Talk:Leonel Gómez Vides

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Leonel Gómez Vides/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Rublov (talk · contribs) 20:39, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

Hello, I will be reviewing this article shortly. Sorry that you had to wait four months for this.

Good Article review progress box

Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Lead and infobox

• Don't need a reference for date of death in the lead as it is already cited in the body.
  • Fixed, reference removed.
• The lead (and infobox) describes him as a coffee farmer and political activist, but he is certainly more notable for the latter than the former, and in fact the body only obliquely mentions his coffee farming activities.
  • Fixed, adjusted sentence accordingly.
• From a wealthy family → Born into a wealthy family is clearer I think.
  • Fixed, changed as suggested.
• He died in 2009 of a heart attack — Recommend removing this as the lead already states his year of death, and the fact that he died of a heart attack is not especially noteworthy.
  • Removed.

Early life

• I don't think you need to mention that December 31 is New Year's Eve as it is a fixed-date holiday.
  • Removed.
• Gómez attended... an undergraduate college in the United States — Does the source say which one?
  • Not specifically. He graduated from Fishburne Military School in VA for high school, and attended a "Florida agricultural college." No other source gives further information, as best as I can recall.

Activism and exile

• Too many participles used as adverbial phrases, most of which should be rephrased, e.g.
  • Described by historian Robert Wesson as...
  • Described by scholar Thomas Anderson as...
  • Advocating for land redistribution...
  • A cousin of poet Claribel Alegría...
  • ...building an extensive network of contacts
  • Fixed, I hope. If I've understood your comment correctly, I've rephrased each of these sentences to avoid the issue.
• an expert on the nature of the Salvadoran military → an expert on the Salvadoran military
  • Fixed.
• Gómez eventually became the general manager and deputy director of ISTA — When?
  • Comment - neither source says when, specifically. I also wanted to know and spent some time looking, but the information was not forthcoming.
• Gómez subsequently spent time in exile — Dates?
  • Comment - the earliest mention of him in exile in the US is 1982. I presume, but cannot verify, that he left nearly immediately after the death of Viera and did not return at all until 1989. As I can't verify the earlier date, though, I haven't included it in the article.
• Not strictly required for GA, but per MOS:QUOTE the terminal quotation mark of accused of being a communist... should come before the period.
  • Fixed.
• Some of these laudatory quotes are a borderline neutrality issue. I'd recommend trimming them.
  • Trimmed - let me know if I should go further.

Return to El Salvador

• Again, blockquote is probably too much.
  • Shortened the blockquote. Would you prefer I remove it entirely?
• He was married twice, to Eugenia B. Gómez and Teresa Arene–both marriages ended in divorce — Minor abuse of em dash; recommend semicolon or just regular period instead.
  • 'Fixed - went with a semicolon.
• was survived by two daughters from his first marriage, Margarita Gómez Zimmerman and Teresa Gómez Koudjeti, as well as four grandchildren — Sounds kind of like an obituary; not sure if notable enough to include in an encyclopedia article.
  • Shortened and broadened - let me know if it looks good now in context.
• Forché expressed a similar sentiment... — This sentence needs a reference.
  • Added reference.

General comments

• There is one image, and it is relevant and freely licensed.
• Earwig shows "Violation Possible" at 62.1%. This is largely on account of two long quotes, which I recommended trimming or removing above.
  • Hopefully fixed by my changes.
• The references to Forché's book need page numbers.
  • Fixed, reference improved.
• In the citation templates, The New York Times should be listed as a work, not a publisher, per Template:Cite news#Publisher.
  • Maybe fixed? - I think I understood what you were saying, but I'm no good with reference formatting. Let me know if I didn't actually fix it!
    • I think you should use Template:Cite news instead of Template:Cite web for the NYT. Not required for GA though. Ruбlov (talk) 19:27, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

Overall, the article is close to meeting the GA criteria. Putting on hold while comments are addressed. Ruбlov (talk) 21:44, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

@Rublov: I believe I have addressed all of your comments. Let me know what further changes need to be made, and thank you for the review! Ganesha811 (talk) 23:09, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

