Talk:Johnny Carson

POV Issues in Section on Marriages

The section on Carson’s marriages states that “Under California’s community-property laws, she was entitled to 50% of all the assets accumulated during the marriage, though Carson earned virtually all of the couple’s income.”

The statement is inflammatory, and it suggests that Carson’s wife was greedy or otherwise acted inappropriately, or that the court made an improper decision. On the contrary, nothing out of the ordinary happened at all. Under California law, the earnings of each spouse, from the first moment of acquisition, belong to them equally, Cal. Fam. Code § 751, and in the event of a divorce (dissolution of marriage), absent contrary agreement between the spouses, the court is required to divide the community equally. Fam. Code § 2550.

The section, as written, attempts to portray Carson as some sort of victim, and it is inappropriate to do so.

John Paul Parks (talk) 14:54, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

I deleted the contested part, and some other bits in this section which were trivial and lacking citations. Perhaps the dispute notice can now be removed Nicmart (talk) 06:47, 4 August 2017 (UTC)

I cannot see a thing wrong about the statement, nor any implication of greed nor any NPOV issue.

"“Under California’s community-property laws, she was entitled to 50% of all the assets accumulated during the marriage, though Carson earned virtually all of the couple’s income.” (PeacePeace (talk) 19:51, 24 December 2018 (UTC))

Logic degree?

The current entry says that Carson left college after a year to join the Navy. This web page claims that he obtained a 1949 bachelor's degree in logic from the University of Nebraska: http://www.wisegeek.com/who-is-johnny-carson.htm The claim that he had a degree in logic was also made by one of the interviewees in a PBS documentary on late night television that spent most of its time on Carson ("Pioneers of Television"). Did the Univ. of Nebraska offer bachelor's degrees in logic in 1949, and did Carson earn one? Lippard (talk) 03:23, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

I could find no such degree in their 2000 archived catalog, and predictably, the elements of Logic are subsumed as courses under the degree in Philosophy, where it is traditionally found. These days some universities will offer an actual degree in Logic, but the focus is mathematical/computational. In 1949 it would be even more likely to be found in Philosophy; digital computers were still in their infancy. I strongly doubt any college offered it solus.

The question is moot now. Carson's educational credentials are fully displayed in the article; he had a minor in physics, which took me by surprise. But it explains a brief aside he once made when a guest introduced something about the trajectory of a missile leaving him to explicate the matter with what sounded like a calculus-driven incomplete argument seemingly dredged up and its mental cobwebs of 50 years previous dusted off. Incomplete, because the explication started bringing in bewildered snippets of laughter from guests and audience who hadn't a clue what he was talking about.

I wouldn't have expected even a high-school math parabolic description from a talk-show host, let alone what he tried to launch into. JohndanR (talk) 03:32, 10 April 2022 (UTC)

Wayne newton comment

so my addtion was killed, how and where can newton's comments go? 15.251.201.72 21:30, 3 December 2007 (UTC)justin

I agree. These comments shed a lot of light on Carson...they need to go somwhere. Slick Black Cadillac (talk) 04:33, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

I've tried again, I think I put it in a better place and found the transcript, give me a shot ok? justin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 15.251.201.73 (talk) 19:31, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

oh, I really feel as if this article should have a good photograph of Johnny :) (38.98.168.187 (talk) 03:40, 9 May 2008 (UTC))

Haberdasher?

On Haberdasher, they list Carson as a haberdasher. Is this correct? If so, it should briefly state when he did this, thanks. --Rajah (talk) 04:46, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Chain smoker and quitting?

