Talk:1955 World Professional Match-play Championship

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:1955 World Professional Match-play Championship/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: BennyOnTheLoose (talk · contribs) 20:21, 12 September 2020 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
· · ·

Happy to discuss, or be challenged on, any of my review comments. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 20:33, 12 September 2020 (UTC) I've made some hopefully uncontroversial small copyedits and added some reference details. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 02:49, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

Copyvio and Plagiarism check

• Earwig's Copyvio Dectector shows just 2% match, which is "Billiards Association and Control Council", so no concerns here.

Image

• Free to use, accurate.

Edit wars?

• No issues here. (Note: I have previously added a line about TV coverage).

Infobox

• (Note to self: I'll see if I have a source that means we can add the PBSA as organisers) (Done. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 10:46, 20 September 2020 (UTC))

Overview

• "which it later took the lineage of." - I think this needs to be expanded to make it a bit clearer. I think the point is that the World Professional Match-play Championships were retrospectively "upgraded" to the status of World Professional Championships. (I wish I knew when.)
  • Reworded Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:06, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• "founder Joe Davis" might be read as founder of the World Professional Match-play Championship, which could be true (he was most likely running the PBPA at the time) - but is it meant to be that he was the founder of the World Championship. (Of course this gets messy as it wasn't originally called that...)
  • It does. Confuses the hell out of me. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:06, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• "did not participate in these events" - specify which, currently ambiguous.
  • Clarified Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:06, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• " under its original lineage" - would it be better to say something like "the officially recognised" or "the BACC authorised" championship?
  • Reworded. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:06, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Format

• "from 14 to 19 March 1955" not verified in the Turner source.
  • Fixed Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:18, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• "The event had six participants, with two players being given a bye to the semi-finals. Defending champion Fred Davis was given a bye, but the 1954 runner-up Walter Donaldson did not enter, Alec Brown, who had played in the semi-finals the year previously was also given a bye" - Dundee Courier source verifies that Donaldson had retired from the championship, but not the rest of this.
  • Re cited the first sentence. I have nothing that says Brown was given a bye because he was in the semi-finals the previous year, but that was all I can think of for it. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:18, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• "The rounds were played at different locations in the United Kingdom over different match lengths. Matches were scheduled for the best-of-61 frames in the quarter and semi-finals ..." not verified by the GSC source used.
  • reworded/cited. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Schedule

• Pulman/Williams - source verifies that the match ended "on Saturday" but not the start date.
  • Having some issues finding anything. Might need to search paper records for something published that date. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Rea/Stokes - source verifies that the match ended "on Saturday" but not the start date. (Glasgow Herald 28 Dec 54 can be used for start date)
  • Done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Rea/Davis - source verifies that the match ended "last night" but not the start date. (Northern Whig 18 Jan 55 can be used for start date)
  • Done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Pulman/Brown - source says that Pulman had a winning lead of 31-17 on 28 Jan, does not confirm match dates. (Glasgow Herald 25 Jan 55 can be used for start date)
  • Done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Davis/Pulman - source verifies that the match ended "on Saturday" but not the start date. (Glasgow Herald 15 Mar 55 can be used for start date)
  • Done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:36, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Summary

• The Glasgow Herald source reports that a NOTW match took place in the evening at the same venue as the Williams/Pulman match but doesn't state this as the reason for their match being shorter.
  • I don't think the article actually makes that claim either... Just that both things were true? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• "This was the last World Championship match played at Leicester Square Hall before its closure" needs a source.
  • Removed (although quite obviously true, as the "last match" was being played at the same time! Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Pulman/Williams "after the fourth day" not verified in source.
  • Removed. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Pulman/Williams "day five" not verified in source.
  • Removed Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• (Note: Sources state that score was 17-13, and later 22-15, rather than that Pulman won five of six then five of seven, but as the score was previously 12-12 these seem reasonable calculations.)
  • MOS:CALC indeed. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Final "on the sixth day" not verified in Turner source.
  • Removed. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Main draw Some inconsistency between sources - it may be better to use the newspaper sources for match scores.