Second round

• Coffee farmer should also be removed from infobox.
  • Removed.
• The "Activism and exile" sections needs a bit of reorganization.
  • For one thing, it's mostly but not completely chronological, e.g. the first paragraph mentions a strike in 1980 but the next paragraphs talks about the start of the civil war the year before. I understand if the sources don't have dates for everything, but right now too many statements are simply undated. A little vagueness ("the early 1980s") is better than nothing.
  • Gómez came to know... — The first two sentences do not have any apparent connection to the rest of the paragraph about the civil war.
  • I don't object to the blockquote per se but it is not well-integrated into the section.
  • In 2019, Gómez was remembered... — This breaks the chronology as the next section starts in 1989. I suggest paraphrasing this (e.g., Gómez was viewed with suspicion by some elements of both the left and right) as there are already many quotes from people about Gómez in this article. Especially if you can cite it to a RS rather than his brother.
  • I recommend removing Walker's quote entirely; it's unusual to have a random praiseful quote in a biographical article like this.
• Whitfield's quote is fairly short and does not need to be a blockquote.
• was survived by — per MOS:SURVIVEDBY, it would be better to mention his children in the previous paragraph about his marriages. I don't think you need to mention his grandchildren.
• The split between "Activism and exile" and "Return to El Salvador" is a bit arbitrary because the first paragraph of the latter is closely connected to the last paragraph of the former. I'd recommend moving these to the previous section and renaming "Return to El Salvador" to "Later life".
  • Fixed. I have made a series of changes / re-organizations that I believe address all the concerns above. It's a definite improvement, so thank you for the suggestions!
• I'm sure you know better than I do about this, but isn't the proper way to refer to him "Gómez Vides" rather than just "Gómez"? e.g., this is how Gabriel García Márquez does it.
  • Comment - reliable sources generally refer to him as Gómez, so that's what I've gone with, but I believe either "Gómez Vides" or "Gómez" would be correct Spanish usage.

@Ganesha811: Thanks for the fixes. I've left a few more comments here. Ruбlov (talk) 17:28, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

@Rublov: made further fixes along the lines suggested above. :) Ganesha811 (talk) 18:01, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

Just a few remaining things. The one blockquote remains not well-integrated; I recommend introducing it with Gómez testified before the US Senate subcommittee on Inter-American affairs on March 11, 1981: or something like that, instead of having a separate caption. In the lead, Developing close relationships with American political figures is awkward. I suggest While in exile, Gómez developed close relationships with American political figures as its own sentence. Ruбlov (talk) 19:26, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

@Rublov I have fixed both these issues. The block quote should be better integrated now. Ganesha811 (talk) 01:18, 26 March 2022 (UTC)

Great, happy to pass this article. Ruбlov (talk) 11:20, 26 March 2022 (UTC)

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 08:33, 13 April 2022 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

Gómez in 1978

• ... that after Leonel Gómez Vides (pictured) died in 2009, one of his friends expressed surprise that he had not been murdered? Source: Sullivan, Patricia (December 15, 2009). Leonel Gómez, Salvadoran human rights activist, dies. The Washington Post. " 'It's amazing to me that Leonel died of natural causes and wasn't murdered, given the hornet's nests he stirred up time and time again,' McGovern said."
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/William Rees Jeffreys

Improved to Good Article status by Ganesha811 (talk). Self-nominated at 19:34, 26 March 2022 (UTC).

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Interesting article, very eye-catching hook. Relatively high similarity on Earwig's tool reflects the use of a length quote. Guettarda (talk) 17:36, 27 March 2022 (UTC) ALT0 to T:DYK/P1 without image

Formula One

@Nordschleife 00: I believe you, but the sources do say he was a Formula One driver. Do you have a source that contradicts this? Ganesha811 (talk) 23:12, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

"Leonel owned a small coffee farm, was an expert marksman, was a motorcycle racer and he had an interest in Formula One racing cars" (https://www.concordmonitor.com/Carolyn-Forche-and-how-we-remember-El-Salvador-34316614).

Searching for "Leonel Gómez Vides Formula 1" in Google is the only thing I find. I can't find anything that says he was just an enthusiast, but the fact that he's not on statsf1.com or any other F1 databases that list even drivers who "came close" shows he was never a driver. --Nordschleife 00 (talk) 23:21, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

I think that's reasonable, but the Washington Post obituary (link) does say that he was a driver, and I recall that Weissman said the same in his book (link), though I can't verify that as I no longer have the book in front of me. Do you think WaPo misinterpreted the facts, or something similar? Ganesha811 (talk) 00:06, 22 April 2022 (UTC)

New sources

Some new sources I've just clipped and hope to incorporate into the article:

• https://www.newspapers.com/clip/108006120/leonel-gomez-vides-1981-profile/
• https://www.newspapers.com/clip/108006257/profile-of-leonel-gomez-vides-1982/
• https://www.newspapers.com/clip/108006469/carolyn-forche-el-salvador/

—Ganesha811 (talk) 04:46, 21 August 2022 (UTC)