Talk:Basel-Landschaft

Country or County?

Country? Not county? RickK 03:16, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Country. As in countryside. --Wik 03:21, Feb 1, 2004 (UTC)

Should the 1973 below be 1793, maybe? (wechsler@phase.org)

Regions

The nine municipalities of the Arlesheim district used to belong to the diocese of Base. In 1792 French troops occupied the district and in 1973 the lands were annexed by France. In 1815 at the Congress of Vienna the district joined Basel.

That's a rather confused account. The Diocese of Basel and the Baselbiet (the city of Basel's fiefdom) were not the same. The bishop of Basel had been expelled from the city in (IIRC) 1512 and in the 1790s his seat was at Porrentry/Pruntrut. The bishop's domain was still called the Diocese of Basel, but it had no jurisdiction over Basel or the Baselbiet, and Catholicism was not tolerated in Basel's jurisdiction. — ℜob C. alias ᴀʟᴀʀoʙ 00:16, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Why "Basel-Country"?

This has probably been decided a long time ago as part of a naming convention, but why have you chosen to translate Baselland as "Basel-Country"?

It is much more usually called "Baselland" or Basel-land" in English, both of which are perfectly good English. I have only ever seen "Basel-Country" in articles translated from the French (Bâle-Campagne), such as Michelin Guide books.

The article Cantons of Switzerland calls it Basel-Land.

The German-language article de:Kanton Basel-Landschaft says "Der Kanton Basel-Landschaft, auch Baselland oder Baselbiet .... Englisch: Basel-Land."

Since "Baselland" is German speaking, and the same name is also good English, why this non-English sounding form? TiffaF (talk) 15:23, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

The official German name of the canton is Basel-Landschaft, where Landschaft signifies "landscape" or "countryside." So the meaning is comparable to French Bâle-Campagne and Italian Basilea-Campagna. The German name is often shortened to Basel-Land or Baselland for convenience, and it's this shortened, informal version that translates effortlessly into English as "Basel-Land." The government of Kanton Basel-Landschaft refers to itself in English as "the Canton of Basel-Country"; see for example this page from the government website. -- ℜob C. alias ᴀʟᴀʀoʙ 13:44, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Other sites (e.g. Basel tourismus) use "Baselland". The Swiss Federal Statistical Office uses "Basel-Landschaft" in English. As a resident of Basel, I can say the common usage is Baselland, in both German and English. I have never heard anybody talk about "Basel Country", and I have only seen it written in documents which were translated from the French (e.g. Michelin Guides).

Is there any other source (google search?) about the usage of "Basel Country" as the correct exonym in English? It is not listed under English Exonyms.

I have also seen "Baselbiet" used in German, as in road signs "Willkommen in Baselbiet" TiffaF (talk) 07:05, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't think we have any grounds for disagreement. "Basel-Land" is certainly more common than "Basel-Country" in English, just as "Basel-Land" is more common than "Basel-Landschaft" in German. But "Basel-Landschaft" is the formal name, and it corresponds to "Basel-Country" in English — however awkward that may seem.

It reminds me of how Americans are in the habit of referring to the "states" of Massachusetts, Kentucky, and Virginia, although these three are officially called "commonwealths." There is nothing wrong with referring to the "state of Virginia," but when using the formal name of the state, it should be the "Commonwealth of Virginia." Evidently it's the same with "Basel-Land" and the more formal "Canton of Basel-Country."

The article's title should not be a problem for readers, as a search for Baselland, Basel-Land, or Basel-Landschaft automatically finds this page. -- ℜob C. alias ᴀʟᴀʀoʙ 18:47, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

P.S. Baselbiet (Basel beat, Basel district) is not really a comparable term; I think it may have been used to refer to Basel's feudal domain even before it joined the old Swiss Confederation in 1501. Certainly it was used before the partition of the Canton of Basel in 1833. — ℜob C. alias ᴀʟᴀʀoʙ 18:54, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, "Basel Country" just sounds ugly to me, and I have never heard it used.

P.S. Baselbiet (I assume from Gebiet) is still in common use in German see here and here, and it is on the road signs when you enter Baselland which say "Willkommen in Baselbiet", see page 2 of this document. Maybe I should photograph one of these signs and add it to the article :-) TiffaF (talk) 11:50, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

If Basel-Land is more common in English usage than Basel-Country, I don't see why the article shouldn't be moved to Basel-Land per WP:COMMONNAME. The intro can still mention the translation of the formal name, just as Massachusetts starts with the long name, while using the short (common) form for the title and rest of the text. An awkward translation need not be used for the title just because it is an English name. --skew-t (talk) 12:09, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I've lived in Switzerland for 18 years, and "Basel Country" just sounds weird to me. I've never heard or seen it used except on Wikipedia and the one Basel web page this article references. Everybody uses "Basel Land" in English (English is my mother language). The statement in this discussion that the government of Kanton Basel-Landschaft refers to itself in English as "the Canton of Basel-Country", supported by the URL of a government web page, has no merit because that web page is just an informal translation of an old version of a web page in German. It has no legal or official status, and certainly is not good English (for example it has a link called "Legal Informations", with an s). -- Barbacana (talk) 06:47, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

History: undue emphasis

The "History" section includes several unsupported statements of opinion, e.g. about the level of education that formerly existed in the country vs the city, and about reunification efforts. There is at least undue emphasis on some aspects of the canton's history at the expense of others. — ℜob C. alias ᴀʟᴀʀoʙ 22:57, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

Criticism

Since I have obsessive followers for now, please note I would like to add the following to the article: On 10 January 2017, the New York Times reported in the article titled "Muslim Girls in Switzerland Must Attend Swim Classes With Boys, Court Says" the canton being staunchly leftist and secular as it imposes its views upon Muslim residents through its courts without consideration for the citizens' social attitudes or religious beliefs. Or something to that effect. -Human like you (talk) 13:12, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Do you mean this article? I did a quick search on the article's text, and couldn't find 'staunchly leftist' (or even 'left') and the only result for 'impose' was in relation to a fine. So I'd suggest some discussion would be merited before using your suggested text, which doesn't come across as very neutral to me. 80.229.60.197 (talk) 14:33, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Moreover, please note that what is being reported in that NYT article is the European Court of Human Rights upholding the school officials' order. Located in Strasbourg, the ECtHR is not one of "its [the staunchly leftist canton's] courts". ---Sluzzelin talk 14:59, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

I also advice you re-read the article more thoroughly. Additionally, I don't get the point what the relation with "leftist" does really matter. First of all, Basel-Landschaft is throughly "bürgerlich", center and right wing parties have a very strong majority. In other words, left parties are a minority power (29:61). And secondly, traditionally such an approach would rather be expected by right party representatives. So your "staunchly leftist" claim is totally wrong, irrelevant and futile. -- ZH8000 (talk) 15:03, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Surely, you must understand that liberal means leftist in political terms. Would you have answered me the same way if I had said staunchly "liberal", as the article states or implies? I could bring a ton of evidence from the article to the contrary. Anyway, this distrcit has major issues to deal with no matter what Wikipedia says about it. Good luck Swtizerland. Human like you (talk) 09:54, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

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