• GSC has no details for Rea/Stokes or Pulman/Brown, shows 37-34 for Davis/Pulman
• Snooker Scene blog has no details Rea/Stokes or Pulman/Brown, shows 37-34 for Davis/Pulman
• CueSport book has 31-19 for Rea/Stokes; 31-16 for Pulman/Brown.
  • The refs all seem to be wrong. I've added the citations from above. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:46, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
    • No doubt part of the problem is that some are scores for the win, and others are after dead frames, but sources are sometimes inconsistent with themselves on this. The newspaper sources seem a better bet. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 21:50, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

References

• All seem reliable.

Lead

• Add in that this tournament is now recognised as a world championship.
  • I think it doesn't really need much more - it's quite a confusing situation to explain! Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
    • Indeed. I think with the revised text in the body it's OK. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 21:50, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
• Could add that Davis was the defending champion.
  • Done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:44, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Review comments above, Lee Vilenski. I've had a look in The Billiard Player for 1954 and 1955 but there is hardly a mention of the tournament there! Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 02:52, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

Hi BennyOnTheLoose - I've done all of the above except the schedule for the first match. I've spent a good hour looking through everything I have, and nada - any ideas? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:12, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Added in a source for that. I'll add one for it being a PBPA event. In searching for a source for that, I've uncovered what I think is a missing result. Do you agree Lee Vilenski? (It's not the books I've checked - Kobylecky has it as a walkover.)

• In the original draw, Alec Brown was to play John Barrie in the quarter-final. ("Davis gets a snooker bye", Sunderland Daily Echo and Shipping Gazette, 13 May 1954, p.16).
• "Snooker, Birmingham Daily Gazette, 5 November 1954, p.6 mentions Brown and Barrie's "level-terms London tournament heat, which is also a quarter-final in the world match play championship". Brown was 7-5 ahead.
• "Brown's good start" Belfast News-Letter - Friday 05 November 1954 p.7 says their News of the World Tournament match was "also a quarter-final tie in the world match play championship", also says Brown was 7-5 ahead.
• "Snooker: Alec Brown beats John Barrie" Northern Whig - Monday 08 November 1954 p.8 says Brown won 21-16.

Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 22:20, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

I have now incorporated this match BennyOnTheLoose. No wonder I didn't find this match, it was in two different tournaments! Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:42, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

That match isn't in any of the books as far as I've seen, so no wonder it wasn't here either. I've made a small amendment to the lead and removed some duplinks (although I actually like duplinks). Passing this for GA, thanks for your work Lee Vilenski. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 10:46, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

References

Score in the final

Many printed sources give the score of the final as 37-34 (e.g. the Rothmans Snooker Yearbook, Morrison's Snooker: Records, Facts and Champions, and Everton's Guinness Book of Snooker). Chris Turner's site has the same. I'm confident that the final score after dead frames was 38-35, as we currently have in the article and as reported by many newspapers in 1955, including The Times (21 March 1955 p.10) and The Observer (20 March 1955 p.12). This would mean that the final was over 73 frames, again as reported in multiple 1955 newspapers, so a player would need 37 frames to win.

The most detailed account I could find of the final day's play is on page 5 of the Lancashire Evening Post, 21 March 1955, in the British Newspaper Archive. This states that Davis was 36-30 ahead going into the concluding session, and "Davis lost the first frame [of the session] ... and took the second at 94-21 to become champion in the 68th frame of the week." This would mean that a winning margin was achieved at 37-31. It reports frame scores consistent with this result and 38-35.

Both Downer's Crucible Almanac (2019 ed.) and Kobylecky's International Directory have the winning score as 36-31, but this can't be right as 37 frames were needed.

I would be happy to take the Lancashire Evening Post as the most suitable source for the decisive score, despite it being in a minority. What do others think? Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 21:22, 2 March 2024 (UTC)

37-31 is correct according to my record of frame scores (although I am missing the scores from the 3rd day - frames 25 to 36, but all sources I have found stated that Fred Davis was leading 20-16 at this point). I can understand Downer and Koblecky both giving a 36-31 score as a final score of 37-34 you mentioned is printed elsewhere would suggest a 71 frame match, which would have meant that 36 frames was enough to take the title. However, this would still make Downer and Koblyecky wrong as the score at the end of the final day's afternoon session was 36-30 and not 36-31.

I have no problem in taking the Lancashire Evening Post as the most suitable source. Steveflan (talk) 14:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)