleHenson (talk) 09:22, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Hi CaroleHenson, I can do a similar exercise on these page(s) if you with, as I completed on this page, which only saves ~5% so may not meet the requirements as per above. If not, please advise so that I can then delete the tools I wrote and the data kept for this page as it will not be used unless the format is exactly the same (I have base tools I convert for specific needs), if I can help in any other way also please let me know.
Kind regards
The Original Filfi (talk) 10:55, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

I just realized that the etchings list is a subset of what was the 344 kB List of works by Frank Weston Benson, so the etchings and paintings lists were split apart from the larger "List of works". Since I split the "List of works" by types of subjects, etchings are not really needed as a separate and distinct list. And so, removing the extra spaces as you did on the "List of works" wouldn't be needed because you've already done that. I hope that makes sense.

Any thoughts about removing the links to the web pages?--CaroleHenson (talk) 17:33, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Hi again, I think this is now answered, and I agree with the methodology of the approach as per Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Visual arts#Use of external links to images on web pages dated 19:22, 31 March 2014 by czar, so my work is done here, unless there is anything else I can assist with?
The Original Filfi (talk) 02:18, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

@The Original Filfi:Hi,

That's a nice offer. If you're interested, it would be great to have help loading images of works made before 1923 into commons (Category=Frank Weston Benson) and then adding the link to the image in the table. For instance, in List of interiors and still lifes by Frank Weston Benson there are two more images that look like they could be uploaded. And other are others in the other "list of..." pages.

If so, that would be a great help!--CaroleHenson (talk) 05:48, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

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