Talk:Jo Stafford

Citations & references

See Wikipedia:Footnotes for an explanation of how to generate footnotes using the <ref(erences/)> tags Nhl4hamilton (talk) 10:54, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Lede name usage

I don't find evidence that Jo Elizabeth Stafford legally changed her name to Jo Stafford. I propose changing the lede to begin, "Jo Elizabeth Stafford (November 12, 1917 – July 16, 2008) was an American singer...", per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (biographies). --GrizzlySound (talk) 00:32, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

I found an article in The Guardian which gives her full name as Josephine Elizabeth Stafford (see here). If this is correct then I was thinking we could change the lede to say something like "Josephine Elizabeth Stafford (November 12, 1917 - July 16, 2008), known professionally as Jo Stafford . . ." Any thoughts on this? TheRetroGuy (talk) 17:47, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Perfect pitch

I have removed this claim from the lede: "She was one of only a handful of musicians to have perfect pitch, or the ability to identify a note without having seen the piano key or instrument on which it was played."

The cited reference actually refutes this claim. IMHO the claim should not be restored unless a higher quality source is cited. See Wikipedia:Verifiability. —GrizzlySound (talk) 17:12, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

External links

There are a lot of external links on this page. I think some of them could be used as references instead, so I might put this on my list of things to do. TheRetroGuy (talk) 13:02, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

Date of death

I notice someone changed the date of her death, but I think some of the refs which point to her death being on 13 July are erroneous. Somewhere (I think it was the Washington Post or LA Times) I've seen a correction regarding this, and most seem to agree it was 16 July. TheRetroGuy (talk) 22:19, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Political stances

Jo Stafford also participated in a Roosevelt Birthday Ball at the White House during the Truman administration. Being involved in this or the Eisenhower tea in 1954 doesn't mean political affiliation. I am commenting out the political information and removing the category; unless/until there is proof that she publicly favored a political party. We hope (talk) 18:23, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

Should hopefully know this by the weekend. :) Paul MacDermott (talk) 19:59, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

For the record-

• G.I. Jo "The Westons are liberal Catholics, and in an age when presidential rhetoric brought out of the woodwork all the bumper-sticker patriots, the gun people and assorted other crazies, they remained unintimidated liberal Democrats."
• Newbergh-Beacon News October 31, 1960. "The Democrats will supply Milton Berle, Louis Prima and Keely Smith, Stan Freberg, Jo Stafford and others for a Kennedy rally in East Los Angeles Tuesday...." We hope (talk) 23:11, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

Well, that's a major relief. Jo's IMDB "Trivia" section [1] claims she was a "lifelong Republican", which really didn't sit well with me, as a big fan of hers. It just didn't quite ring true to me either. This book also cites Jo as supporting Kennedy: [2] I know I shouldn't be disturbed by such things, but as an ardent lefty, I am... --TrottieTrue (talk) 20:14, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

