Talk:Drummer/Archives/2015

Jokes against drummers

80.213.33.62 19:31, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Drummers are traditionally the worst of musicians' jokes, (like viola players for classical musicians). -- Tarquin

Too short

What's with people hating drummer's? --Mastermarik11

Example: "What do you call someone who hangs around with musicians? A drummer." -- Anon.

Timpanist?

"a good timpanist is so vital in an orchestral setting"??? Isn't that supposed to be the conductor? (besides, timpani are heard much more rarely in an orchestra than drums are in a band) --Ma Baker 3 July 2005 22:47 (UTC)

Ok besides my talk below I have desided to correct this. First Timpani's ARE DRUMS!! They have a shell, they have a head, they have lugs, they can be tuned, they are just a different form of a drum. Congas are drums but they look different then say a Snare Drum. Timbales are a drum just like the Bass Drum. And on the conductor note, (I'm sorry if could be taken as a crack at conductors it is not meant to be that) if you didnt have any musicians I don't think it would be a very interesting night at the your Orchestra Hall. Also if Timpani's are not important why do you find them in all full orchestras around the world. And why would you spend thousands of dollars to not be heard. I'm sorry to say but they are important and that comment was extremely insulting to the professional Timpani players around THE WORLD and to me the people who admire them. I to the B

Timpani's have been around since ancient times as the kettle drum, and were highly important as tuned instruments during the baroque period onwards. They were never a backwater instrument. I myself am a timpanist.203.51.88.201 10:39, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

And no other percussionist is allowed to double on the tympani. Only the tympanist is allowed to play the tympani - did you know that? 86.181.97.253 (talk) 22:25, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Improvement drive

Percussion instrument is currently a candidate on Wikipedia: This week's improvement drive. Vote for this article if you want it to be improved. --Fenice 20:47, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Professional drummers

Someone just edited this article to state that a drummer is only a drummer if they are paid for drumming. This seems incorrect to me. For instance, if I drummed in a volunteer band or school band, I think I'd still be a drummer, just as I am still a piano player for my church, even though I do not receive compensation for it. As such, I have removed the section that ties being a drummer to being paid for drumming. NickelShoe 12:47, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

I just edited out some of the page, don't know about how neutural I can make it, being a drummer, but I've tried to edit out the useless parts. An example is the statement that studio drummers can read sheet music. Though this is true, for most, im only a student of the drum and I can still read sheet music. - Anonymous, P.S. I dont know what the process is for this sort of thing, sorry if I just screwed the page over.

My drum teacher once told me, "There are drummers, and there are people who play drums." Think about yourself. I can't read sheet music and I play drums, so therefore in the eyes of the musical world I am not a musician. Conor, N.I.

In today's music a skilled and proficient drummer just have be able to play anything he is asked for. That is the reality. Drummers must listen to all kind of music and be proficient at all kind of playing. No matter blues or orchestra percussion or latin and afro percussion, a drummer has to be "Jack of all trades", but unlike this aphorism with "master of none", contemporary drummer has to be master of all kinds of percussion playing. Therefore I think it's not necessary to have pocket and studio parts. A pocket drummer can be just as well be a studio drummer and vice versa. Painbearer 09:50, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

NPOV/Tone

This article seems very POV to me - it reads like it was written by a drummer with a point to prove. I have tagged the article accordingly, and will attempt a re-write. QmunkE 19:48, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

• Seconded. Improvement needed. I may flag this as a potential future project. Have other engagements at this time. TydeNet 09:06, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Think before you act.

Don't write an article if you aren't an expert. Seriously it's demoralizing for people to make gerneral bias comments about drumming. Drummers can be looked down on and famed. Please don't contribute to the demoralizing aspect. I myself am a drummer and to hear someone say Timpani's aren't important. It's so sad that is oviously coming from a person who doesn't know much about percussion. Timpani's are key to an orchestra you say you don't hear them but you do Timpani's add to make a fuller sound and lots of times have solos. And I find it almost insulting for someone to make a comment like that when its completely wrong. I am 15 and I know I have a lot more to learn but please people don't make stupid comments please it's insulting.

---

Some misbegotten user is constantly changing this page. If you have a reason for doing so, please post it on this page.

A drummers main contribution is NOT only just timing changes and dynamic range but MUCH MORE. A drummer also has to deliver the right groove, maintain tempo, play fills when needed, emphasize other musicians, etc... And this depends GREATLY on the type of music played.

If the above statement seems biast, then "A drummer's main contributions are timing changes and, often overlooked by amateur drummers, dynamic range." can be considered biast as well, because you cannot stereotype a drummer, or for that matter, a musician.

Either remove the line, or change it.

If I am wrong, please be so kind to state why - i try to keep an open mind.

The main point of a drummer is to keep time steadily. Then comes providing the feel of the music (that is, a shuffle, a blast beat, a swing pattern, etc.). Next, and not necessarily, come groove, fills, emphasis, dynamics, etc. Look at, say, AC/DC's drummers, especially Phil Rudd, who rarely do anything apart from simple 2 & 4 beats and very simple fills, yet it is all that is needed. Or look at Queen, or any 80s pop band, or for that matter, most Sousa marches, where the bass drum is all quarter notes, and the snare is a slightly ornamentated backbeat/straight quarter note pattern.

I have changed the article, for the record, to include the other contributions, but it still focuses on tempo and feel. Evan Seeds (talk) 22:37, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Point taken. And i guess to this article you provide a proper POV. But I personally consider drummers like Phil Rudd and Roger Taylor as pocket drummers. And if you say that grooves or fills are not necessary, then that would mean a guitar player shouldnt necessarily play solos. I feel that they are necessary, in reference to the music of course. Say in order to emphasize a particular passage for example, or to bring about a climax or to just to show musician showmanship. And this article starts of with "While drummers are the butt of many jokes (not unlike alto viola players)....." this gives a negative feel and it is not justified at any point in the article thereafter.

