Talk:Autocephaly/Archive 1

Archive 1

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Georgia

Reading the article on the Georgian Orthodox Church, one gets the idea that it was independently founded by Saint Andrew rather than Saint Peter and has been autocephalous from the beginning. This article however states it broke from Russian Orthodox in 1917. Did it come to be part of Russian Orthodox when Georgia became part of the Russian empire? 65.118.97.26 (talk) 22:12, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 30 March 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) ~ Aseleste (t, e | c, l) 12:41, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

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Autocephaly → Autocephaly and autonomy (Eastern and Oriental Orthodox Churches) – The article currently covers both subjects, and both subjects are closely related. The concepts exists in both churches, e.g. ROCOR and Jacobite Syrian Christian Church.
Moreover, it will be useful to have a page which explains what the autonomy of a Church means in the E. and O. Orthodox Churches. Currently, the article explains what autonomy in the EO and OO Churches is (the concepts, as far as I know, are the same in both churches so by describing the concepts as seen by the EO Church we have the description as understood in the OO Church); despite this, there is no go-to article to explain the concept of autonomy in this context, due to the name of the article.
The word "autonomy" can mean numerous things, this is why I believe it is important to add "(Eastern and Oriental Orthodox Churches)" next to the title, and also because of WP:PRECISE. Veverve (talk) 19:05, 30 March 2021 (UTC)

• Autocephaly is not ambiguous as the term is notably used only in Eastern Christianity. Autonomy is an ambiguous term, so a page called Autonomy (Eastern Christianity) is needed (and we have it). I think that Autocephaly and autonomy in Eastern Christianity would be a confusing title. Autonomy is just one step short of autocephaly; so autonomy is something like autocephaly. We should either have two articles, one for Autocephaly and one for Autonomy (Eastern Christianity), or just leave everything as it is. I am in favor of the latter. We already have a page Autonomy (Eastern Christianity) redirecting to Autocephaly#Autonomy. --Omnipaedista (talk) 19:25, 30 March 2021 (UTC)

  @Omnipaedista: The idea that autonomy is considered a reduced autocephaly is, I think, very biased. This idea was present in the article when you wrote your comment, but I removed it as it was unsourced. I believe autonomy is understood as a limited sel-government in itself, rather than in relationship to autocephaly and being "a few steps away from autocephaly". Veverve (talk) 21:36, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

  Fair enough. The new tilte of the article could be Autocephaly and autonomy in Eastern Christianity (cf. Ritualism in the Church of England). --Omnipaedista (talk) 22:04, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

  @Omnipaedista: I agree with your proposal. Veverve (talk) 22:08, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose. Autocephaly is a good topic in itself and should have an article. These other article topics may or may not be good topics too, but I'm a little sceptical... we are a general encyclopedia, and the information should be arranged to be accessible to the general reader. But regardless, this article should remain scoped as it was. Andrewa (talk) 19:36, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose The term Autocephaly is a good topic, found in many encyclopedias, and should not be rendered clunkier and more confusing with this name change. If anything, you could propose making Autonomy a separate article, but I am not sure it is needed. Eccekevin (talk) 01:48, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose I have to agree with Eccekevin. As I said above, I think that Autocephaly and autonomy in Eastern Christianity would be a confusing title. Autocephaly is not ambiguous; autonomy is not a notable topic to have an article on its own (or even be mentioned in the title of this one). Omnipaedista (talk) 13:36, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

"Christocephalous" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Christocephalous and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 June 11#Christocephalous until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Veverve (talk) 18:00, 11 June 2022 (UTC)