Talk:Regions and municipalities of Trinidad and Tobago

Counties?

I keep on seeing references to TT's counties in the articles I've been re-stubbing. How do these relate to the regional corporations? Grutness...wha? 08:35, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

The corporations replaced the counties in 1991. People however still use the Counties as geographical descriptions.Xerex 15:19, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Untitled

can someone list the regional colours eg. siparia is red and yellow (same as st.patrick 1991) penal/debe is green and yellow mayaro/rio claro is white and green (same as mayaro 1991) — Preceding unsigned comment added by ====190.58.189.181 (talk) 12:08, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

ndash vs hyphen in article titles

As far as I can see from MOS:DASH, article titles of regional corporations whose names are formed by joining two entities, e.g. Tunapuna-Piarco Regional Corporation, should really use an endash in the title rather than a hyphen. (I've noticed, however, that the graphic at Couva-Tabaquite-Talparo Regional Corporation shows slashes). Before I go changing anything: any comments? Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 13:17, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Do any reliable sources on T&T local government bodies use en dashes? While I think consistency with the MoS is a reasonable way of resolving inconsistencies in punctuation between different sources, we should avoid inventing a way of punctuating things that literally isn't used by any other source. Cobblet (talk) 15:17, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Different topic: All lemma names are wrong. The articles are about regions, while the lemmas stand for governing bodies. Kind regards, Grueslayer 14:43, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

There's no difference between the two: it's just that the article titles follow WP:COMMONNAME in some instances. Cobblet (talk) 15:17, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Like, Arkansas is the same as Arkansas's state government? No. Kind regards, Grueslayer 03:13, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Yes, I agree with user:Grueslayer. May I first attract a few more comments about punctuation, then I'll submit a multiple RM request. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 07:37, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

I also agree, and apologize for misunderstanding Grueslayer's first comment – I thought he meant the names themselves were wrong when he meant to say that the usage of them was wrong. Cobblet (talk) 17:52, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Yes, and if you omit "Regional Corporation" you also remove the distraction of the what those "official" bodies use. The dash or hyphen is common in sources referring to the regions. Dicklyon (talk) 14:30, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

The government website uses a slash and in other places there's just a space, but ultimately these are issues of stylisation. MOS:ENDASH has guidance: "In article titles, do not use a hyphen (-) as a substitute for an en dash" and MOS:SLASH: "Generally, avoid joining two words with a slash...". Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 07:37, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

The Central Statistics Office uses slashes. I would not put stress on which chars are being used by "official" bodies; since an attunement between governing bodies does not exist in TT, each department uses its own diction. I would simply follow general WP rules here. Kind regards, Grueslayer 07:47, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

The Municipal Corporations Act consistently uses slashes for every corporation except Couva/Tabaquite/Talparo, for which it uses both hyphens and slashes. Given that the CSO and the government office are also consistent in using slashes, I think we should be going with that. WP:NPOV and WP:COMMONNAME trump WP:MOS. Cobblet (talk) 17:27, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

The official 2011 census report also uses slashes consistently. The Penal-Debe RC uses slashes, the Mayaro-Rio Claro RC uses spaces. Slashes are probably most common in usage, but alternative dictions exist. I vote for - oh, look, a picture of a kitty! Kind regards, Grueslayer 17:59, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

That official report has Mayaro/Rio Claro, Mayaro Rio Claro, Mayaro / Rio Claro, and Mayaro/ Rio Claro. The inconsistent use of punctuation and spacing there and in other docs suggests that they haven't really thought much about styling and don't have a style guide. Since we do, we might as well follow ours. There's nothing unneutral or uncommon about doing so. Dicklyon (talk) 14:37, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

@Cobblet: I think you might be overstating WP:NPOV here. The use of different punctuation styles in common use is evidently inconsistent and we should default to the reasonable Wikipedia style guide. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:25, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Guidelines don't trump policy. There's a clear preference for slashes in the controlling legislative document and in official usage; and no evidence that en dashes have ever been used. MOS:SLASH also says, "An unspaced slash may be used: [...] where a slash occurs in a phrase widely used outside Wikipedia, and a different construction would be inaccurate, unfamiliar, or ambiguous." Cobblet (talk) 11:46, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

But in this case the en dash would not make it inaccurate, unfamiliar, or ambiguous. Quite a few sources do use dashes already for these (usually rendered short like a hyphen). Dicklyon (talk) 14:28, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

I concur with Dicklyon. Furthermore, there is no policy to cite that would force a slash here. If you think WP:COMMONNAME does, you're wrong. It is not a style policy, and has nothing to do with which glyph to use (otherwise WP would use a hyphen in every single case that calls for a dash or a minus, because that's the most common stylistic presentation, because most other publishers are lazy and don't want to bother with the distinction).  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  23:54, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Using a glyph that has never been used in this context would not make it unfamiliar? (Not to mention unverifiable?) Trinidadian legislators are lazy? OK then. Cobblet (talk) 01:00, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

• Use an en dash, per MOS:DASH. We have these guidelines for a reason. For any given construction there are half a dozen ways someone somewhere might want to write it, and the purpose of having a style guide is to do something consistent, a) for our readers' understanding and b) to prevent re-re-re-hashed lame arguments about style trivia recurring over and over again. This is the purpose of all style guides, not just ours. We have one, so we follow it.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  23:56, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

 Done. A number of moves/edits are now complete. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 06:12, 31 May 2018 (UTC)