Well, guitar solos are not necessary. While some genres of music somewhat 'require' them (thrash metal, and the like), there are many many successful songs without guitar solos (especially non-guitar-oriented genres, such as pop, rap and R&B, latin, etc.) Also, I have changed the intro to the Musical Signifance section due to your concerns. (Also, for the record, sign your comment with four tildes (~~~~) which becomes the signature after you submit. This ==> Evan Seeds (talk) 03:28, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Content removed

I have removed the following:

--Oldfartdrummer 17:11, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[1] In more general terms, a drummer is one who plays or strikes a variety of instruments and/or objects to provide a metronome-like pulse for other musicians to follow. "Objects" may be single drums/hand percussion, or trash can lids/plastic bins/cardboard boxes. It may just involve the drumstick striking anything that can be heard by the rest of the musicians/band.

--Oldfartdrummer 17:11, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[2] Today, the terms drummer, musician, percussionist, groover, or slammer are interchangable. The formal education or lack of has never been criteria for labelling.

since it is sourced to a blog which you can't view without a login - also this would not be considered an acceptable source. QmunkE 17:17, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

"The preceding (the section about military drummers) may mostly be correct for military drummers serving under the flag of Great Britain. American military drummers, buglers, etc. have been assigned to a compnay level unit since the turn of the century. Each company is comprised of musicians who represent a [full concert orchestra]. Based on need, other groups may be subdivided from this main body; such as [marching band], [jazz combo], [percussion ensemble], [rock band], etc. All musicians are required to know how to sight-read/perform on at least two instruments. All have high school level proficiency, most have college-level experience. After a four-year tenure in the military, all are considered professional musicians."

That's from the same guy, and ditto QmunkE. Evan Seeds (talk) 21:07, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

swing pattern

"swing" in swing pattern needs to be disambiguated. Thanks! --Jamoche 06:24, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Why do people look down upon drummers?

A lot of people look down upon drummers. Saying they just bang on stuff. This is entirely not true. They create the beat, add some emotion to the music, and grabs attention. Alot of people I know don't consider a drummer as a musician. this is odd to me. So, why do people look down upon drummers? -mastermarik11

Military?

Huh? What's this got to do with Drumming? It takes up almost half the section? I seriously think this is biased and someone should do something about it. We don't need that section...

• If you cry bias, you should at least point out which 'opinions' (if there are!) you mean - now you're just stating a 100% subjective opinion yourself! Fastifex 12:05, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Military

I've given this section a new heading and cleaned up its references. I also rewrote the three paragraphs; but since I couldn't tell what they were trying to say, in many places, I'm sure they still need some work. --Chris 01:29, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Pocket vs. studio?

At first glance it seems like there are two kinds of drummers out there: pocket drummers and studio drummers. Obviously, this is not the intention, but it seems a bit confusing pulling out these two categories (although the task of creating a comprehensive taxonomy of drummers certainly would be a challange).

Yeah many drummers are not pocket drummers in that they do not keep to simple beats and few fills but are not studio drummers in that they may only be proficient in a few genre's. Drummers like Ginger Baker, John Bonham, John Dolmoyan, and Keith Moon are all very talented but have been shown to be effective in only a few drumming styles despite their widespread fame. I think that this article should be entirely re-written perhaps by someone with some substansial knowledge about drumming (not me) also im sorry for any formatting errors i may have made im very new to this whole wikipedia business.

I agree. And I really think it should be pointed out that "pocket" and "studio" are names attributed to drumset players, not drummers in general (the introduction states that "drummer" can refer to both marching band drummers, hand drummers and drumset drummers - have you ever heard of an orchestral snare drum musician being called a "pocket player"?). And even within the category of drumset players, they are most relevant when used for describing pop or rock drummers.

Removed content II

Nicholas R. Storey Said to have founded this category, Nick Storey is the greatest drummer to have ever lived. Upon playing drums, he has been known to kill people with the sound of the ultimate fury. We asked Joey Jordison what he thought on the subject and he simply replied, "What can I say? My dad is a hell of a drummer." Also have been known to break the sound barrier, Nick constantly increases on perfecting his drumming skills and finally getting the courage to ask Haley out. Upon a recent update, E3 asked Mr.Storey how he came to the conclusion of his drumming career, he simply stated, "Some call it a curse, I call it a lifestyle." More info on Nick Storey check out http://www.afraidtotalktogirls.org

Three well-known contemporary examples of this playing style are Nick Storey of Nocturnal Nightmares fame, Charlie Watts of the Rolling Stones, and Phil Rudd of AC/DC.

Removed. Ehjort 14:58, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Merger proposal

I propose that Drummer boy (military) be merged into Drummer. I think that the content in the Drummer boy (military) article can easily be explained in the context of Drummer, and the Drummer boy (military) article is of a reasonable size in which the merging of Drummer will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. 187.15.79.196 (talk) 18:32, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

I think the use of drummers in a military context and drummers who create music are two fairly distinct concepts and a separate article is justified, but I don't think that article should be Drummer boy (military), necessarily. My suggestion would be to move Drummer boy (military) to Drummer (military), then merge any relevant content from this article to that one. --Bongwarrior (talk) 09:42, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Bongwarrior that no merger is needed, but neither does a move seem warranted. BCorr|Брайен 23:14, 28 October 2013 (UTC)