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Wikipedia:Files for deletion/2008 April 1

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April 1

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Image:Armia Krajowa killings.jpg

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Image:Armia Krajowa killings.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs) - uploaded by M.K (notify | contribs).
  • This non-free low quality image is possibly unencyclopedic and in any case can be replaced by a higher quality Image:Armia Krajowa killings 2.jpg. It's hard to figure out what is shown on this image, and it is not used in any articles (unless in a slow edit war it the "2" image is replaced by this one). The fair use rationale is given for three articles; a discussion in Armia Krajowa has long ago determined that the image is of undue weight there, and as for two others articles, the "2" image is better - and two images would be on undue weight there. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 17:02, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per Piotrus. Tymek (talk) 03:55, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong keep. Image is historically valuable and is not reproducible in regards of PD, and there is no similar picture in PD. Compared images are not identical. Also there is very limited number of pictures which actually documents contemporary criminal actions of Armia Krajowa and crime scene. Therefore image is significant. Complain of low quality is baseless as image has "acceptable quality", plus we have quite number of pictures of similar quality and covering specific area like in article Holocaust, those are historically valuable as well . Image for a year was in the article Polish-Lithuanian relations during World War II, and only recently attempts are being made to remove from this article by the same user who filled deletion request [1], it was also introduced into Dubingiai massacre (image showing crime scene from this historical event), but due to revert wars lost its space there too. M.K. (talk) 15:03, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. Version 2 is a lot better. - Darwinek (talk) 17:55, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - it is not version 1 or 2, these are separate and very different images from different events. It does no harm to have both.--Lokyz (talk) 09:43, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete-unclear, better version exists.--Molobo (talk) 01:48, 12 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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Image:Akhand Bharat.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs) - uploaded by Ravichandar84 (notify | contribs).
  • A political bias presented through an image. No source to support the bias, no citation, no reference. There is absolutely no reason to keep this chauvinistic/imperialistic zealotry. Total trash. Aditya(talk • contribs) 16:00, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • What sort of bias??? The article Undivided India itself is about an ideology and I regard the image as a saffronist representation of Akhand Bharat. If the inclusion of an image is going to be regarded as "chauvinistic/imperialistic zealotry", then I guess images of the Nazi swastika or Ku Klux clan too should be removed from Wikipedia. You argument that an image represents an ideology does'nt seem credible at all. As for sources, I have already explained that it is a self-made image. Sources shall be added in the near future. -Ravichandar 17:22, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • I am not associating completely with the the current contents of the page, Undivided India which I had initiated as defined in certain legal enactments of India. However, as regards the image, the rationale for its deletion is not cogent enough as the image endevours to project the Undivided India based on the contents of the page in its current form. As such, if the image has to go, the page too has to go. --Bhadani (talk) 20:50, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
        • Images must not push ideologies, an for that matter Wikipedia must not push ideologies ("It is based on the popular conception of Akhand Bharat"... Saffronist indeed). The Nazi Swastika and Clan music do not represent the concept of Great Germany or Great Whitemen on the Wikipedia, they represent symbols used by Nazi's and KKK. Who uses this symbol of Akhand Bharat? Quote it as that, not an accepted fact. And, if the content of the current article is suspect, it needs to be discussed separately. Indosphere now represents the concept in linguistic studies that it actually is (after an AfD). If this article promises to become the legal concept that was intended after a serious thrust, there's nothing to complain about. I already have proposed to merge a large number of similar "India is great and greatly influential over it's neighbors" type articles. You may discuss it there. But this is for the image, and currently it represents nothing but a concept of Indian supremacy over its neighbors. Aditya(talk • contribs) 05:12, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
          • I see in the comments of Aditya the requirement to modify the contents of the page as it was intended - a legal concept in certain legal enactments of India governing citizenship and similar issues. However, over a period of time, the contents become very different from the initial flow and style of the contents. Still, the issue of the image and the issue of the contents, IMHO represent different dimensions. I would love to see some more comments from the editors interested in the subject as it is always better to settle sensitive and emotionally charged issue at the earliest so that energies of editors may flow to more creative direction. Thanks. --Bhadani (talk) 18:48, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
            • The map, if I am not mistaken, shows Pakistan, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Sri Lanka, Nepal and Bhutan as part of the fabulous Akhand Bharat. Unfortunately, this entity never existed in history. If is was a representation of the British Indian Empire, obviously Hyderabad, Kashmir, Tripura, Goa and a lot other places should not be a part of this map. If it was the maximum extent of Hindu majority area, then obviously Myanmar should go out, while Afghanistan should feature here. As far as I know, this fantastic proposition only exists in the propaganda of saffrons zealots. I don't find it coincidental that the map is drawn in that color.
              This propaganda piece may not mean anything to Americans and other Western people, who dominate the Wikipedia, but it means a lot in South Asia, where saffronists (i.e. Hindu supremacists) are a sad reality. Aditya(talk • contribs) 04:41, 3 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
              • I agree with most of the points raised in the latest comments of Aditya without aligning myself (for or against) with any particular political ideology, and (of course) without imputing any motive to anyone. I also invite other editors, if interested in the issue, to please comment to facilitate resolving the matter at the earliest. --Bhadani (talk) 19:12, 3 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
              • Well, you simply don't remove ideologies and propaganda completely from Wikipedia because you don't like them. Wikipedia is not censored! If you have any neutrality issues you should respond by modifying the contents of the article or the image. Besides, I have given you the example of a propaganda for Ku Klux Klan. If you have POV issues you should respond by balancing POV. The concept of Akhand Bharat is a significant ideology because it is subscibed to by a fair proportion of Indian populace. Hence, it does not fail notability. This being the case, only POV issues remain. And this should not be dealt with by removing articles or images. Well, if are of the opinion that any modifications should be made you may very well contact me. Thanks -Ravichandar 12:41, 8 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • (reduced indent) Sorry, dear. We do remove propaganda from the Wikipedia. Otherwise it would have been full of POVs you would probably hate more than you love this cute little piece of unsubstantiated and unreliable, pointless and groundless, non-neutral and partisan Saffronist propaganda. Aditya(talk • contribs) 18:04, 8 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Delete: Propaganda / ideology only has place in wikipedia to the extent it can be supported by verifiable fact. Imaginary maps created by editors without any reference cannot have a place in Wikipedia. Arman (Talk) 02:17, 9 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Probably the matter stands resolved with inputs by Armanaziz and Ragib, and a consensus appears to have emerged. --Bhadani (talk) 18:26, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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