The article says he was a chain smoker and that, as I recall, he would smoke at his desk during the show, but I also recall he quit smoking a few years (I don't know exactly when) before retiring, indeed he at least once SAID he had quit and as far as I saw he no longer smoked on the show. Surely this much is verifiable (even if it's unknown whether he remained quit after retirement), and if so I think it should be added. Benbradley (talk) 01:06, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

"Beautiful Downtown Burbank"

Did Johnny Carson also joke about "beautiful downtown Burbank"? That was a line from Rowan and Martin's Laugh-in. Does anybody have a reference for Johnny Carson's use of it? Or did somebody write that line from memory and get it wrong? —MiguelMunoz (talk) 01:37, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

• I don't recall Carson ever doing that joke. The joke with the Tonight Show was they always said it was from Hollywood when it was from Burbank (at least until O'Brien's show which will actually be from Hollywood). 68.146.81.123 (talk) 17:09, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Okay, there's a reference now, quoting the Burbank mayor, but the mayor is going from her own memory and getting it wrong. We should remove it.—MiguelMunoz (talk) 03:06, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Early life

Should be more on his early life including education and navy. The article on Ed McMahon is much more complete than the article on Carson!—Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.216.185.184 (talk) 20:18, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Article needs a listing of his hosted TV shows

As the recent DVD releases (both Carson Estate-sponsored and otherwise) have indicated, Johnny hosted a number of different shows, often with the same Johnny Carson Show title: there was Carson's Cellar, a prime time Carson Show, a daytime Carson Show that was a panel-type discussion series, at least one other Johnny Carson Show, and some specials and the like. Although some of these are addressed in the text, it would be helpful to do a listing. 68.146.81.123 (talk) 17:08, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Been adding references to the article. Are there other pages we could use? Ergito (talk) 16:26, 7 July 2009 (UTC) Still looking for more references. Ergito (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 22:26, 25 July 2009 (UTC).

Been working on the deaths and tributes section. Does it need more references? Ergito (talk) 22:54, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Starting to add references to the early life section Ergito (talk) 23:39, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Looking for references for the marriage section. Anyone know any books on the topic?Ergito (talk) 22:41, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

"Pet my pussy" joke

Jaye P. Morgan was the actress that uttered the line, not Zaa Zaa or anyone else. I definitely saw it. http://www.johnnycarson.com/carson/search.do?name=Jaye+P.+Morgan&x=40&y=14&=Search&singleDateMonth=Month&singleDateDay=Day&singleDateYear=Year&dateRangeBeginMonth=Month&dateRangeBeginDay=Day&dateRangeBeginYear=Year&dateRangeEndMonth=Month&dateRangeEndDay=Day&dateRangeEndYear=Year

The above links list the dates she appeared. Does anyone have access to the videos to research this issue?

I'm sure I saw a video clip in 2009 as part of a late-night TV commercial for a Tonight Show DVD compilation. The lines as I remember them were more like this:

 (Actress) This is my pussy, would you like to pet my pussy?
 (Carson, immediately) Sure, just get rid of the cat!

Hope that helps.

Snopes says this never happened. Jane Fonda once asked him about it on air, so that may be where everyone's "memories" of seeing this come from, but there doesn't appear to be a shred of evidence the underlying quote actually happened. 221bbaker (talk) 18:19, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

The Jane Fonda segment is doubtless where this comes from. Fortunately (for this discussion and simply because it's funny) the Johnny Carson official You Tube channel has it online here. - UPDATE - For some reason You Tube is on Wikipedia's "black list" whatever that means, so the You Tube handy url will not post here. To find the official video search You Tube for this specific phrase = Jane Fonda Asks Johnny Carson About Zsa Zsa Gabor on Johnny Carson's Tonight Show 50.54.236.164 (talk) 20:06, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Henry Bushkin's book on Carson also denies this joke occurred. -- j — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.170.172.178 (talk) 20:51, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Maiden Name?

