Talk:Alleged doubles of Adolf Hitler

Photo

Erm, are we certain that photo is Weler? I thought that officially it hadn't been retracted? Sherurcij ^{(talk) (Terrorist Wikiproject)} 07:04, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Article is to 99% an completely unproven rumor without any serious sources - should be deleted instantly, before someone starts believing this nonsense. Weler was caught alive and interrogated after the war by the Allies, see e.g. "The Murder of Adolf Hitler: The Truth About the Bodies in the Berlin Bunker" by W. Hugh Thomas, ISBN 0312140185. --Wittkowsky 21:11, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Socks

According to a cable tv program, the dead Weler was wearing worn socks with holes in them. Presumably the dictator could afford to wear new socks.

It wasn't Weler. Weler was located and interviewed by the Allies in 1945. The photograph depicts a second Hitler double, name unknown. Garrick92 13:18, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

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If Weler was found alive by the allied forces, this photo might be of the real Adolf Hitler.

--- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.211.139.168 (talk) 18:17, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

"Cook double"

This news article mentions this double. You need a subscription to look at the whole article, though.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20615FB3F5F1B7B93CBA9178ED85F418485F9

Greets 666sabbath666 02:06, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Name

I was just looking up this theory today. The same person being referred to as Gustav Weler was also given name spellings of "Gustav Weber" and "Gustav Weder". So should perhaps be redirect pages for those names leading here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Metasailor (talk • contribs) 16:22, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

Rename

I doubt this would be very controversial because of the limited attention this article receives, but floating the idea here first anyways. I think the article should be retitled to Alleged doubles of Adolf Hitler, for these primary reasons:

1. There are multiple alleged doubles. The only thing different about "Weler" is that footage exists of him, though it is sourced from the dubious Soviet archives.
2. The name is conjectural. The renamed article would still focus on "Weler", but without implying that's his name. It's a name with no verifiability, again sourced only to the Soviet archives.

— UpdateNerd (talk) 04:26, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Gustav Weler in lede

I recently changed the clunky wording:

The most prominent evidence of any Hitler double is Soviet footage of a toothbrush moustache-wearing body identified as Gustav Weler

to:

The most prominent evidence of any Hitler double is Soviet footage of the body of a toothbrush moustache-wearing person identified as Gustav Weler

Because Gustav Weler was a person, not a body.

The article body, which the lede is supposed to summarise, says, with a citation, "Footage of the body double identified as Gustav Weler was presented as Hitler's corpse in a post-war documentary".

User:UpdateNerd reverted me with the edit summary:

...less accurate, as we don't know if whoever the double is actually wore the moustache, as opposed to a prop if this was made (apparently) as propaganda

Since I made no change to the wording "toothbrush moustache-wearing ", and there is no mention of a prop, that made no sense, so I reverted with an edit summary to that effect..

I have now been reverted a second time, with the edit summary:

huh? the word 'wearing' isn't the topic of concern at all. it appears to be WP:OR that you assert this person wore the moustache while alive, which is unverified. also please see WP:BRD & use talk page

Firstly BRD is not mandatory and UpdateNerd is presumably as capable of starting a talk page discussion as I am. BRD says "BRD is not a valid excuse for reverting good-faith efforts to improve a page simply because you don't like the changes."; "BRD is not an excuse to revert any change more than once." and (emboldening in original) "If you revert twice, then you are no longer following the BRD cycle:".

More significantly, I made no assertion - much less one with OR - about what Weler did while alive. It is the reference "a prop if this was made (apparently) as propaganda" which seems to be OR.

The suboptimal "a toothbrush moustache-wearing body identified as Gustav Weler" still needs to be rewritten. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:29, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

This is a rather long beginning to what seems to be a simple discussion for someone familiar with sources. I don't assert that a prop was usef, but the film was definitely used as propaganda. We can copyedit for a better sentence wording or whatever, but please don't make it sound like Gustav Weler was an actual person walking around with a toothbrush moustache. There is no evidence at all supporting that notion. Weler is a name that was thrown onto a can of film by the Soviets, who are specifically anf incredibly unreliable on these matters surrounding Hitler's death. Thank you. UpdateNerd (talk) 01:25, 14 July 2023 (UTC)