Article links

• Voice From Home New Yorker August 26-September 2, 1996]
• Bill Reed Interview Songbirds Winter 2000. Information on Corinthian Records, early and later years and family.
• When Stafford Sings Coronet magazine (defunct) April 1955.
• Wild Pitch Village Voice March 22, 1998. Jonathan and Darlene Edwards.
• G.I. Jo from Singers and the Song by Gene Lees.
• "Club 15" bio
• 1956 newspaper mini bio
• 1955 Problems with the live television show.
• 1952 Jo's piano-playing poodle, Beau.
• 1952 Beau becomes a member of the Musicians' Union.
• Discovering Great Singers of Classic Pop: A New Listener's Guide to the Sounds and Lives of the Top Performers Jo Stafford chapter-details her eyesight, cue cards and the bright lights of television.
• Dialogues in Swing: Intimate Conversations With the Stars of the Big Band Era Jo Stafford and Paul Weston chapter. Paul talks about how he got started, so does Jo. How the Pied Pipers cleaned out the fridge of Weston and Stordahl and the embarrassment both felt after the Pipers were fired from the Dorsey radio show. More on Jonathan and Darlene.
• A Biographical Guide to the Great Jazz and Pop Singers start reading on p 436. Some pages not viewable. Jo's early family background, more on career. Also more on Jonathan and Darlene. When asked what Jonathan Edwards is really like, Paul's answer was, "He's a pain in the ass!"
• American Singing Groups: A History from 1940s to Today The Pied Pipers section starts on page 51. Sir Hubert thought they were a scandal and that's why they had to leave the Dorsey program. For many years in both radio and television, one or two companies paid the costs of a radio or television show, thus they had the "last word". Red Skelton lost his first television sponsor because they wanted live, not filmed, shows. Goodman Ace lost a radio show sponsor because he snapped at the sponsor when they wanted a music bridge change, telling them the change of packaging of their product was "a gyp". So for a long time, "the sponsor" was King of the media castle in the United States.
• American National Biographies-Paul Weston-some information provided by Jo.
• Billboard It's 10 Candles for Corinthian
• A Voice for America 1952
• 1953 News story about Paul, Jo and the guitar playing priest who married them.
• 1956 News story-Jo was born on a piece of land called "Tract 35" in Coalinga, CA.
• 1953 Paul talks modern music and tells that "You Belong to Me" was the "B" side of the record.
• 1952 Story details how Paul's accident brought him to arranging music.
• 1952 Paul had his name on more records sold than anyone else at the time-estimated to be 50 million when the story was written.
• 1953 The first Jo Stafford television show was a million dollar deal.
• 1961 Jo working for 3 record companies
• 1946 Jo's ex sues re: Pied Piper breakup
• 2008 Obit-tells that Jo never played another nightclub after La Martinique and her thoughts on why she no longer sang.
• The Stafford Sisters in Gold Mine in the Sky
• Sinatra! The Song Is You: A Singer's Art Paul on Mitch Miller and "Underneath the Overpass", etc.
• Jo talks about Paul in 2007. "Had the notion of being romantically interested in him occurred? “Huh-uh. Not yet,” she said. “That didn’t occur until after I went to New York. He made a couple of visits to New York, and that’s when the idea that we were, kind of, special came up.”"

How she overcame a weight problem

• Her Battle to Reduce
• How to Keep in Trim
• La Martinique opening 1945. This is the performance she refers to.

Jo and Paul "Marriage Watch"

• Dorothy Kilgallen 1947
• Hedda Hopper 1947-rumors but no ring
• Louella Parsons 1951 "secretly married"
• Finally! 1952-details she the divorce from Huddleston was final in 1944 and that the couple had to wait for an official investigation and determination re: whether the marriage to Huddleston was thought valid in the eyes of the Catholic Church. If it had been, there could have been no Catholic wedding.

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Jo Stafford/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Bruce1ee (talk · contribs) 09:56, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

I'll be reviewing this nomination. I should have it done towards the end of this week, so please bear with me. —Bruce1ee^talk 09:56, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it reasonably well written?

   A. Prose quality:

   See Comments below Fixed

   B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:

   See Comments below Fixed

2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?

   A. Has an appropriate reference section:

   B. Citation to reliable sources where necessary:

   See Comments below Fixed

   C. No original research:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. Major aspects:

   B. Focused:

4. Is it neutral?

   Fair representation without bias:

5. Is it stable?

   No edit wars, etc:

6. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   Nine free images used, all correctly tagged