What was the maiden name of Carson's first wife? Paul, in Saudi (talk) 09:57, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Uri Geller

The section about Uri Geller's appearance on The Tonight Show is very poorly described and factually incorrect. Johnny Carson, in consultation with friend and fellow conjuror James Randi, designed a very careful series of simple experiments designed to test Geller's psychokinetic claims (bending spoons/keys, starting broken watches, divining water). The most important aspect of testing Geller's claims was to keep the test items (keys, spoons, film canisters, timepieces) away from Geller and his entourage until his actual segment was to begin, thereby foiling any attempt to tamper with the objects prior to the test. When confronted with the simple test(s) with untampered objects on live TV, Geller faltered and dissembled, giving many excuses as to why he could not successfully achieve that which he demonstrated on many prior occasions. Contrary to the post, Geller's failure to succeed did little to hurt his career. The post should at least be changed to reflect the actual circumstances surrounding the test, if not completely scrapped and rewritten. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Brprivate (talk • contribs) 18:45, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Navy rank and timeline?

The following makes little sense.

He left college after one year to join the United States Navy, being commissioned an Ensign. He joined the U.S. Navy on June 8, 1943, as an apprentice seaman enrolled in the V-12 program, which trained Navy and Marine pilots.

If he was commissioned an Ensign how could he have joined as an Apprentice Seaman? Some clarification please. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.1.156.204 (talk) 12:28, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

The article should also amplify Carson's position against the Vietnam War. In the 1970s and beyond, every influential position in America was filled by WW II veterans who did a great job with total social support from America during and after WW II. But Vietnam veterans got no such support, and the GI Bill for our generation of veterans had been eroded by inflation. The traditional veterans organizations like the American Legion and VFW were run by WW II veterans and had no interest in Viet vets and so we had to establish the Vietnam Veterans of America. Carson was an influential person, and it would be interesting to know if he ever did anything to help Vietnam veterans. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.49.27.38 (talk) 23:26, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Final Wife

I am seeing conflicting listing of Carson's last wife's name, seeing her as both Alexis and Alexandra. His obituary on CNN reads "Alexis:"

http://articles.cnn.com/2005-01-23/entertainment/carson.obit_1_tonight-show-guest-host-carson-s-cellar-television-hall?_s=PM:SHOWBIZ

Unfortunately I can't find anything on Carson's official site. It seems a nitpick, and Alexis might be a nickname -- just hate it when a detail like this is hard to pin down.Frank Mottley (talk) 23:58, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

Carson kidded that he had married three similarly named women to avoid "having to change the monogram on the towels."

I don't think Carson is the one who said this. Watch this youtube video of the Dean Martin Celebrity Roasts (go 3:50 in) and you'll see Bob Newhart actually saying the joke. It's a minor thing, but funny, and I think Newhart should get the credit. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VrNURaMhnA Vyselink (talk) 02:14, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I agree. According to Bushkin's book, this is Newhart's joke — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.170.172.178 (talk) 20:53, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

I also agree. I watched the original roast and remember the joke from Newhart. We should either delete/modify or the originator post a reference that convinces. Jtagchair (talk) 02:39, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Carson's faith, or lack of it

Has anyone read enough Carson bio material--sparce as it admittedly may be for an "intensely private" celebrity--to know his religious views? The fact that he was so tight with absolute atheist Sagan and his fellow non-believing wife Druyan, was an amateur astronomer (a discipline which has upwards of 95% nonbelievers, by many estimates), and also had a strong interest in physics (his college minor, and another field which has about 90% faithless folk), suggests to me that he likely did not buy the G-d hypothesis. Can anyone confirm this? (I wouldn't be surprised to learn he was nominally Protestant, given his Iowa and Nebraska background, but I'm interested in his actual beliefs, as opposed to any pro forma church membership that he never really followed through on.)

Brother Dick Carson, longtime director of Merv Griffin's daytime gabfest (as well as sometime Tonight director during late 60s and 70s), might have a lot of insight on this question as well as other ambiguities regarding the private Johnny, but I've never seen an interview with Dick even about his own career, much less his vastly-more-celebrated brother's. Anyone herein ever seen him queried on anything? Thanks in advance! [signed] FLORIDA BRYAN — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.99.22.25 (talk) 08:33, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Telescopic Confusion

Questar's telescope, the 3.5" Maksutov, was certainly NOT "top of the line". It was considered a very pricey toy by most serious amateur astronomers. The optics were very good however, and it was far more practical as a daytime spotting scope (i.e., wildlife watching). The more serious scopes, both also catadioptric cassegrain designs, were the 8" Celestron and Meade. These were priced similarly to the Questar (I'm remembering around $1,200 - though it was a long time ago). Both Celestron and Meade also offered 11" models of the same design for around $10,000.