   B. Images are provided if possible and are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

Comments

• 1A.
  • In the lead section, "She left the group in 1944. She recorded ..." could be changed to "She left the group in 1944 and recorded ...".
    • Done. Changed to "After leaving the group in 1944 she recorded..."
  • I think "syncopation" in the Early years section should be linked as it's not a common term.
    • Done.
  • I think the first occurrence of "The Pied Pipers" in the Pied Pipers section should be linked for clarity.
    • Done.
  • In the Pied Pipers section, the "cleaned out the refrigerator" statement is not explained here; the reference suggests that it was because the group was "very poor and very hungry", but is this statement necessary in the article?
    • Changed to "the group was invited along to give a performance"
  • In the Pied Pipers section, "By this time, it was successful enough in its own right" – is this statement necessary? It was a number one song.
    • Removed the that sentence.
  • In the Solo career section, I think "to Huddleston" should be added after "In 1944, after her divorce".
    • Done.
  • In the USO section, replace "USO" with "United Service Organizations (USO)".
    • Done.
  • In the USO section, link Pacific Theatre to Pacific War.
    • Done.
  • In the USO section, "at lights out" – should that not be "after lights out"?
    • Not sure. Wouldn't the hospital want the servicemen to sleep after lights out? Maybe they played the songs as the lights were being switched off. I'll have to look into it.
      • I'm sure it's ok as it is – don't worry.
        • I found a source somewhere that says before lights out, which kind of makes sense. I'll look for it again.
  • In the USO section, according to the reference, "Madame, I was there!" does not end with "!".
    • Done. I'll check though whether it was Madam, or Madame.
      • The reference says "Madame"
  • I think the first occurrence of "The Chesterfield Supper Club" in the Chesterfield Supper Club section should be linked for clarity.
    • Done.
  • I think that the Duets and VOA section needs to open with a statement that Stafford recorded several duets with Gordon MacRae, then discuss their songs.
    • Done.
  • In the Duets and VOA section, the 2nd paragraph is a little confusing: "In order to join Columbia, Stafford asked for an early release from her contract with Capitol.", but it says earlier that "Stafford had a clause inserted in her contract with the company [Capital] stating that if Weston left Capitol, she would automatically be released from her obligations to them."; why did she have to ask for an early release?
    • Done. Both are sourced, though I agree it is a little confusing. Since Nancy Franklin's article is based on an interview with Stafford I'm assuming that is the definitive version. It may be that they inserted another clause that required her to record so many songs for them, but that is unclear so I've just changed it to say that they wanted her to make eight more recordings for them before the end of the 1950.
  • In the 1960s section, I suggest changing "believed" to "felt" to avoid repetition in "She also said she did not believe she could perform in Broadway musicals, as she believed her voice".
    • Done.
  • In the Comedy performances section, can the 1st sentence be dated (when did this happen)?
    • Done,
  • In the Comedy performances section, "Columbia Records executive George Avakian named Weston's character Jonathan Edwards, for the 18th century Calvinist preacher. He asked Weston to record an album under this alias." – I'd suggest joining these two sentences: "... Calvinist preacher, and asked ...".
    • Done.
  • In the Comedy performances section, "As Weston thought, he worried that he might not be able to come up with enough material for an entire album alone." – is "As Weston thought" necessary; why not: "Weston worried ...".
    • Done.
  • In the Comedy performances section, "He asked his wife to join the project and Stafford then became Darlene Edwards, the off-key vocalist." – did this happen after the birth of Darlene Edwards described in the next paragraph?
    • Done. It seems the character came before the name, so I've reworded it slightly. Let me know if it's ok.
      • That seems fine.
  • In the Comedy performances section, link 1st occurrence of "Time magazine", delink the 2nd occurrence.
    • Done.
  • In the Comedy performances section, "The album was followed up with a "pop standards" album" – what was the "pop standards" album's title?
    • Done. It was Jonathan and Darlene Edwards in Paris, so I've changed things round slightly.
  • In the Comedy performances section, "In 1958, the Westons brought the pair to the television screen for a Jack Benny Shower of Stars and to The Garry Moore Show in 1960." – shouldn't that be "Jack Benny's Shower of Stars"?
    • Done.
  • Close paraphrasing/copyright violations:

Article

"a mock hillbilly version of "Temptation", which she pronounced "Tim-tayshun""

Source

"a mock hillbilly version of " Temptation,," which she pronounced "Tim-tayshun,"

• Done.

• Should "hillbilly sent-up" not be "hillbilly send-up"?

• Yes, indeed. :)

Article

"triggered a national sensation as the public tried to identify the brazenly off-key singer and the piano player of dubious ability."

Source

"triggered a national sensation: trying to identify the artists behind the brazenly off-key singing and piano-playing of dubious ability"

• Done.

Article

"although they did record four sides for RCA Victor Records"

Source

"though they did record four sides for RCA Victor"

• Done.

• 1B.
  • There are inconsistencies in the abbreviation of United States, sometimes it's U.S., other times it's US; I see UK has no periods.
    • Done.
  • "She was admired by both critics and the listening public for the purity of her voice and was considered one of the most versatile vocalists of the era." appears in lead but is not covered in body of the article.
    • Done. Added to new section.
  • The Hollywood Walk of Fame statement at end of lead is not covered in the body of the article; how about adding an "Awards and recognition" section, there are several entries that could be added here: Grammy Award, Hollywood Walk of Fame, Best Dressed Women by the New York Fashion Academy, Big Band Academy of America's Golden Bandstand.
    • Done. Added to new section.
  • Some of the online references don't have "Retrieved" dates.
    • Could you highlight those concerned? I edit with a screen magnifier so it would help me find them more easily.