The main advantage of the Questar was light weight & portability. It was very small and could be comfortably carried in your hands. Its altitude/azimuth mount was (again) better suited to terrestrial use. Many who tried to use their Questar for celestial observing were ultimately disappointed. A better (and far less expensive) entry-level telescope was the Edmund Scientific Astroscan. With a 4.5" objective, a more-or-less "rugged" plastic enclosure, its unique spin on the Dobson mount (basically the Astroscan is a ball & socket joint) and its shoulder strap, one got far more telescope for a thousand dollars less.

The 8" Celestron & Meade models mentioned earlier both require lugging around in a sturdy case, partial assembly at the observing site and polar alignment (a polar mount, unlike an alt/az or Dobson, can accurately track the night sky). And yes, of course, modern alt/az & Dobson mounts can be motorized with steppers to emulate sidereal motion. However only advanced do-it-yourselfers had anything of the sort back then.

You people can go verify all this for yourself. You need to talk to ACTUAL amateur astronomers though. Not just people who spend a fuck ton of money on equipment they don't use. You guys get a LOT of stuff completely wrong. Basically, it's because of your Dorwinnian (yes, DORWINnian) attitude. For those of you not familiar with the Foundation, the short version is he's an ignorant, pompous dick head who thinks the correct way to do research is to read others' research & pronounce one author more correct over all others, rather than doing the field work himself and reaching his own conclusions. So, congrats. Archie Bunker would be pleased.

And, screw your signing crap too. I've never heard such idiocy! You kids are SO fucked up hehehhehe.

Marriages: Discrepancy in awards to second wife Joanne Copeland

In the section on Marriages, the article says that his second wife Joanne Copeland "received nearly half a million dollars in cash and art and $100,000 a year in alimony for life."

The PBS documentary on Johnny Carson, aired for the first time yesterday evening (5/14/2012), disagrees with these figures, giving an award of $260,000 plus $75,000 a year in alimony.

This discrepancy needs to be resolved and if inaccurate figures have been posted, fixed. Bill Jefferys (talk) 00:24, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

The relevant section of the "American Masters" show on Johnny Carson starts at about 44 minutes into the show. Bill Jefferys (talk) 00:28, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

More information out with the American Masters series

Those taking care of this page may want to watch research the American Masters program on Carson. A lot of information there, and elaboration on things on the page. Like the feud with Rivers wasn't that she got her own show, but that she didn't tell him about it before hand, and he only heard about it the day before it was to be publicly announced. Or that he learned Swahili before he traveled to Africa after his retirement. 96.31.177.52 (talk) 21:10, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

I made an article for that Johnny Carson: King of Late Night. I found the official site lets you freely watch the entire thing. http://www.pbs.org/wnet/americanmasters/episodes/johnny-carson-king-of-late-night/watch-the-full-documentary/2093/ Dream Focus 21:14, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Kevin Spacey

It is noted that Kevin Spacy narrates the PBS documentary. Is it worth noting that Spacey is known for his very accurate impersonation of Carson? 68.146.52.234 (talk) 23:15, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Location of Cedars-Sinai Medical Center

In the infobox it says that Mr. Carson died in West Hollywood, CA. In the "Death and tribute" section of the article, it is stated that Mr. Carson died at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center in West Hollywood. However, both the Wikipedia Cedars-Sinai article and the medical center's own website <www.cedars-sinai.edu> state that the medical center is located at 8700 Beverly Blvd. in Los Angeles. Bunkyray5 (talk) 01:31, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Carson Cuties