Ref 8 (Parabrisas.com)

Ref 17 (Lees, Gene, ed. (1989))

Ref 28 (Dunning, John, ed. (1998))

Ref 38 (Stafford, Jo (June 1953))

Ref 73 ("Singer Jo Stafford dies aged 90". BBC News)

Ref 74 (Find a Grave)

• Done.

• • Some of the Google Book references have no page numbers.
    • Could you highlight which ones?

Ref 26 (Music--As Written. Billboard. November 2, 1946)

Ref 50 (Talent Topics. Billboard. November 3, 1962)

Ref 51 (Jo Stafford's Dot LP Out in January. Billboard. October 23, 1965)

Ref 52 (First Annual Jockey Poll. Billboard. August 2, 1947)

Ref 53 (General Artists Corporation trade ad for Jo Stafford. Billboard. November 5, 2011)

Ref 54 (Nostalgia With Let-Down Trimming. Billboard. March 14, 1960)

Ref 67 (New LP, Tape Releases. Billboard. April 10, 1982)

Unfortunately I'm not able to enlarge these sufficiently enough to read them, and their file format means they won't run through text-to-speech either. Any thoughts?

I think it's ok to leave it as it is. I was only asking for page numbers for completeness, but the references are quite comprehensive as they are.

No worries, hopefully someone will stumble on the article and add them.

• • Ref 16 (Hall, Fred, ed. (1989)) cites page 52, but other pages appear to have been used, for example "the group was invited and speedily cleaned out the refrigerator." is on page 43.
    • Done.
  • Ref 24 (Full-page ad for the Chesterfield Supper Club) & Ref 27 (Ad for 'Chesterfield Supper Club) should be combined as they appear to point to the same Google Book page.
    • Done.
  • Ref 14 & Ref 37 (Weston, Paul; Stafford, Jo; Pawlak, Keith (2012)) can be combined.
    • Again, could you assist with this one.
      • The references have changed a bit, but now there are three that refer to this book: Refs 13, 36 & 71, and they can all be combined into one as you've done above. Just search for "Weston, Paul; Stafford, Jo; Pawlak, Keith (2012)"
        • There is a way of doing it so the book appears in the bibliography and refs can be linked to that, but I'm not sure how to do it. But I can arrange them so there is a bibliography with individual references in the main reflist, and hopefully someone who knows how to do it can actually link them together later. Paul MacDermott (talk) 12:54, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
          • I've done what I think you wanted. There are several ways of doing it (see WP:CITESHORT), but this is the way I do it.
            • Thanks, that was the one I was thinking of.

• 2B.
  • In the Duets and VOA section, "While at Columbia, she was the first to sell 25 million records for them." – the source says "she's the only other vocalist besides Bing Crosby whose record sales have reached 25 million", not the first, or have I missed something?
    • Done.
  • In the Comedy performances section, "...the first commercially successful musical parody album..." – I can't find a source for this.
    • Done. I couldn't find this either, so I've removed it.

Please have a look at the above issues I've found. It's generally a well-written article with a good coverage of the subject. Some of the references are offline, but I've assumed good faith. Thanks. —Bruce1ee^talk 10:43, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the review, Bruce1ee. I've addressed most of the points now, but there are one or two small things I'll need a bit of help with. Give me a shout if there's something I've missed. Cheers. Paul MacDermott (talk) 19:31, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the updates. I've responded to the questions you raised above, and raised one of my own ("hillbilly sent-up"). —Bruce1ee^talk 08:29, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. I think I've done everything I can with this now. Unfortunately there's a couple of things I'm not personally able to address due to software issues, but hopefully someone else can do that. Cheers again. Paul MacDermott (talk) 13:55, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Everything seems fine now; I've promoted the article to GA. Thanks for all your help and hard work. Regards. —Bruce1ee^talk 15:09, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

That's fantastic, thanks. Paul MacDermott (talk) 15:58, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

High-priority error #5

Checkwiki --LukasMatt (talk) 14:06, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Need a little more information about this as I'm not entirely clear what the problem actually is. It seems to be working fine for me, but if there is an issue with something then I should be able to fix it with a few more details. If not, I'll find someone who can. I've already replied on LukasMatt's talk page, but thought it was worth mentioning it here too. This is Paul (talk) 14:49, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your note. I've responded on my talk page. Checkwiki LukasMatt (talk) 15:09, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Your fix looks good, Paul. Thanks. Checkwiki --LukasMatt (talk) 16:33, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

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