The article named four women, Theona Bryant, Phyllis Applegate, Norma Brooks, and Sally Todd and said they were the Carson Cuties on the Tonight Show. It did not say what year, implying they had some long prominent run on the show. This seemed undue weight given to people who might have done walk-ons or bit parts at some point. There were many models who walked on to hold a prop or appear in a bit. Searching for mention of them in reliable sources, I found http://www.john-odowd.com/portfolio/sally-todd-on-sammy-davis-jr-jerry-lewis-jfk-and-her-1950s-cult-films/ which said they were on his 1955 variety show. This was 7 years before the Tonight Show. Searching Google for reliable sources, I only found websites which mirrored this Wikipedia article. Even on IMDB (useful for screen credits, though not a fully reliable source) I found bios for actresses who could be these four, doing bit parts in movies and 1950's TV shows, and their credits did not include the Tonight Show or even the 1950's variety show. I removed the mention as unreferenced and undue weight, until adequate sourcing can be shown. Edison (talk) 13:59, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

The Carson Cuties were probably very short lived. Sally Todd moved to NYC in 1955 to be one of them. By early 1956 she was back in Hollywood, having signed a contract with 20th Century Fox. Hamellr (talk) 18:53, 17 September 2016 (UTC)

References

Final show

I want to call attention to the use of the word "penultimate" to describe Carson's last show. In the immortal words of Inigo Montoya, "I do not think it means what you think it means".75.118.75.187 (talk) 03:23, 21 April 2017 (UTC)CBTemple

Penultimate is used correctly in the current version. Midler and Williams appeared on his second to last show. Figureofnine (talk • contribs) 16:40, 23 October 2019 (UTC)

External links modified

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Possible copyright problem

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Time of airing

I added a cn tag. When I was in high school in 1971, we watched Johnny Carson at 10:30 pm, after the late local news at 10:00. I would be interested to see a source that contradicts this and says 12:30 am for the show. I was in New Mexico, USA. 71.228.112.175 (talk) 02:51, 15 August 2022 (UTC)

Ridiculing of Jim Garrison

Let us not forget that Carson was complicit in the cover up of the Kennedy assassination by purposefully ridiculing Jim Garrison in an interview where Carson refused to allow Garrison to present photographic evidence of other Suspects that were involved in the JFK assassination. 92.12.2.157 (talk) 16:39, 20 September 2022 (UTC)

At the very lease, we need reliable sources to back up this claim. Then, the consideration of whether notable for inclusion. --ZimZalaBim ^talk 17:10, 20 September 2022 (UTC)

Night Court appearance

Johnny appeared in a cameo at the end of an episode of the original "Night Court" series (season 3, episode 18), where he played himself, flirting with the Markie Post character with unsigned, secret admirer, letters. Near the end of the episode, he is told by the bailiff that she, not knowing who has been sending the letters, is not interested, at which point the camera focuses on Johnny, and the audience realizes who he is. Johnny acts disappointed at the news, at which point the bailiff asks, abashedly, "Aren't you married, now?", to which the multiply-married-and-divorced Carson responds with facial gestures, indicating that he isn't sure, himself.

All the citations needed to add this to the Wikipedia entry are too complicated for me to do, so, if any one else wants to do so, please feel free! Skaizun (talk) 06:00, 21 October 2023 (UTC)

Criticism in lead

Is such strong wording about his personal reputation really necessary for the lead? It's so jarring, like it's two long paragraphs about his accomplishments, hyping him up as a cultural icon, and then hits you with "also he was a real jerk and everybody hates him now: the end". Very clumsily handled I think, and the bit about his legacy being tarnished is a highly subjective and arguably inaccurate claim, at least as far as the general public is concerned. I'm not defending Carson personally here, I just think it's an oddly blunt and severe statement to drop in amidst all the accolades. 2600:8801:7116:4400:1949:96FC:EF68:DC59 (talk) 19:58, 11 April 2024 (UTC)